Nephew back from Iraq - and comatose

[mtnester]

My nephew, who is in "special forces" in the Army, just came back for a leave from Iraq after being there for 18 months, but will be shipping BACK to Iraq again for a second tour in about 2 weeks.

Christmas Eve, we watched him sit in a chair, and drink an entire fifth of Jack Daniels. He would not talk, he would not answer questions, he would not do anything except sit in the chair and drink steadily. His parents do not know what he does in Iraq, because he cannot tell them, they never know exactly where he is in Iraq (or wherever he is sent) because he is not allowed to communicate with them during his tour.

None of his cousins, who are his age and who he grew up with, could communicate with him at all, and it frightened them completely. This young man is 24 years old. My 26 year old son told me "Mom, he is walking dead."

I do not expect this young man to make it back alive, I really don't.

Pray for him and all the other young men and women who have been mentally and physically brutalized by the lies of their commander in chief. They will need all our help and love and support for a LONG time.

Shame, Shame, Shame on the President.

[roody]

1. He must not go back!

[mtnester]

3. I hear you on that, but I don't think the Army will take my word on that

His parents said they will try to communicate their concerns this week with his unit, but I do not think that will help.

[roody]

15. Fuck the Army.

[mtnester]

16. We all even tried THAT route too

it was like speaking to a rock.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

68. Write to your U.S.Senator and Representative

Write a real paper snail-mail letter, follow up with a phone call.

Army brass tends to react when hit by a congressional 2x4. Things sometimes get done.

[caligirl]

54. Please see my post below stat. His unit will want to send him back to Iraq and send him to

see his units doctor there. You don't know how responsive his unit will be. although special forces may be a different scenario. Personality and ego of his Commanding officer play a big role in this decision as to what will happen with him once he is back there. If what you have heard about this CO is not good, you should just know that a decision by his CO in this matter will be based on his own personality and concerns. It could go well or bad.

[jwirr]

87. If you can get him to a civilian doctor and get their opinion. Then

when you start the fight to keep him home you will have backup from a medical source. We did that for my son-in-law some years ago and it worked.

[blm]

113. There is a REQUIRED MENTAL TEST that ALL military personnel are supposed to take

before they are allowed overseas for any military purpose.

It is REQUIRED by law, but it turns out Bush's Defense Dept. hasn't been carrying thru with this requirement.

Kerry made note of it BEFORE the invasion, but it seems another issue that press refused to cover.

Use this information and his awareness of the issue, and call his office - they are used to questions like this, and would give you the right advice you need.

From the Office of Senator Kerry


Kerry Calls for Investigation into Department of Defense's Treatment of U.S. Troops

"What's the message we're sending to our troops around the world today and those prepared to fight in Iraq? . I intend to keep the pressure on until we have answers and the certainty that we're keeping faith with our troops," says Kerry

Thursday, March 6, 2003


WASHINGTON, DC – In response to reports that the Department of Defense (DOD) has failed to uphold a post-Gulf War law requiring it to develop and implement a medical tracking system for service members deployed overseas, Senator John Kerry today called for an investigation of the DOD by the General Accounting Office (GAO).

“To ensure that the Department of Defense is upholding its obligations to our troops, I am calling on the General Accounting Office to investigate,” said Kerry. “And I intend to keep the pressure on until we have answers and the certainty that we’re keeping faith with our troops.”

On November 18, 1997, President Clinton signed into law Public Law 105-85, which required the DOD to develop and implement a medical tracking system for service members deployed overseas. The law required the DOD to perform medical examinations, before and after operational deployments, including “an assessment of mental health and the drawing of blood samples,” to, as the law puts it, “accurately record the medical condition of members before their deployment and any changes in their medical condition during the course of their deployment.”

According to recent reports, however, troops heading for the Iraqi theater are not getting health screenings, especially blood sampling, as mandated by law. According to the Kansas City Star: “The law, which grew out of concern about unexplained illnesses that followed the 1991 gulf war, required that troops receive mental and medical examinations before and after deployment overseas. The tests are intended to provide clues in case the phenomenon known as gulf war syndrome should recur. Instead, the Pentagon requires only a brief, one-page questionnaire asking for general health-related information.” (Kansas City Star, March 5, 2003, page A-1)

“These reports are extremely troubling. What’s the message we’re sending to our troops around the world today and those prepared to fight in Iraq? The message seems to be, ‘do your duty to country but your country won’t fulfill its duty to you if you’re lucky enough to return home.’ That’s not the America I know, and it’s not the America I want us to become. Those of us who’ve served in combat have a special understanding of the values at stake here and the importance of never breaking promises to those who may become our brothers in arms.

“Vets fighting for vets is how we’ve made most gains for veterans from recognition of Agent Orange to treatment of Post Vietnam Stress Disorder. I am very mindful that this law was inspired by the efforts of a previous generation of Gulf War veterans whose illnesses came to be known collectively as Gulf War Illness and drafted in the best interest of our men and women in uniform. We must insist it is carried out for those veterans who may follow.”

