Juan Cole, "A letter to the editor worth reading":

[Junkdrawer]

MODS: I feel the signatories and the polling data make this newsworthy:

The US-backed Israeli assault on Lebanon has left the country numb, smouldering and angry. The massacre in Qana and the loss of life is not simply "disproportionate". It is, according to existing international laws, a war crime.

The deliberate and systematic destruction of Lebanon's social infrastructure by the Israeli air force was also a war crime, designed to reduce that country to the status of an Israeli-US protectorate. The attempt has backfired. In Lebanon itself, 87% of the population now support Hizbullah's resistance, including 80% of Christian and Druze and 89% of Sunni Muslims, while 8% believe the US supports Lebanon. But these actions will not be tried by any court set up by the "international community" since the US and its allies that commit or are complicit in these appalling crimes will not permit it.

It has now become clear that the assault on Lebanon to wipe out Hizbullah had been prepared long before. Israel's crimes had been given a green light by the US and its loyal British ally, despite the opposition to Blair in his own country.

In short, the peace that Lebanon enjoyed has come to an end, and a paralysed country is forced to remember a past it had hoped to forget. The state terror inflicted on Lebanon is being repeated in the Gaza ghetto, while the "international community" stands by and watches in silence. Meanwhile, the rest of Palestine is annexed and dismantled with the direct participation of the US and the tacit approval of its allies.

We offer our solidarity and support to the victims of this brutality and to those who mount a resistance against it. For our part, we will use all the means at our disposal to expose the complicity of our governments in these crimes. There will be no peace in the Middle East while the occupations of Palestine and Iraq and the temporarily "paused" bombings of Lebanon continue.

Tariq Ali
Noam Chomsky
Eduardo Galeano
Howard Zinn
Ken Loach
John Berger
Arundhati Roy


http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1835915,00.html

On Edit: As per scarletwoman, adding a link to Juan Cole:

http://www.juancole.com /

[MamaBear]

1. K&R.

[Extend a Hand]

2. cnn, msnbc, network news

nope. not here. just hours worth of a Mel Gibson dui.

disgusting.

K&R

[scarletwoman]

3. k&r -- I'm glad you posted this.

I think a link to Juan Cole would be useful also:

http://www.juancole.com/

sw

[Junkdrawer]

4. Done, n/t

[mom cat]

5. Also see this provocative question that follows the signiatures:

London

As our political leaders argue over the difference between a "cessation of hostilities" and a "ceasefire", more and more children die. The British government (unlike the US) has agreed to be bound by the UN convention on the rights of the child. This is a legally enforceable international treaty which enshrines the "right to life" as one of its four core principles. I would be very interested to know how the government justifies its actions in relation to its responsibilities under the convention and why our new children's commissioners have remained silent on what appears to be a flagrant disregard of children's rights, as well as a breach of our international obligations.
Professor Steve Trevillion
University of Leicester

K&R& thanks.

[laura888]

6. My heroes signed.

I feel a little better.

[Nikki Stone 1]

19. Mine too

:kick:

[breakaleg]

7. Let's focus on the casualties, the victims in this case.

[scarletwoman]

8. (*smooch*) Here's another kick... (nt)

[BrklynLiberal]

9. but but but ..if there is no war, BushCo can't make money!!!!!!!

and it is so much nicer to have Israel do the dirty work for them...

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

10. Another kick in agreement with the signatories.

[Cooley Hurd]

11. In agreement - and a kick & recommend!

:thumbsup:

[KoKo]

12. The United Nations that I so believed in as a Child and growing up...

has FAILED... and tears could run in rivers as to how that "noble venture" means NOTHING today. It can do nothing...it is nothing but a "Forum" of a more sophisticated level than DU...but just a Message Board...nevertheless for those with opinions to come to and EXPRESS their Grievances But NOT to have anything DONE about them.

And...the "International Community?" What is that....what is that...??

