If the New Jersey decision really costs us a Senate seat then the civil unions strategy won't work

[dsc]

The decision is clear. Give gays and lesbians civil union status with completely equal rights or give them marriage. The legislature gets to decide which. If the civil unions strategy is really a good idea then this decision should be no problem whatsoever. Yet the very same people who continually tell us civil unions are the only way we can have rights without upsetting the electorate tell us this decision will upset the electorate.

My point, be honest with us. If you think giving us our rights will cost us politically then own that. I think the hit for actually equality will be the same regardless of the word marriage. I can't prove it, but maybe this case will. If you honestly think that gays should except less than full equality to prevent Republican rule then admit it. But don't talk out of both sides of your mouth. Either the civil unions strategy prevents us from losing races or it doesn't.

[WI_DEM]

1. first, the senate isn't a forgone conclusion and hasn't been

even before this decision. Too many seats are close. Yes, we have a good edge in Pennsylvania, Rhode Island and Ohio--all of those are outside of the margin of error. But Montana, Missouri, New Jersey, Tennessee, Virginia are all within the margin of error and could go either way. New Jersey has been a struggle in a blue state for an incumbent Democratic Senator, who is leading maybe by 3-4 points, even before this decision. It was a struggle because of accusations that he is corrupt in a year when people are highly upset with corruption in politics. So we can't say that if the Dems don't take the senate it is because of this NJ Court decision.

[dsc]

2. By no means am I conceeding it will

I actually don't think we would have won the Senate in any case. But my point is that they can't have it both ways. Either the civil unions strategy will work or it won't.

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

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[dsc]

4. I think the theory is that

we will lose Tenn and VA not NJ. I think Menendez will win on his own.