Kerry requested the investigation of DOD in a letter sent today to GAO. The text of the letter follows.

-- 30 --

March 6, 2003

Mr. David Walker Comptroller General The United States General Accounting Office 441 G Street, NW Washington, DC 20548

Dear Mr. Walker:

I write to request that the General Accounting Office examine Department of Defense (DOD) compliance with Public Law 105-85, Subtitle F, Sections 765 through 767.

On November 18, 1997, Public Law 105-85 was signed into law by President Clinton. Among its provisions are requirements that DOD develop and implement a medical tracking system for service members deployed overseas. The law requires DOD to perform medical examinations before and after operational deployments, including “an assessment of mental health and the drawing of blood samples,” to, as the law puts it, “accurately record the medical condition of members before their deployment and any changes in their medical condition during the course of their deployment.”

Unfortunately, reports in recent weeks indicate that DOD may not be performing this responsibility to the letter of the law. These reports are troubling. The requirements to develop and implement a medical tracking system were based on lessons learned from the 1991 Persian Gulf War when lack of medical surveillance, incomplete medical records, and information on the location of specific units during particular events led to uncertainty about whether or not the illnesses of many veterans were service related. Any deficiencies in DOD’s execution of the law are particularly worrisome as we face the prospect of war in Iraq again.

Given these concerns, I request that the General Accounting Office examine DOD compliance with the relevant provisions of Public Law 105-85, including the following specific issues:

1. Public Law 105-85, Subtitle F, Section 765 called for improved medical tracking for members of the armed forces deployed overseas in contingency or combat operations, and along with section 766, called for improved medical record-keeping, including documentation of immunizations and receipt of investigational drugs. What is DOD doing to fulfill these legal obligations? Are current measures adequate to meet the requirement for medical surveillance and documentation established in the law?

2. Section 767 required the Secretary of Defense to report to Congress by March 1, 1998 on plans “for collecting and maintaining information regarding the daily location of units of the Armed Forces, and to the extent practicable, individual members of such units, serving in a theater of operations during a contingency operation or combat operation.” Has DOD adopted such a plan? If so, has it been implemented at the unit level?

I would welcome discussion with the appropriate members of your staff regarding other areas of this or other laws that may be germane to this issue. Please contact Jim Ludes of my staff (224-7024) to discuss this request.

Sincerely,


John Kerry

[caligirl]

117. Nice work! having the specific law in hand is helpful. n/t

[blm]

122. If the corporate media was talking about this, this man's family wouldn't be in

the dark. But, yet again, the media protects Bush by ignoring those critics calling attention to his wrongs against the troops - especially critics named John Kerry.

[Joanne98]

2. He didn't even talk when he opened his presents?

[mtnester]

5. He didn't

We left eventually for another gathering on the other side of the family...last we saw when we left was everyone else playing poker or some other games, him sitting in the chair, glazed.

[Joanne98]

13. That's terrible.

[Eurobabe]

4. This is extremely heartbreaking

another generation coming back from an ill-gotten war, and they will be messed up for life. You are right, shame on Bush, and Blair and Eritrea for this one. I hope Bush and Blair share a tiny cell in the Hague after they are indicted for war crimes!!!

[mtnester]

7. Everyone has an accounting at the gates

Oh yes they do.

[jgraz]

23. Nice fantasy, but ultimately unhelpful

Believing that BushCo will be held to account by some mythical higher power only makes it less likely that justice will ever be served. The only way that the BFEE will EVER pay for what they have done is if we citizens rise up and stop them.

[TwentyFive]

101. You have proof of this accounting?

What was Hitler's punishment at the gates?

[mtnester]

107. That was unhelpful

[alfredo]

62. Why Eritrea?

Kagnew Veteran, Asmara Eritrea

[Junkdrawer]

6. Iraq must be THE darkest hell-hole we have created as a nation...

and that's saying something.

[Skidmore]

8. There has to be a way to prevent him from being sent over there

again. He sounds like he needs some help and quickly.

[mtnester]

10. Of course his unit commander will know what is best for him

But I do not think he is the only child like this.

His parents will do their best to try to get him some counseling...I hope they succeed.

He used to be a bright, talkative young man.

Sigh.

[Waya]

9. Reminds me of my Brother in Law.........

...when he came back from Gulf War I. All he would do for the first 3 months is sit and drink himself into a stupor on a daily basis. Horrible to watch. To this day he doesn't speak about it and he has never been the same.

Best wishes and good thoughts for your nephew and hopefully a speedy end to this nightmare of a war.

[mtnester]

11. Thanks

speedy end...then we have to get busy fixing those that come back.

[stillcool]

12. I am so sorry...for you...for him...

for every life he has touched and will continue to touch. It is the ultimate mind-fuck for all involved.

[mtnester]

14. I understand though...we will have to have resources and patience

and help for these young men and women. My Grandpa, who was a sniper with the Sea Bees in the Pacific Theater STILL cannot talk about the Japanese to this day...PTSD and he is 85 years old!

