Remember the Gandhi quote: Guess what? They're fighting us now. We win.

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

This is a popular and timely quote from Gandhi: First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.

I remember when those of us who, vehemently and passionately, opposed all that gwb and his necon fundy minions stood for, were not even a blip on the public consciousness. I remember conversations with friends and family who shared that sentiment. We would invaribly say, "Surely, we can't be the only people who feel this way."

Yet the MSM force fed us, night after night, the wonders of george the second and the glowing approval he basked in, supposedly from almost all the citizens of our country.

Well the ignoring is over. Their laughter has ceased. They're fighting now. Just look at a couple of threads from the greatest page today.

NYCGirl's post: Fox calls Keith Olbermann "twisted and sick"!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x5702579

From OneAngryDemocrat: Freepers Target USMC Vet's Anti-War Website
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x5700163

A quick DU search with "attack", "fight" and "GOP" as keywords, give us even more recent evidence that we are winning and will win.

From pdurod1: CNN: Bush attacks paper for jeopardizing national security
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=1993617

From papau: Fixing the Game (NY Times ED calls GOP action like the "Bolsheviks")
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=103&topic_id=177603

From sabra: Hoekstra defends spying policy (necessary to "fight the bad guys.")
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=1998095

So..take heart. And, a few more observations from Gandhi, a contemporary pacifist who changed the world.

Strength does not come from physical capacity. It comes from an indomitable will.

One needs to be slow to form convictions, but once formed they must be defended against the heaviest odds.

A "No" uttered from deepest conviction is better and greater than a "Yes" merely uttered to please, or what is worse, to avoid trouble.

My personal favorite, with which many more of us, than "them", can identify.

If I had no sense of humor, I would long ago have committed suicide.

C'mon everyone, let's fight, let's love, let's laugh and let's win! MKJ

Cue, "We are the Champions!" by Queen....:yourock:

[Terran1212]

1. I'm sure the Fight is just beginning but ....

It's worth fighting for

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

2. You're right, the most difficult times are ahead of us. Once the fight

is engaged in, I don't rule out anything by the greedy, power grubbing, corrupt people who want to rule the country.

And, you're right. It is worth it. MKJ

[C_U_L8R]

3. Then lets not play only defense...

we need to define the game on our terms and keep the freepy-fundie-creeps
knocked back on their heels.. so far so good.. and we're gaining momentum..
It's our fight to lose.

(in a gandhi sort of way. of course... hahaha)

[Dunvegan]

4. Important reminder...This is Ghandi speaking...therefore...

...this quote applies solely to non-violent civil resistance...this quote's promise and warranty is null and void if the resistance becomes violent.

Other than that proviso...Ghandi was right and won...King was right and won...Mandela was right and won...and so shall we.


(Oh, and edited to say: There is some long time and patience required to make it from the "They Fight Us" stage to "We Win!" stage...see, Mandela, King..et. al.)

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

5. I'm so glad you brought that up.

That distinction directs attention to this quote, which, to me personally, is the bravest statement anyone can make....

You can chain me, you can torture me, you can even destroy this body, but you will never imprison my mind.

I only wish I could have that level of courage of conviction. MKJ

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

6. Or, They Can Take Our Lives, But They Can Never Take Our FREEEEDOMMMMMMM

Love that movie. Sorry.

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

7. LOL, my boss is Scottish...

My nickname for her is "Braveheart", 'cause when she gets fired up, watch out!

BTW, she hates gwb and was horrified when he was in Scotland for the G8 summit this summer. MKJ

[Dunvegan]

8. I laugh because I'm a multi-ethnic woman...

...married to a Scots-Canadian who's clan (who had a woman Chief in the last century) has a motto that is "Stand Fast!"...and there's total truth to that idea.

Which goes in non-violent struggle too.

Come firehoses, come police dogs, come inprisonment...come assassination...the ones that stand fast, and never, never become violent...nor (in Churchill's words) never, never surrender ALWAYS win eventually.

That is only if their pacific center holds...and their pacific convictions...and their pacific will.

True of the dismantlement of the Soviet, South Africa, India's British Raj, and America's apartheid.

