How to justify torture in three sentences!

[Cleita]

:wow:

I just had the rug pulled out from under me by my stepdaughter, who is not a freeper, nor is she dumb. I said something to her about how our goverment has legalized torture.

She said, "Good!"

I said, "What?"

She said, "Good! Our guys go to other countries and if they are accused of rape, the cut their dicks off. If they steal something, they cut their hands off. Good, they deserve it."

I said, "You know that half the guys at Guantanamo were taxi drivers, cooks and other non political types that were sold to us by war lords in Afghanistan. They have no information and yet have been tortured and held without charges and then let go because they were nobodies."

"That's not true", she said.

Then I said, "You know you could be arrested now and tortured for wearing the wrong T-shirt because that's how the new law is laid out?"

"Oh, you are exagerating," she replied. "That will never happen here."

Then she said, "I can't talk about this now."

"Well, enjoy the loss of your basic rights guaranteed under the Constitution while you can, because we have become Nazi Germany." Then I left.

I am dumbfounded. If we don't get our news from places like DU and the foreign press, we are at the mercy of the mainstream press who can influence normally level-headed people like my step-daughter and son-in-law who basically watch the evening news and listen to some rock station with news breaks on the radio. The only other source I can think of that they are getting these ideas from is the group they socialize with. We have to figure out a way to contradict every lie on the propaganda press to inform people. I just don't know how we can do it.

:cry:

[MrCoffee]

1. I can justify torture in one sentence:

It makes it easier for Democrats to run for office.

[liberal N proud]

2. That will never happen here - Too many Americans have said that

They have said that for far too long.

Hitler could never happen here: Then what is bu$h if not a Hitler.

Yes torture of US citizens could happen, will happen. It is just a matter of time now.

[Oeditpus Rex]

3. And they'll keep saying it

until a few thousand of them are "disappeared."

[Cleita]

4. How can we impress them with the danger?

No one wants to believe our country doesn't exist that was there before 2000.

[MsUnderstood]

5. Maybe we need to recall this one sentence

Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.

(Amendment 8, U.S. Constition)

Now I know, I know these are not U.S. citizens (well they could be by we dont wanna fight that arguement) but the idea is that OUR FOUNDING fathers did not want to torture people. . .so why do we?

Oh wait but we're talking about non Americans and look how Americans are treated, blah blah blah?

If you want to protect American Citizens abroad you have to use the Geneva Treaty Obligations. The treaty is a little more wordy but allows our citizens to receive protection from others following the treaty:

Article 3

In the case of armed conflict not of an international character occurring in the territory of one of the High Contracting Parties, each party to the conflict shall be bound to apply, as a minimum, the following provisions:

1. Persons taking no active part in the hostilities, including members of armed forces who have laid down their arms and those placed hors de combat by sickness, wounds, detention, or any other cause, shall in all circumstances be treated humanely, without any adverse distinction founded on race, colour, religion or faith, sex, birth or wealth, or any other similar criteria.

To this end the following acts are and shall remain prohibited at any time and in any place whatsoever with respect to the above-mentioned persons:

(a) Violence to life and person, in particular murder of all kinds, mutilation, cruel treatment and torture;

(b) Taking of hostages;

(c) Outrages upon personal dignity, in particular, humiliating and degrading treatment;

(d) The passing of sentences and the carrying out of executions without previous judgment pronounced by a regularly constituted court affording all the judicial guarantees which are recognized as indispensable by civilized peoples.

2. The wounded and sick shall be collected and cared for.

An impartial humanitarian body, such as the International Committee of the Red Cross, may offer its services to the Parties to the conflict.

The Parties to the conflict should further endeavour to bring into force, by means of special agreements, all or part of the other provisions of the present Convention.

The application of the preceding provisions shall not affect the legal status of the Parties to the conflict.

So basically, once we have "Captured" a potential terrorist, we can stack him in a human pyramid, attack him with dogs, sodomize him, force him to watch others be subjected to this treatment . . .why is that vague?

[Cleita]

6. I'm wondering if anyone else has any suggestions to

get these people to understand the horror of what they are approving of.