[hlthe2b]

46. My father (WWII) vet went NEVER talked about it...

To this day, I have NO idea where he was stationed, where he served--anything. It was absolutely verboten to discuss. He died years ago and his brothers have also died, so there is no one left to ask. War is the devastation that never ends...


I am so sorry for this young man and all the other lives in crisis.

[benddem]

50. check with army records

you should be able to google it...and see if you can't get his records. Also although many people don't do it, military personnel are supposed to file their dd214 (discharge record) with the county they live in when they are discharged. If you know where he lived then you might be able to find it. There might be some neat things you never knew about him.

[hlthe2b]

58. Interesting thought..

I thought this many years out it would be a lost cause, but I will look into it... Thanks

[durtee librul]

63. Same with my dad

the only thing I know about his war experience is that he was a gunner on a ship that was sunk in Pearl Harbor and that he was a POW for many months on a Japanese held island. That's it. He is 86 and says I don't need to know.

AND, he refuses to go to Walter Reed anymore and see boys in the halls (no beds) as he says it brings back too many war memories that he would rather try and forget.

So whatever he went thru, it had to have been hell.

I have friends who served in 'Nam and they will not speak of anything either.

And just think, the Bush twins are probably drunk as I write this (and you read it) and could care less just like Daddy taught them.

[Joe for Clark]

66. You can find out - if you want to.

I strongly encourage everyone to do this.

Find out what they did.

If he was in the army his records will be in St Louis Missouri - contact them - they can give you his records. Some last names were destroyed in a fire in the 60's, they can tell you the deal and send you what they have. Find out.

Joe

Good luck to you!!

[hlthe2b]

69. thank you

Part of me now is a bit afraid to find out, but frankly I never thought I could. This gives me much to consider...

[Joe for Clark]

71. You can find out a lot.

If you don't know where to start- call the Red Cross - they are great at helping. If you know your relative was in the army - you will end up calling the records center in St Louis. They are very nice and helpful.

You have nothing to be afraid of - and you can find out.

Joe

[Donnachaidh]

97. FWIW, if he has passed on you can access his military records

Contact the branch of the service he was in and ask them for the forms to request them. That is, if you want to get the papers.

[merh]

103. My father was the same way.

We knew he served, he never really spoke of what he did, any of his missions.

[ribrepin]

17. Hugs to you and your family

My nephew who used to be a really mellow kid came back from afghanistan drinking hard and not talking much. He's scheduled for deployment to Iraq now.

His grandmother is beside herself about the changes in him. It's so sad for the families.

This boy was a big teddy bear of a kid who wears a size 15 shoe.

[TomInTib]

18. Give him some room.

And time.

I have been in that place, almost 40 years ago.
After coming home for a bit and knowing that I was going right back (they do that to SF troops), I could not allow myself to relax out of fear of meltdown.

One advantage of Special Forces training is that you are more mentally conditioned and able to compartmentalize stuff that most folks just cannot deal with.

Alcohol helps to keep those doors shut. In my case, heroin was just as much a threat to my well-being as were the Bad Guys.

I sure hope your nephew makes it, mtnester.

Please do not continue to think negatively. That shit won't help either of you.

If I were prone to prayer, your nephew (along with a whole slew of others) would be in them.


Tom

[Joe for Clark]

79. Hi Tom,

You know, if you pray and you are wrong about a god, no harm done.

I just point that out - and you can pick your god.

Your point is right on Tom - but if a kid is in trouble, do not give him time - that will just make for more suicides - been to some of those funerals.

If the kid is in trouble - intercede. Quicker the better. Smarter the more successful.

Hope all is well with you Tom.

Joe

[mtnester]

108. We did not pressure him

We also understand that lots of times they come back, knowing their buddies are still there, and there are some serious issues in that respect as well.

It is up to the decisions he and his parents make at this point.

I don't know how to take how badly this scared all the cousins...they are all like a big pack of puppies that grew up together. This frightened them and saddened them.....maybe it was also a good lesson for them..I don't know.

[lvasconcellos]

19. Very sad indeed

If he ever speaks against the war perhaps he could hook up with Iraq Veterans Agaist the War. They are wonderful...He has to come to that on his own, though. The private h*ll he lives in is unimaginable for us. So tragic for so many...

[roody]

20. Maybe he would like to call

GI rights hotline. http://girights.objector.org/ Another good resource: http://www.citizen-soldier.org/

[Gregorian]

26. Yes!

I really like how you are thinking here.

I would go to jail before getting back in front of the bullets and flying metal in that illegal invasion.

Don't go back!




PS- I used to live in Ukiah. Way out on Orr Springs road! Hello! :)

[Double T]

21. Sad story that I'm sure is replicated thousands of times.............

the physical and mental destruction bushco has single handedly created for our troops and the innocent Iraqi people was completely unnecessary and unwarranted. bush is no better than saddam, yet will continue his heinous acts of personal destruction.

[Cleita]

22. My heart goes out to this young man and you and your family.

What horrors has this administration done? I believe everyone should write to their Congressional Representatives and Senators with this story and any other out there. We need to beg this Congress to put ending the war first on their calendar.