Even that Jesus guy...the Caeser of the greatest Western warrior empire ever known eventually adopted His philosophy.

Just imagine the discreditation of the "Plantation paranoia" of the minority Whites in South Africa when the majority gained power yet didn't over-run and kill them...but instead instigated under Mandela the "Truth and Reconciliation" initiative.

Now, who was the closest to being "animals" in ruling their fellow men?

The people the militant White South Africans called animals showed evolved mercy and forgiveness when they gained power.

And if you as a ruling class see your resistant adversary is not like you (that is the resistance is not hateful, but peaceful) eventually you as an opressor are worn down by persecuting such saintly behaviour...and after years it is obvious that no mater how you perscute them the pacifists will never go away...what now if torture and worse have no effect...it means you have no weapons at all.

And even more importantly...the oppressors come to know in their heart-of-hearts that their oppressed are not going to rule them with opressive hate. The oppressed will obviously continue, if they finally come to power, their battle-proven philosophy of forgiveness.

That up-front forgiveness on the part of the opressed is key to ending the violent oppression.

It is to forgiveness alone that they dare to surrender.

Do not play thier game. Do not give in to hate.

Lock on "love thine enemy"...and get and stay in their sights with this...stand square in front of them eye-to-eye and never ever look away, and yet never fall victim to their philosophy of hate...and never never ever leave the playing field.

Because building something takes longer than destroying anything: Never. Never. Surrender.

And then, we win.

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

15. Dunvegan, you have a gift for expressing the best in all of us.

Thanks, that is inspirational. You sound like someone who's wise and probably very fun to hang out with!

MKJ

[malaise]

19. Nice post n/t

[gratuitous]

21. Ka-bam

Excellent post.

And well worth remembering that the real fight is just now beginning. We've been called naive, we've been called traitors, we've been accused of being in league with terrorists, and that's only the beginning. The real heavy artillery, rhetorical and real, is about to be rolled out.

Where are your convictions? What do you believe in? We've got a few days around the New Year's holiday, and this might be a real good time to review that in your own mind. If you didn't believe the stream of lies spun out by the administration in its run-up to the Iraq invasion, don't believe them in the days and weeks to come when they lie about you. Know yourself and know your heart. You're not a traitor to America; you stand for what's best in America and what's best in humanity.

A small coterie of power-hungry men is heavily invested in promoting fear and divisiveness. Be strong, be together. Encourage one another and take heart from each other. Despising the politics of terror isn't joining the terrorists running our country, and don't let them try to tell you it is. It's up to Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld and their minions to decide if they want to put away the fear they've so assiduously cultivated. If they choose to remain at odds with the rest of humanity, then it's not divisiveness on our part that isolates them.

[fooj]

9. One of my favorites...

You must not lose faith in humanity. Humanity is an ocean; if a few drops of the ocean are dirty the ocean does not become dirty.:patriot:

Peace.

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

14. Lovely. I hadn't heard that one before. Thanks for posting. n/t

:hi: MKJ

[Oversea Visitor]

10. Bush say

First they ignore me (call me a stupid spoilt brat), then they laugh at me ( call me a chimp :cry: ),then they fight me ( call me a liar and lawbreaker :freak: ), then I win, I WIN

Daddy I win, Mommy I win, see I am a winner not a loser, I win.
I told you I can do it, cut all this spending to help those miserable people who always whine about them not getting fair deal, whee they dont know how to dig for oil and earn real bucks
( Daddy BUsh face turn white :( and say " Son you not think of doing that again are you?")

I also make lots of bucks, see I multiple the cuts by 2 and gave it all away as tax cuts to your friends and my buddies. Then i go to Afganistan and Iraq to drop all this firecrackers on all the frogs, big frogs, female frogs, little frogs. That was FUN FUN FUN. And cheny and rumfield so happy with me on that, my oil buddies love me so much. 500 billion whee so much bucks.

