Should we make it harder for homicidal maniacs to own guns?

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

Or would that infringe on someone else's rights to keep a basement full of mini 14's?

[karlrschneider]

1. Yes, we should...but don't make it harder for me. I'm not a homicidal

maniac, I'm a responsible liberal Democrat with many guns.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

5. And I should take your word on that?

Had a bad day?

Mebbe a brain tumor swelling has you talking to your dog who's telling you to do strange things?

A synaptic misfire?

Sorry, IMHO, a license to own a gun ought to be about 50 times more difficult to get than a license to drive.

[karlrschneider]

11. I've owned guns and shot them responsibly for 56 years.

Nobody is taking them away. And no, I am not nor ever been a member of the NRA.
Hopefully the day won't come when you regret not having some of your own. And don't ever question
my liberal credentials.

[trayfoot]

34. Problem is.....

How do you recognize a "homicidal maniac"? The guy in Lancaster was supposedly not a threat until today. I also own guns - legally and responsibly. Don't threaten my hobbies because someone else used a gun to commit a horrendous crime. To illustrate the point, rape is a horribly, violent crime against women. Using the same logic some use for guns, one would have to assume that every man with a penis is a threat to womanhood. Not true - the violence is against women by particular men and they would use another weapon, if a penis wasn't available. Gun control, within limits, is fine. BUT, I cannot support the penalizing of innocent people who use guns responsibly.

[ThomWV]

2. Who Are You Presuposing Is A Homicidal Maniac?

Me? My neighbor? Someone who's opnion on some thing you don't agree with? Tell me, just who is it you are assuming will go on a killing spree at some time in the future - thus, the person you would deny their right to bear arms today.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

7. Fucking A right.

We all have potential. This ain't Dodge and it ain't Red Dawn either.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

3. The problem is also that guns are stolen out of people's houses.

A lot of guns that are used in crimes are stolen out of "regular" people's homes.

[slackmaster]

6. Not from mine

How about a federal tax break so more people can afford a nice safe?

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

9. Give me a carbide blade, a torch and a couple of hours...

Of course it would be easier to go to a gun show.

[slackmaster]

16. Not in California

Gun show transactions are regulated the same as in-store transactions. That includes private-party transfers of used firearms.

BTW my neighbors would have called 911 because of the noise and smoke long before you'd be able to get in. And FYI an abrasive blade, not carbide, would be the best choice.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

31. A 24V Saw doesn't make that much noise.

[slackmaster]

37. I'd be home from work long before you finished

With a 24 volt saw. That is not a cheap safe.

I have a 115 volt 7-1/4" Skil saw in the garage and at least a 10-pack of metal-cutting blades in the garage, if you can get past my vicious guard dog and find them.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

40. Hot dogs and seconol...

That's not hardened steel in a home safe... Unless you spent $20K on it...

If you did, I'd bet dollars to donuts I could find weapons in a closet on the same block that you live on.

[slackmaster]

4. A person diagnosed or adjudicated as a homicidal maniac...

...is already prohibited from buying or possessing a firearm.

Gun Control Act of 1968.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

10. And every one is diagnosed BEFORE exhibiting psychotic behavior?

[slackmaster]

14. Of course not, Tom, please don't trivialize this issue

What realistic, politically feasible solution ARE you proposing be done about the problem of guns falling into the hands of people who subsequently go haywire?

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

32. Frankly, I woulds love to see it made to where if you wanted to own

a gun or buy another gun that you would have to jump through so many hoops that you'd be too old to use it by the time it (your request)was approved.

[slackmaster]

36. Thanks for your candor

Of course, I think that would be going way too far.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

38. Hell, you gotta have candor on this topic... There's good people on both

sides of the debate...

The only difference is...

I'm right! :evilgrin: :silly:

[Selatius]

8. No amount of gun regulation short of outright banning could've stopped...

this from happening.

The guy apparently had no criminal record before then, right? Did the guy have a prior medical history of mental instability? It's no, isn't it?

Then unless there were no guns, nothing could've stopped it because he could legally purchase a firearm.

The answer is to ban guns, but that consideration is done without respect to the cultural traditions of the US. Guns are engrained in our culture, and while banning is the most logical answer, culture, if anything, is not a logical beast, and then there's the repeal of the 2nd Amendment, and that's not going to happen.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

12. I guns were a rare commodity and terribly hard to acquire...

Kids and maniacs wouldn't have them quite so often.

[JuniperLea]

21. If penises were a rare commodity

There'd be less rape too.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

28. You can't kill at a distance with a penis...

at least not mine.

[Selatius]

22. I don't disagree with the logic, but we're dealing with culture

As long as American culture remains the same, there will be no solution to the problem because all logical answers will be overruled by irrational cultural views on guns in this country.