[mnhtnbb]

24. My heart goes out to you. My husband has a great-nephew--age 20-- in Iraq.

We fear for him. He went willingly, expecting a great adventure.

It is so sad how these young kids have been brainwashed into giving up their lives for nothing. It's criminal.

[Disturbed]

35. "expecting a great adventure"

That makes me wonder what great adventure he could have been dreaming about before he joined up.

[mnhtnbb]

86. His father was a Civil War re-enactor. Now heads a group devoted to

Revolutionary War re-enactment at King's Mountain. War has been glorified in this young man's house from the time he was a kid. His parents are life-long Republicans and big Bush supporters.

[catmandu57]

25. All I can say is goddamn bush to hell

this idiot has caused so much pain, death, destruction and goes happily oblivious to all of it, goddamn you bush goddamn you to hell.

[Jack Rabbit]

27. Can he be hospitialized?

He sounds terribly depressed. It might be a medical condition.

Consult a doctor.

[mediaman007]

28. One of the benefits of an "all volunteer military." Young people join and

are willing participants in brain-washing. They more than likely are more loyal and faithful to their military peers than to their families.

I am not a supporter of the "all volunteer" concept. Everyone should at least be doing something for their country, when they are young. Volunteers allow the zealots in the military to overwhelm young recruits. It shouldn't be that easy. Military leaders should be questioned. If our military were more vulnerable, we wouldn't be heading into these foreign adventures so casually. Perhaps our foreign policy would be more responsible.

I'm sorry for your nephew. I wish that his situation were different. As a country, we are reaping what we have sowed.

[TheCowsCameHome]

29. Bush has already killed this young man, in a different kind of way

So very sad.

[Morgana LaFey]

78. That MAY NOT be the case

but it's terribly discouraging to post, ya know? We're trying to be optimistic and HELPFUL here.

[TheCowsCameHome]

102. And this isn't because of what *W* has done?

Bush has ruined this young man, as sad as it is.

[democrank]

30. Heartbreaking.

Perhaps you could find some help for your nephew by contacting Paul Rieckhoff (IAVA) here


http://www.iava.org/index.php

[RedEarth]

31. That's so tragic............

[Joe for Clark]

32. I will pray always for every kid that has to go out and do

the "war".

There is nothing wrong at all with going CO - really, not at all.

I have looked at this pretty carefully. You need a friendly minister - assuming he is christian at all - doesn't need to be the same denomination, either. All you have to do is tie the army up in knots for a while - they will reassign him to avoid the problem. I believe any faith will work, but I have some knowledge about christian denominations. How to tie them up - didn't work for me, not with my kid - might for your family - and I am happy to share what I know.

Joe

[Hekate]

33. KnR. Merciful gods, I have no words. Only tears.

I include soldiers like him in the prayer I say.

May all beings be peaceful
May all beings be happy
May all beings be safe
May all beings awaken to the light of their true nature
May all beings be free

Bring them home. Now.

Hekate

[Monkeyman]

34. Now Take it from me

He has the thousand yard stare PTSD or Worse get him to the VA NOW Please drag him if you have to. I know that look I had it. His life hangs on what you do.

[Monkeyman]

38. Get in Touch with Senator Dodd office he is fighting to keep

These soldiers out of Iraq they have seen to much way to much. Number 202-224-3121

[TahitiNut]

57. Yep. Not much question about it. Intervention is called for.

What's particularly appalling is that CO's and senior NCO's often don't pay attention and monitor the warning signs. Once upon a time, some veterans' organizations (e.g. VVA) set up intervention personnel who'd assist getting these people the kind of professional help needed.

He almost certainly won't do it on his own - it's contrary to the 'training' and macho mythos.

[bobbolink]

64. Thank you, Monkeyman. It's imperative!

This is so sad, and I hope this one life can be saved.

:cry:

As we keep saying, it's Vietnam all over again.

[LWolf]

36. I've seen that.

My son's best friend, who did his leaves at my house. He got out a year ago and settled in another state. So far, I hear that he is divorcing his wife, has a drinking problem, and can't seem to settle on what to do with himself.

He has not been the open, humorous, likable young man that we knew since he headed to Mosul.

[leftchick]

37. I am wondering why my bush loving jackass of a nephew has not been sent

3 years ago after marine boot camp he was bragging about wanting to go to Iraq and "kill ragheads". For the sake of the Iraqis I am glad he has not gone yet but I wonder why he has not deployed.

At any rate my prayers are with your nephew. He should not be going back, he should be treated at a local VA for PTSD.

:(

[Joe for Clark]

44. I have some family that were like that - "gung ho" -

I give some credit for going there - but that won't last too long, in my experience.

It is my opinion that patriotisim lasts just up to the time the first bullet wizzes past your head - then you are on you own.

I will say this - cause I know it is true - you put any kids in a situation where morals become a liabilty - and you will find things you don't want to see - blood baths, worse. Certainly not new to this war - true for all wars, at all times.

