Wingnuts: Kerry Supposedly "Bashes" Military In Speech In California

[ruggerson]

John Kerry was giving a speech at Pasadena City College yesterday in support of Angelides and said this, apparently:

"You know, education, if you make the most of it, if you study hard and do your homework, and you make an effort to be smart, uh, you can do well. If you don't, you get stuck in Iraq."

This won't affect the election one iota, and is not even newsworthy, but why give the rightwingers ANY ammunition at all? This gives them something to scream about for one news cycle.

Link: Sludge

[Mass]

1. They will jump on anything,so what would you suggest? That he and

others stay silent?

You are right, it is not even noteworthy, so why bring it here.

[ruggerson]

9. Because he said it

and they are reacting to it, and we should know about it.

[blm]

22. And left the sentence before and AFTER out - - typical RW tactic.

They've been doing it for decades in order to distort what is said.

They did it to his testimony in 1971, too, and that was the most clearly written statement a person could make - but when the rightwing operatives chopped it up they didtorted that, too.

So are Democrats supposed to walk around and not say ANYTHING in fear of being editted and didtorted or call the RW on their tactics?

[BOSSHOG]

2. Damn the Irony

- Kerry studied hard and made something of himself and ended up in Nam.

- rove got a military deferment to go to college, did not get a degree and never amounted to anything worthwhile.

[Touchdown]

3. Never apologize. Never explain. Always throw it back

Sludge never served anything but a rim job to the GOP. Everybody says things that can be taken out of context, and no matter how we try to say the right things, they will always try to use them for smears. It's time to just ignore what they say, and slap them back when they try. Enough of the wimpy Democrats who are skeered of what the Puggies are gonna say.

Kerry should say to Drudge..."Go Cheney Yourself!"

[Mass]

5. I doubt Kerry will apologize. But be sure a few wimpy Dems will

be bothered by what he said.

[wisteria]

16. And take advantage to boost themselves I suppose. n/t

[blm]

4. Reality - with today's education system and bad job market, young people ARE

making the tough choice to go into the military and are ending up in Iraq.

Kerry has a REAL lifetime record of respecting and supporting the military - don't let RW spin frighten you so easily. Just don't ACCEPT the bullshit - counter it.

No Faint hearts.

[cali]

7. It wasn't a very bright thing to say

but it won't make a speck of difference. We all slip up sometimes, and I think that's what happened here, but it's hardly a big deal, and the freepers can scream from the top of their lungs, but it still won't have any impact.

[Mass]

10. You're right. It will not have any impact. However, the coverage

of the rallye by the local media (from which this sentence is extracted) show that the rallye by itself and Kerry's intervention were very energizing.

http://www.sgvtribune.com/news/ci_4578136

But while the students showed proper enthusiasm for Angelides by waving his signs and wooing and booing at the right places, the energy in the room clearly belonged to Kerry. He took the stage to roaring applause and left it only to be mobbed by students and reporters.

Kerry charmed the crowd with tales of surfing at Mission Beach and got laughs for a series of one-liners, including telling the crowd he had just returned from Texas, "Where the president used to live - now he lives in a state of denial."

Kerry then told the students that if they were able to navigate the education system, they could get comfortable jobs - "If you don't, you get stuck in Iraq," he said to a mixture of laughter and gasps.

And, before people begin ranting about surfing, note where he was.

[blm]

11. Sometimes saying the truth doesn't SEEM bright - but it's still the truth.

This country has no time left for dancing around the truth.

[confludemocrat]

26. If you're gonna get in trouble w/media, then have it be from forceful talk,

not such a weak attempt to mutter under his breath figuratively. Shouldn't be that big a deal anywhere, but among us, something to consider as to how fit he now is for another run (has he upped his game?), but also an opportunity for him to speak forthrightly about this issue in defending himself and turn it around on them. Will he? No, he will fail to do so (he hasn't upped his game).