If I had my way, there would be no private ownership of handguns, only collective ownership. The only thing that would exist are community-run citizen militias. (No, I'm not talking about the National Guard, which should probably be called the Federal Guard at the current rate) I'm talking about a model similar to the Swiss citizen militia system.

However, even the Swiss love guns, and private ownership of guns is allowed over there as well. The only difference is they've achieved per capita gun death rates and gun crime rates that are a fraction of the US population. For one thing, they treat the poor and the needy far better than we've ever done, which means less people turn to crime and the drug trade to survive, and they take gun regulation seriously over there.

[SoCalDem]

13. Here's the problem

First off. I WANT gun control

but

one does not BECOME a homicidal maniac until the have USED the gun..and then it's easy to "identify" them, but it's too late for the victim(s)..

The trick is in PREVENTING them from getting access to guns BEFORE they go on a killing spree..

That's the hard part..

It's the same argument for immigration.. We want to "end" it, but the same people who bitch and moan about it are also against ID that shows citizenship....

can't have it both ways..gotta choose which is most important..

[slackmaster]

15. How about better availability of mental health care?

If it was more readily available, maybe more people who need help would seek it before they go off the deep end.

[SoCalDem]

17. That should be a given... and if we had national health care

it could be.. There are probably many people who GET mental issues over the inability to afford regular healthcare for their families..


I know for a fact that many men become suicidal when they lose their jobs, or are passed over for promotions.. sadly, in our society, some men ARE what they do..:(..and if they lose their jobs, they become nothing (in their minds)

[spoony]

24. The best idea this thread has produced so far! n/t

[zbdent]

18. It's comical - here in Ohio, the Repukes tried to slime

a local Dem with "he voted to allow illegal aliens to get a concealed carry license" ... (by voting against legislation)

What's comical is this: If the Dem voted for the legislation, it would have restricted people's concealed carry laws ... either way, he loses ...

[JuniperLea]

19. How about we take away your penis so you can't rape

Even though you have never done that... it's used as a weapon every day, in a most violent and heinous way. It can take a life.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

20. If you're mentally ill you can't own a gun as it is now

I know, it doesn't stop them from getting guns, and I don't know how to fix that.

[razors edge]

23. Hitler was big on gun confiscation,

and a running man can slit a lot of throats in a single night.

I own everything from hand guns, so called assault rifles, to the baddest 30 cal sporter on the market, each and everyone pristine and outfitted. It is not so much a concern about Red Dawn situations, personally I'd go the IED route, I was taught marksmanship at paris island and was raised by a gun dealer. My dad had me cleaning guns at age 10 or younger, so I see them as nothing more than a tool, no more no less.

Every time some nut uses a gun to kill in a school, or some other high profile situation, the gun grabbers come out pissed and push the Democrats to call for gun bans. I truly think this has cost us more votes than just about anything else going.

Mother drowns three kids in tub, nobody calls for water bans. Four killed in car accident, no calls to ban cars. I personally am more afraid of getting west nile from a mosquito bite than I am being shot and killed.

[VeggieTart]

26. Well, guns have one purpose only

To kill. Pure and simple. That's the only purpose they have.

Now, if you want to own guns, you should have to go through far more hoops than, say, a woman getting an abortion. You should have to be RESPONSIBLE. And if people are required to register their cars, they should register their guns. Gun dealers should be required to be responsible for their stock. The sniper shootings in 2002 were from stolen rifles; the store they were stolen from had a problem with guns walking out the door.

And yeah, we need better mental health care in this country to maybe prevent a gun owner from going psycho.

[razors edge]

30. yeah I'm sure the criminals

are going to line up around the block to register and apply for a permit.

[elocs]

25. The trouble is that homicidal maniacs

don't always have that tattooed on their foreheads. It would make it so much more convenient if they did.

[BlooInBloo]

27. Sure. Duh. And as soon as you tell me how to differentiate...

... I'm with you.

Sheesh.

Same for:

Should we make it harder for child molesters to be around kids?

Should we make it harder for thieves to be around other people's belongings?

et cetera, ad nauseum.

[Catchawave]

29. Nah, they'd just buy bombs or throw knives....

Just like the Mexican Border fence is going to stop illegal immigration!

Has anyone done a study on how many homicides are done with "illegal" v. "legal" guns ? I don't like guns, but school shooters (or anyone else who snaps) have the will, they'll find a way. Heck, this guy was determined today in PA, he could've soaked that little school with gas and torched it :cry:

[sendero]

33. As soon as you find a way..

... to do it, you let us know.

I'm sick to death of civil libertarians turning into mush about guns. You want to live in a real, free world? There are risks.

[Beelzebud]

35. LOL

[doc03]

39. The Amish own guns. When did you ever hear of a

Amish person killing anybody? So is it the gun that kills people or the the person behind the gun?

[bridgit]

41. yes...