Personaly, I think it is a small miracle that these kids have managed to avoid this in such a large measure.

A good post leftchick.

Joe

[SeattleGirl]

39. That is sad beyond words, mtnester

The damage done to you nephew and the others who have been to Iraq is shameful.

[wryter2000]

40. I'm so sorry

I can't imagine anything else to say. I'm just so sorry for you and your family and this young man. I hope the universe can find one miracle for you.

[H2O Man]

41. Sorry to hear that.

It must be very difficult for your extended family. The callous disregard shown by Bush/Cheney and their ilk is stunning, even from this distance. I will pray that your nephew makes it back, and that he recovers.

[caligirl]

42. My husband(LtCol retired USMC, USNA) says to do this: He needs

to declare he has a substance abuse problem and is thereby unfit for combat.They send him to rehab, 4-8 weeks inpatient rehab. By claiming he has an substance abuse problem probably disqualifies him for combat in the minds of any rational commanding officer. Go see the substance abuse NCO or officer in the substance office at a nearby base of his service branch. EVery unit has a substance abuse unit or officer, every battalion sized unit and beyond has one.
This is one way and there is a second that I will speak of. Typically if you have an alcohol or substance abuse problem, you won't be prosecuted for the admission of this and they cannot mention this on his evaluations.He needs to be the one to make this claim. Normally if you have a substance abuse problem, and anybody who drinks a whole bottle of whiskey in a single sitting

does have a problem- call any AA group and ask, they have to evaluate you.

Here is way number two and it may be more effective:

But if you think this is an emergency such as a threat to himself or others or that you believe this cannot wait,ie, he is drinking to solve problems and is drinking life threatening quantities in a single sitting, and is uncommunicative, you can take him to an emergency room for emergency treatment, high likely hood of alcohol poisoning that can kill him. This creates or starts a paper trail that is harder to sweep under the rug. I asked hubby about civilian medical treatment, in an emergency this is okay. This also makes it harder for the military to get a hold of him since anytime they want to get him a doctor has to release him, a civilian doctor operating under medical rules not military rules. They may transfer him to a military rehab facility but it makes this more public in the eyes of the military and harder for them to ignore or sweep away.
There may be consequences to his career, but he would be a living vet rather than a dead one.
From my and my husbands point of view drinking like this is a problem for him and his unit. Husband is a retired field grade officer who knows something about this stuff. Adverse consequences should not occur if the CO is a fair person.
recognizing alcohol poisoning to save a life
http://www.brad21.org/alcohol_poisoning.html


onb edit, I re read the OP and see that he is special forces, he would have a security clearance as well for this.
two points are that he would likely suffer some career consequence for substance abuse, but he would be alive rather than dead. clearly there is a serious and life threatening problem here that would impact his ability in combat.

and last: Emergency room treatment also generates a bill the military would get. It further entangles the military to recognize a proble exists for this man.

[H2O Man]

43. Good thinking.

Great suggestions.

[caligirl]

45. Just wanting to keep this guy from killing himself.

He obviously is in a great deal of pain and wants help, ie a bottle of whiskey in a single sitting that could kill him.

[Monkeyman]

47. Good Call

458 Of these kids have taken their own life's.

[caligirl]

49. more than two decades in the military. Alcoholism is a serious issue and problem

in peacetime and worse by orders of magnitude in war time.

[Monkeyman]

55. Yep been there done that

Only way I stopped was finding out I was not alone. Got treatment for the drinking and the PTSD

[caligirl]

56. He didn't do war time, and still had a serious problem but finally got help.

My worry here is that he may be like many and not ask for the help. In combination with that amount of drinking his life is clearly threatened. A willingness to see the danger is needed now. A family member needs to get him into treatment asap.

[cadmium]

48. I am very sorry to hear about your nephew. Caligirl has

some good points. I don't know the laws in Connecticut. As a last resort, when a person is unwilling to enter treatment In Massachusetts, a close family member (parent, sibling, spouse) could file a section 35 with the Clerk Magistrate to mandatory inpt care if he is deemed to be in danger. It is harsh but the courts are usually willing to forgoe forced treatment if the person enters rehab voluntarily. In any case I just hope things work out for your nephew and your family. You are doing something valuable for all Americans by bearing witness.

[roamer65]

83. It is absolutely stunning to me that we are making the Vietnam mistake...

...again. :(

I never in my wildest dreams thought it would be this bad after November, 2000.

This kid needs an intervention very badly.

[mtnester]

109. His parents have been on this board reading all your

good suggestions. They will do whetever they can for him now.

I thank you very much for your help!

[caligirl]

119. Keep us posted, we worry about parents and kids in this situation.

I added a comment somewhere here about obtaining a civilian evaluation before the military can do anything to him. They are sending some soldiers back with diagnosis of personality disorders which we all know is a punitive non treatment of real mental health issues. A civilian evaluation would make that harder to get away with.

[mtnester]

120. I hear you...and if I have anything new to post, I will let everyone know

Unfortunately, they have about 2 weeks to try...again, they are using this post as a reference, so every suggestion helps!