[confludemocrat]

6. Off the cuff or written out, dumb either way. What was his point?

it's noteworthy here at DU because breath is being wasted by one many here support on pointless inanities like this one

[karynnj]

15. Many people joined

in the voluteer army either to get educational benefits or because they can't get jobs. The economic disparity may be every bit as great now as in Vietnam or possibly greater. Middle class kids DID go to Vietnam. I knew kids from my middle class high school who went. You needed to be upper class (or at least upper middle class) to avoid it.

Congressman Rangel and others have made the point that the fact that most people do not have family members or people they know involved. The burden of this war has very unfairly fallen primarily on the lower class. (There are exceptions - like Tillman or the Brown alumni whose funeral Kerry went to; just as there were exceptions to the rich not going to VN- we know some names: Kerry, both Thorne brothers etc - but we also know a huge list of privildged people who avoided it.)

This sentence appears to be ripped out of context, and it does represent what is a reality for some. The point is that the economy is awful for those at the bottom and the military is offering huge enticements to people with few other prospects because they are having troubel recruiting.

I doubt this will get any real traction because the underlying unfairness is real and is the basis for what Kerry said. He also did NOT say that this is true of all who went into the millitary and there are many statements showing that he does not think that.

[confludemocrat]

23. Burden has fallen on the lower economic classes? Then say it goddamnit, JK

"in the voluteer army either to get educational benefits or because they can't get jobs" Then why didn't he address that issue other than in some typically oblique, pussy-footing Kerry way. His rhetoric is always, always cautious beyond milquetoast except when it's about him, and even then he has been known to fail to defend himself like a James Webb. He knows there are sound bites and ripping of portions of speeches to be used against him. He sound like he was out of energy, or didn't think through what he was going to say properly, but you Kerry operatives regard him as infallible.

[formernaderite]

28. unfortunately what he made is a bad pithy comment

that he will have to explain over and over again, instead of sticking to message...

[wisteria]

43. Naw, he can turn it back on them. They should be apologizing! n/t

[wisteria]

18. The job market is going overseas and if you don't have a formal

education, you career opportunities are limited.
Come on, didn't you ever consider that Bush and the NEOCONs like a depressed job market- it makes recruiting a lot easier for their war in Iraq and any others they decide to undertake.

[confludemocrat]

24. Please see above response to Karynetc n/t

[ThoughtCriminal]

8. Anything's Possible with Commander Cuckoo-Bananas

Homer Simpson (to Bart): "Next time you're expelled it'll be straight to the Army for you, where you will be sent immediately to America's newest quagmire. Where will it be? North Korea, Iran ... anything's possible with Commander Cuckoo Bananas in charge."

[wisteria]

12. Huh? What exactly is wrong with this statement?

It implies that you need a college education to get a head. With many of our jobs going overseas and no formal education what is left? And,with the awful mess in Iraq he doesn't want to see more lives taken for this mistake. Senator Kerry has the utmost respect for the military.

Drudge is aiding and abetting the Republicans. He specializes in lies.

[Mass]

13. Sludge is there to help the GOP. So, no surprise there.

For the rest, of course, you are right, but people will never be tired of parsing every word that Democrats say.

[TayTay]

14. Ripped out of context like that

it sounds like Kerry's referring to Bush.

[wicket]

17. Michelle Malkin is in hysterics:

http://michellemalkin.com/archives/006237.htm

But what else is new with her, she's always trying to gin up some latest "controversy" while overlooking terrible transgressions from her friends on the radical right.

[wisteria]

19. This is Right wing bullsh*t. This is about as honest an attempt to

discredit Kerry as the lynn Chaney remark about him not being a nice man was. They are making something out of nothing, pretending that they really support the troops, when in fact, this administration has not even given the soldiers the protection they need. They dishonor the soldiers by continuing to place them in harms way in a war without a plan to succeed.

[wicket]

29. I'm so sick of all of these chickenhawks!

:grr:

[Sensitivity]

21. GOOD SENATOR! Could someone explain the political upside from stumping in California

for a loosing cause -- Arnold is way ahead in the polls.

I am proud that Kerry is keeping his committment to Californial Dems
even though there is no High-Profile upside at this point. Kerry campaigning
will help all the congressional races and democratic state initiatives even
if it does not get Angeledies the Governorship.