U...nder S...erious A...bused, the country consumers got less to spend, cuts in spending locally result in people digging right to the bottom of the barrel to survive, circulation flow of money got strangle as goverments spending reduce in the country and increase with a speed of a bullets to 500 billion oversea. As the oil industry ejaculated in estacy over this big windfall by King George. The others Corporation grind their teeth in anger and told King George "YOU'RE FIRED"

But I win I read history and I follow Gandhi saying. Rove Rove help. Get Fitz of my back first
Gonze write me a law. I did and my ass on fire. Uncle Dick Uncle Dick Busy looking for a bigger calculator to count money, here a dollar go get a brain. Rum rum Ehhh busy serving steak and lobster tail hard work but safe. Condi condi Whee my star rising and hear shoe sales on. Miers Miers I believe in you I did I did, but I didnt get on the Surpreme court. Delayyyyy, Any good news George, they after me. Fristtt, Sorry me out of here. Schmidt??? Cut and run George cut and run. Anybody out there.... YES millions of voice roar, we coming we coming.

[tavalon]

11. My partner has that on a t-shirt

The other day he was wearing it and he just pointed to the last part and gave me a knowing nod. I nodded back at him. We are so on the same page.

[dooner]

12. So true!

I remember when they were ignoring us and laughing.. seems like only yesterday. How quickly times change.

[Dunvegan]

13. Perhaps it's time to take a page from the Ukraine's Orange Revolution...

...they had their duly elected candidate eliminated via election fraud and a power grab backed by Moscow.

Is it time to set up a peaceful and PERMANENT vigil of thousands at the White House?

How one woman sitting in a ditch on a dusty road in backwater Texas pained and shamed and drove the President to near complete distraction.

The success of the Orange Revolution was that it was not a march...but a PERMANENT encampment.

People came and went, as their needs required...but there was always a permanent presence of thousands that was NOT GOING AWAY.

Visualize thousands surrounding the White House.

Orange anyone?

(Or perhaps a "Purple Revolution"...Purple = Red + White + Blue = American Unity)

[julianer]

16. Ummm, not quite

I don't know about the allegations of electoral fraud but I do know that the Orange revolution was paid for by the NED and its offshoots. Also Boris Berezhovsky(sp?), the exiled Russian oligarch, former Yeltsin bagman and the main promoter of Vladimir Putin, was closely involved with funding the orange leaders - he went so far as to create a new newspaper to carry their message. The demonstrators standing in the capital were fed and sheltered, in part, by Berezhovsky money.

There is no doubt that the people of Ukraine were in desperate need of a revolution but the one they got was not what it seemed. The present government - the supposed democrats - are just as corrupt as the previous regime (as the left predicted they would be at the time).

Berezhovsky's involvement was not motivated by a desire to help Ukraine or Ukrainians - he wants to destabilise Russia and is a sworn enemy of Putin. The US motivation in corrupting the Ukrainian political process was to ensure a government that would 'encourage foreign investment' and 'build democracy' - in other words the usual demand for open markets and corrupt leaders to better exploit the country's resources and labour.

[Dunvegan]

17. Point taken...then how about a grass-roots...

...yet uncorrupt White House permanent encampment?

Vacation this spring in lovely Washington DC...and help man the plan to rock the cradle of Democracy.

[julianer]

18. Oh definitely

As soon as possible.

I only wish I could be there.

[info being]

20. we will win this battle. but has the war already been lost?

[RandomKoolzip]

22. I hate that quote.

Really, I do. It implies that any bizarre or outlandish idea will be vindicated in the end. It suggests that the more absurd a theory, the more plausible it will be in the long run.

Sorry to say, but foolishness is not always vindicated. Sometimes a lot of people laugh at something because it is indeed foolish.

I'm sure Ghandi had the best of intentions, but that quote always gets on my nerves, especially when nutball conspiracy freaks get a hold of it and use it as their only weapon of defense when confronted with their lack of facts and idiotic reasoning.

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

23. LOL, I hadn't thought about the implications of that quote in "the wrong

hands."

I could see where any group or individual could use it to justify wacky stuff. For me, the acid test would be whether the person saying this is someone who has a depth of understanding of the context in which he said this.

If it's being spouted as justification for promoting, say, radio signals coming in through teeth fillings, well yeah, that could be a problem. MKJ