Thanks so much for your concern...really.

[Why Syzygy]

126. Flag to OP . PLEASE DO THIS

In our area we have police units trained to assess and recommend. Get him to a help station here on state side. DO NOT allow him to return to the field. It won't be good for him or our 'allies'.. as if we had any.

Please urge your brother/sister to get this done for their CHILD. And for the sake of all children.

I would not hesitate. The gates of Hell could not stop me if I had a chance to save my son.

There is no Protocol. Just go for it. Please. :cry:

[leftyladyfrommo]

51. Oh Lord!

I have a friend whose son came back and then just disappeared off the face of the earth. They don't know if he is dead or alive.

How many of these young people have been killed over there - dead souls count. They are in a lot more pain than the really dead.

[Joe for Clark]

52. You can only do what you can do,

it is true. I don't know what state you live in. I don't know what the young man says. I don't know a lot of things from your post.

Remember, you don't have to win, exactly - it is relative.

You can tie it up for a long, long time. That is usually enough to do the job.

That is winning, in this case.

God bless every kid there.

Joe

[benddem]

53. take monkeyman's advice

your nephew is self medicating. He needs help!!!!

[nadinbrzezinski]

59. Ok some observations

what you are describing is a classic for self medication for deep depresion (and yes he has seen some serious shit over there)

Do as you wre told above, contact the substance abuse officer, and ALSO contact the Chaplain. He may even fight you on this since he "needs" to go back becausse he feels that he will be shirking his duties.

Now also try to contact the shrink and have him evaluated for PTSD and depresion

Now to talking... he will not open up to you... you have no clue (nothing personal) of what he has seen or what he has done... but his Sergeant or Lt should be able to intervene

Problem is you need to intervene ASAP and he will hate your guts for it...

[caligirl]

61. Informed advice as well. Just hope it is headed. good point about

his likely not wanting to get help or face loosing a security clearance.

Intervention ASAP is needed .

[madmusic]

65. So often we read posts of tragedies we can do nothing about...

They are already a done deal and the helplessness is often frustrating as hell. So, for what it's worth, I just want to say thanks to all those who posted potential solutions that may actually prevent a tragedy in the making. Some good news may come of this.

Good luck, mtnester, and good luck to your nephew.

[Joe for Clark]

82. We CAN do something about this!!

Many of us learned difficult lessons - with different learnings.

We put all our knowledge together and we have something really powerful.

Joe

[mtnester]

110. Passed on to his parents, they are reading all of these suggestions

They are doing what they can.

[6000eliot]

60. I'm so sorry.

My nephew is supposed to go back this spring. These bastard neocons and their fucking useless war!

[ninkasi]

67. I'm so sorry, mtnester

Your nephew needs immediate help. I've seen some good suggestions in this thread, and please, try to get him the help he needs. Although I have no loved ones serving in Iraq, or Afghanistan, I have no trouble imagining how desperate I would be, if one were going through what your nephew is. I don't need to have the young ones serving related to me by blood, to worry and agonize over them. After all, I'm one of the Americans that the tyrant Bush holds up as an example of why he's willing to sacrifice OUR loved ones. They are told they fight for me. They don't fight for you, or me, they fight for Bush's ego, and for Iraqi oil. I very much hope you and your family can get your nephew into treatment. Please keep us posted, and my heart goes out to you, and him.

[mtnester]

111. Done, his parents have this thread bookmarked and are referencing it

to see what they can do.

Thank you.

[Why Syzygy]

127. Honor, Right and The Life of their SOn

is on their side. Let us win this one.

Sometimes there is nothing wrong to do. Just something! Save him. Thank you.

[madisongrace]

70. Take him to the county emergency...

I don't know what state or county you are in, but if he is hospitalized, I would assume they (the army) wouldn't send him to Iraq. He would have to be seen by a psychiatrist. If he says he is thinking of committing suicide, they have to hospitalize him.

[bobbolink]

77. Welcome to DU, madisongrace!

:toast:

[Joanne98]

72. I have some advice before you call anyone about the drinking...

You better ask him. He could be furious and do something really desperate. Try to sober him up first. Can you get his mom to cook his favorite meal and just put it on the table so when he wakes up it will be right there.

[Joe for Clark]

74. It is the problem -

Whatever you think needs to happen, what he says is the voice that counts.

He has to want out first - then he can be helped. Some people don't want that help, for different reasons.

If he is non responsive it may be easier.

Good post Joannne98

Joe

[Joanne98]

76. Thanx.

[Miss Chybil]

73. He may be trying to keep his distance from everyone,

knowing he has to go back. It must be like a space/time warp to him to come home and see everyone happily opening presents after seeing - God knows what he's been seeing. We are not a nation at war. He and his buddies are at war. It must be a horrible, horrible shock to his system moving in between these two universes. It sounds like he needs help, quickly.

[rumpel]

75. I am so sorry...

my prayers to your nephew and all those who suffer in silence


caligirl's suggestion is very sound - I hope he heeds the advice

[hardtravelin]

80. 18 Months?