[Sensitivity]

20. Kerry NOBLY VOLUNTEERED go serve. The current recruiting system IGNOBLY

tricks the uninformed into service with fantasies and bribes or compells team through proverty.

[spacemanspiff]

25. sounds like an insult to me

Kerry did choose to serve with people he said "didn't know how to make those phone calls" after he knew that the war was wrong.

But he's not stupid, he's served a few months and then got out because of his three purple hearts...and then has been using it politically ever since.

[blm]

27. Why are you using a RW lie? Kerry had already served a full tour then trained

on swiftboats after he signed up to serve ANOTHER tour where he went incountry commanding a swiftboat.

So, why are you pretending he only served a few months and got out, just like the RW operatives lied about on talk radio?

[Name removed]

46. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[blm]

48. That was his SECOND tour. His first was spent on a Naval ship.

He re-signed and requested swiftboat duty. He trained on swiftboats for some months (as it was one of the most hazardous assignments) and THEN went to Vietnam where he got got 3 Purples in 4 months.

[Name removed]

51. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

42. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Richard Steele]

44. Utter Bullshit.

Simply not even CLOSE to true.

[ProSense]

30. Wingnut hysterics! Two things at play:

Deferments and the Bush administration taking advantage of young people, some who may be troubled and physically unfit for the rigor of war:

Lower standards help Army recruit more

By LOLITA C. BALDOR, Associated Press Writer Mon Oct 9, 7:34 PM ET

WASHINGTON - The U.S. Army recruited more than 2,600 soldiers under new lower aptitude standards this year, helping the service beat its goal of 80,000 recruits in the throes of an unpopular war and mounting casualties.

The recruiting mark comes a year after the Army missed its recruitment target by the widest margin since 1979, which had triggered a boost in the number of recruiters, increased bonuses, and changes in standards.

The Army recruited 80,635 soldiers, roughly 7,000 more than last year. Of those, about 70,000 were first-time recruits who had never served before.

According to statistics obtained by The Associated Press, 3.8 percent of the first-time recruits scored below certain aptitude levels. In previous years, the Army had allowed only 2 percent of its recruits to have low aptitude scores. That limit was increased last year to 4 percent, the maximum allowed by the Defense Department.

Snip...

About 17 percent of the first-time recruits, or about 13,600, were accepted under waivers for various medical, moral or criminal problems, including misdemeanor arrests or drunk driving. That is a slight increase from last year, the Army said.

Of those accepted under waivers, more than half were for "moral" reasons, mostly misdemeanor arrests. Thirty-eight percent were for medical reasons and 7 percent were drug and alcohol problems, including those who may have failed a drug test or acknowledged they had used drugs.

The immorality is astounding!

[Shakespeare]

31. What a PROFOUNDLY STUPID THING for Kerry to say.

Stupid, wrong and insensitive to boot. UNBELIEVABLY stupid.

[Sensitivity]

32. Was GOOD ADVICE TO STUDENTS. Repubs don't want them to hear this.

[Shakespeare]

33. You should be able to give advice WITHOUT insulting the military.

Jesus Christ on a pogo stick. Yes, it was profoundly stupid.

[ProSense]

35. No! It was a true statement!

Maybe the wingnuts don't like to be reminded of the facts of life under the Bush regime, but facts are facts! The Bush admin is taking advantage of young people. Fact, period! Not in college? Flunk the test? Troubled? Medical issues? Off to Iraq! No need to cower from the truth! Think this is fair:

Lower standards help Army recruit more

By LOLITA C. BALDOR, Associated Press Writer Mon Oct 9, 7:34 PM ET

WASHINGTON - The U.S. Army recruited more than 2,600 soldiers under new lower aptitude standards this year, helping the service beat its goal of 80,000 recruits in the throes of an unpopular war and mounting casualties.

The recruiting mark comes a year after the Army missed its recruitment target by the widest margin since 1979, which had triggered a boost in the number of recruiters, increased bonuses, and changes in standards.

The Army recruited 80,635 soldiers, roughly 7,000 more than last year. Of those, about 70,000 were first-time recruits who had never served before.