I don't think any unit deploys to Iraq for an excess of 12 Months. "SF" units deploy for either 3 or 6 months, but have a faster (6-9 month) turn-around time.

Perhaps he is adding up the time overall?

[Joe for Clark]

84. It is possible -

The Marine units go 6 months and out. Most army go 12 months and out. Sometimes the army units get held for aditional months - the 172nd got held for aditional months.

Generally it is 6 and 12 - and then it is how many tours you do.

Joe

[hardtravelin]

92. Believe me, I have empathy for his distress.

but I don't think the timeline works unless he's adding up total deployments, especially in "SF". I have served in a "Special Forces" unit, and they have, internally, much better physc and ptsd treatment than the regular army side of the house; their high op-tempo and intense missions require it.

It would help if we knew what part of "Special Forces" he belonged to.

First step should be the chaplain.

[Joe for Clark]

94. Oh, I understand your point.

Maybe your question is legitimate - could be.

Your observation is right on.

The question becomes, when has the army ever done the smart thing??

They did leave the 172 there whole - I thought they were more careful in SF. But I am just the parent of an engineering unit kid now. And I think those officers are awol at this point.

I never meant more than that.

Joe

[hardtravelin]

96. I've been in for 21 years...

under 4 president's, and the Army NEVER gets smarter. You just keep your head down and hope for smarter leadership.

I really enjoyed the 90's. I was proud to serve in Bosnia and Kosovo. I thought that we were applying our resources for a more humanitarian cause: protect the weak and serve in a just cause.

The 172nd has just been truly boned. I know guys in that unit...not happy. I cannot begin to tell you the grumbling and lowering of morale in the ranks...even among the Infantry and SOCOM units. They are ready for the war to be over!

You can only roll the dice so many times...

I hope the individual the poster referred to can get the help he needs.

[Joe for Clark]

129. That is just so well stated - I have to say so.

Nice post.

Joe

[mtnester]

112. Part of his time was, we know, in Afghanistan....then he had a short break (R&R) in Germany,

then back to Iraq, then another short break (R&R) in Germany, then back to Iraq, then he got to come home because this tour is over. He has been deployed since the summer of 2005. This long break here is his first time home, and he has a new set of orders...back to Iraq.

So perhaps he had multiple short sets of orders. I do not know much about special forces, or a damn thing about what he "does" for them. I can only guess. I know this is the first break he has been allowed to come home for 30 days...so I am assuming this is the end of his tour.

Hey, all kinds of things are weird...there are guys/gals going back for their THIRD tour...that is not supposed to happen either.

No smileys in me today..

[Why Syzygy]

128. smileys absolutely not needed

:hug: mtnester .. never let go. We need you. We need us and them and your nephew. We need us all. Together.

Here is your thought for the day, should you choose to accept it. Together.

[Jokinomx]

81. My thoughts and prayers are with him and your family.....

Thousands of our soldiers will have PTSD.... and after hearing a piece on NPR about this exact problem... His chances for getting help from any branch of the service is very low.

Not to lessen the impact this has had on your family... but can we all imagine the children living in Irag and how this will affect them for their entire lives.

Those that still support this occupation make me sick. Why couldn't more people see what was happening before the war. It was so obvious to me and I am a nobody. I screamed at my family for supporting this war.... I was called just about everything but a traitor.... now look where we are.... no end in sight and a "SURGE" of troops to quell the violence....

Three more US battleships heading to the gulf and sanctions against Iran AGAIN>.. and we all know how well that helps convince nations to change their ways....

Good luck....

Jokinomx

[uppityperson]

85. sounds like he is coping as best he can

going between the 2 places, 2 cultures must be incredibly disorienting and if he is to stay sane at all when he returns, he may need to keep his distance here now. It is not easy, but can be necessary and heartbreaking. I am deeply hoping he is able to get the help he needs when he returns home for good. The repercussions of this occupation will be with us for a long long time. My condolences and am hoping you can enjoy what time you have with him, even if he is not able to reciprocate.

[GenDem]

88. Look at what is happening to these brave kids.

It makes me sick that we are witnessing the maiming both physically and mentally of so many.

It is going to be up to your nephew if he is willing to accept help, but he definitely sounds like he is in dire straights and the last thing he needs is another deployment.

My husband was in the Marines post Viet Nam and he had a problem and we went to our congressman. It was resolved shortly there after. If your nephew is willing...I think a combination of psychological evaluation and a phone call, and letter campaign to your nephew's congress person and US senators is the way to go.

[Target_For_Exterm]

89. Sounds like early symptoms of PTSD. Numbing. Withdrawal.

He needs evaluation.

Even if he won't talk about what he's going through, it can be helpful if folks just sit with him. The companionship can be comforting, especially if he knows no one is going to force him to talk about something he can't talk about right now.

Emotional numbing and withdrawal are pretty serious warning signs for PTSD. You need to watch for other signs - like angry outbursts, flashbacks, memory lapses, depression, etc.

Here's a shortlist of symptoms to watch for:

"What are the symptoms of PTSD?
There are four main types of PTSD symptoms. A diagnosis of PTSD requires the presence of all categories of symptomatic responses:

re-experiencing the trauma: flashbacks, nightmares, intrusive memories and exaggerated emotional and physical reactions to triggers that remind the person of the trauma.

emotional numbing: feeling detached, lack of emotions (especially positive ones), loss of interest in activities

avoidance: avoiding activities, people, or places that remind the person of the trauma

increased arousal: difficulty sleeping and concentrating, irritability, hypervigilance (being on guard), and exaggerated startle response."

http://www.helpguide.org/mental/post_traumatic_stress_disorder_symptoms_treatment.htm

And just to complicate things, in addition to the military discouraging these guys from seeking treatment, the illness itself can prevent them from seeking treatment.

If you see a large number of these symptoms, you may have to intervene on his behalf because he might not be able to help himself.

[caligirl]

118. I am not as sure this is early PTSD, but possibly farther along due to

the drinking and in such life threatening amounts. Either way an evaluation by a doctor would get the ball rolling. Another thing I am concerned about here is the number of Iraq soldiers being sent home with pseudo personality disorders being diagnosed by military psychiatrists under pressure from military commands.
One way to avoid that is a civilian evaluation first.

[illinoisprogressive]

90. PTS

I bet it is. and the anxiety and depression are hitting him big time. How long is he home for. Please please watch over him. Take him to a doctor asap. He could hurt himself.
They are now sending those kids with this back. They give some pills and send them back and no conseling. He is in trouble.
Please tell his parents to keep a close eye on him and take him to a doctor.
I am hoping the best for you. My heart aches for those kids.
I hate Bush. I hate his cowardly self who wouldn't go to his war but, is callous enough to keep those kids fighting his stupid folly and if they don't die there they will carry scars inside here. Those kids deserve better.

[graywarrior]

91. Makes my blood boil.

Poor kid.

[wildbilln864]

93. God bless your nephew!

My nephew is due to go to Iraq in March. I'm so apprenhensive about it. He also is in special forces. I was hoping for a pullout by then but alas it's not to be.

[Divine Discontent]

95. FORCE HIM INTO TREATMENT IN CANADA or something!!

you make this condition sound grave... call anti-war organizations and ask them about options, this sounds like he's ready to just die. MY DEEPEST PRAYER FOR HIM, and the fam.... please keep my fam in a prayer for medical problems.

have a blessed new year

www.cafepress.com/warisprofitable

[Oldtimeralso]

98. Please get him help ASAP

My BIL came back from Iraq and took his own life, and it took a toll of all of us.

[lildreamer316]

124. ...........

:hug: :hug: :hug: :hug: :cry:

[Erika]

99. Maybe if the W twins were sent over it might sink in

W is rich, arrogant, and elitist. If it's not happening to him, he doesn't care.

[donheld]

100. This is one of the saddest things I've ever read on DU

:cry:

[merh]

104. Your nephew and all of you are in my prayers

as are all serving and their families. PTSD is so hard to manage for the sufferer and their loved ones. I cannot even imagine the horrors that most of our soldiers over there have seen or experienced. God love them all and God forgive us for this war, their hell and the hell inflicted on the Iraqis. :(

[Irishonly]

105. I am so sorry for your nephew and your family

I believe in prayers and they can't hurt, might help. You have received a lot of good advice and I hope you can use some of it to help your nephew. I thought we had learned our lesson from Nam. Unfortunately, we normal people did, the neocons didn't.

[mtnester]

106. I would like to thank everyone for their help, prayers and suggestions.

His parents (his father mostly) have been filled in on all they can do, and will keep me posted as to their efforts in this matter.

Bless you all for your help.

[BattyDem]

114. I am so sorry for your nephew and your entire family.

18 months in hell is long enough! He served his country; it's time his country served him. He obviously needs help. I can't believe that they are going to send him back in the condition he's in. :-(

I don't know how this works, so if my following suggestion is naive or pointless, please forgive me.

Would it be possible to have him committed to a (civilian) hospital? Could that buy some time until you can get help from your representatives in Congress or would the Army simply drag him out? :shrug: Perhaps you could contact a lawyer who specializes in military law and could advise your family on how to prevent your nephew's return to Iraq. (FindLaw.com has a search engine.) There's got to be a loophole somewhere.

Good luck. :hug:

[lies and propaganda]

115. weve ruined so many of our young people.

he may come back alive, but hes dead inside. They all are, Im sorry for being so frank.
Were just creating zombies and i tear up just thinking about him.

good luck to you and yours.

[dsc]

116. Is he doing any other drugs?

If so you can turn him in and maybe save his life. I do pray for you either way.

[mtnester]

123. Not that we know of

[Javaman]

121. Sadly,, the moron* has not shame and that is why it* needs to be impeached. nt

[Stardust]

125. Expect resistance from him. He's in the center of a perfect storm:

indoctrination + guilt + alcohol. And don't forget pride. I cannot imagine what's going through his mind right now. Be patient with him. Best of love to all your family.