According to statistics obtained by The Associated Press, 3.8 percent of the first-time recruits scored below certain aptitude levels. In previous years, the Army had allowed only 2 percent of its recruits to have low aptitude scores. That limit was increased last year to 4 percent, the maximum allowed by the Defense Department.

Snip...

About 17 percent of the first-time recruits, or about 13,600, were accepted under waivers for various medical, moral or criminal problems, including misdemeanor arrests or drunk driving. That is a slight increase from last year, the Army said.

Of those accepted under waivers, more than half were for "moral" reasons, mostly misdemeanor arrests. Thirty-eight percent were for medical reasons and 7 percent were drug and alcohol problems, including those who may have failed a drug test or acknowledged they had used drugs.

more...

Kerry spoke the truth!

[sandnsea]

37. Bush doesn't care about these kids' lives

These kids losing their lives wasn't enough for him to start blathering about flexibility and changing course - just losing in the polls. Kerry spoke the truth, those with other options don't join the military today.

[Mass]

39. He is not insulting the military.He was talking about Bush.

[wicket]

47. Hammer. Nail. Head.

:thumbsup:

[wisteria]

45. Well, I disagree.

I see nothing wrong or stupid with his remarks, which, by the way were taken out of context. What is stupid is that you are falling for the right wing smear to change the subject.

[Neecy]

34. Hmmmmmm

Maybe he was listening to Subterranean Homesick Blues before the speech.

...join the Army if you fail

[sandnsea]

36. This thread is classic

This is exactly what happened in 2004. Just lovin' all that Dem 'unity'.

[seabeyond]

38. arent you right on. another thread of kerry kick ass.... and he is being

dissed for speaking out now, and not in 2004. then i come on this thread and being dissed for neing taken out of context

screw this shit

[porphyrian]

40. Soldiers aren't stupid, the people telling them Kerry's bashing them are. - n/t

[Mass]

41. Kerry's answer to these smears,

Statement of John Kerry Responding to Republican Distortions, Pathetic Tony Snow Diversions and Distractions

Washington – Senator John Kerry issued the following statement in response to White House Press Secretary Tony Snow, assorted right wing nut-jobs, and right wing talk show hosts desperately distorting Kerry’s comments about President Bush to divert attention from their disastrous record:



“If anyone thinks a veteran would criticize the more than 140,000 heroes serving in Iraq and not the president who got us stuck there, they're crazy. This is the classic G.O.P. playbook. I’m sick and tired of these despicable Republican attacks that always seem to come from those who never can be found to serve in war, but love to attack those who did.



I’m not going to be lectured by a stuffed suit White House mouthpiece standing behind a podium, or doughy Rush Limbaugh, who no doubt today will take a break from belittling Michael J. Fox’s Parkinson’s disease to start lying about me just as they have lied about Iraq. It disgusts me that these Republican hacks, who have never worn the uniform of our country lie and distort so blatantly and carelessly about those who have.



The people who owe our troops an apology are George W. Bush and Dick Cheney who misled America into war and have given us a Katrina foreign policy that has betrayed our ideals, killed and maimed our soldiers, and widened the terrorist threat instead of defeating it. These Republicans are afraid to debate veterans who live and breathe the concerns of our troops, not the empty slogans of an Administration that sent our brave troops to war without body armor.

Bottom line, these Republicans want to debate straw men because they’re afraid to debate real men. And this time it won’t work because we’re going to stay in their face with the truth and deny them even a sliver of light for their distortions. No Democrat will be bullied by an administration that has a cut and run policy in Afghanistan and a stand still and lose strategy in Iraq.”

http://hotlineblog.nationaljournal.com/archives/2006/10/post_101.html

And BTW, Kerry was talking about Bush, not the troops, and this would probably be clear if more than one sentence has been published.

Sure, the GOP is rushing on that. They are desperate and it shows.

[wicket]

50. It's their MO

this would probably be clear if more than one sentence has been published.


They know nothing else than to smear & distort.

[gully]

49. How's that an insult?

They are politicizing this obviously. Glad I never fell for McCain's supposed integrity.