[Fozzledick]

13. Juan Cole is becoming the Ann Coulter of Israel-haters

crossing the line from partisan fantatic to raving looney the way Ann did after 9/11.

[Junkdrawer]

14. Perhaps you could point out some of his errors?

:shrug:

[truth2power]

16. Raving looney?? Juan Cole?

:rofl: :rofl:

[muriel_volestrangler]

20. Ha ha, have you got your own alternative internet?

Cole is analysing as coolly as he always has. Are you sure you're looking at the right URL? Your remark is possibly the silliest I've seen on DU in the last few weeks.

[Warren Stupidity]

22. Most outrageous post of the morning!

Congratulations.

[Cooley Hurd]

24. Actually, Professor Cole is quite fair in his assessments...

...just because he's had little nice to say about Israel lately doesn't make him an Israel-hater. How could any sane individual say anything nice about Israel's heavy-handed actions as of late?:shrug:

[leftchick]

25. When did Ann Coulter become a Professor and Mid East Specialist?

Prof. Cole's Bio:
Juan R. I. Cole is Professor of Modern Middle East and South Asian History at the History Department of the University of Michigan. A bibliography of his writings may be found here. He has written extensively about modern Islamic movements in Egypt, the Persian Gulf, and South Asia. He has given numerous media and press interviews on the War on Terrorism since September 11, 2001, as well as concerning the Iraq War in 2003. His current research focuses on two contemporary phenomena: 1) Shiite Islam in Iraq and Iran and 2) the "jihadi" or "sacred-war" strain of Muslim radicalism, including al-Qaeda and the Taliban among other groups. Cole commands Arabic, Persian and Urdu and reads some Turkish, knows both Middle Eastern and South Asian Islam, and lived in a number of places in the Muslim world for extended periods of time. His most recent book is Sacred Space and Holy War (IB Tauris 2002). This volume collects some of his work on the history of the Shiite branch of Islam in modern Iraq, Iran and the Gulf. He treated Shi`ism in his co-edited book, Shi`ism and Social Protest (Yale, 1986), of his first monograph, Roots of North Indian Shi`ism in Iran and Iraq (California, 1989). His interest in Iranian religion is further evident in his work on Baha'i studies, which eventuated in his 1998 book, Modernity and the Millennium: The Genesis of the Baha'i Faith in the Nineteenth Century Middle East (Columbia University Press). He has also written a good deal about modern Egypt, including a book, Colonialism and Revolution in the Middle East: Social and Cultural Origins of Egypt's `Urabi Movement (Princeton, 1993). His concern with comparative history and Islamics is evident in his edited Comparing Muslim Societies (Michigan, 1992).


:rofl:

I guess I missed coulter's Doctorate credentials!

:rofl:

When did Juan EVER write something that was not true? Ever?

:rofl:

nice try

:rofl:

actually it was a crappy try!

:rofl:

[WilliamPitt]

29. pzzzzzzcheeeeezzzzzz

Thanks for playing.

[BeachBuckeye]

35. Juan Cole ALWAYS speaks the truth

You may not like it but he knows of what he speaks. Your post is outrageous.

[chibi]

58. must be a LOT of TRUTH to POWER in the OP to generate this BS

line.

obviously the israeli right-or-wrong supporters hate it when the truth be told, too bad - TRUTH-OUT!

[BuyingThyme]

60. There's one.

:rofl:

[cool user name]

15. Kick and a resounding applause!

[JackNewtown]

17. Impressive list

Given their views on foreign policy and social justice I will side with them anyday over Bush, Cheney, PNAC, Hannity, Rush, O'Reilly, et al...

[Name removed]

18. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[GeorgeGist]

21. Any link available for the Hizbullah support fiqures? /nt

[chimpymustgo]

23. K & R. Juan Cole, always on the money.

And some good support there.

[allemand]

26. It was a poll by the Beirut Center for Research and Information:

Editor's note: In an attempt to gauge the mood of the country after nearly two weeks of Israel's latest assault on Lebanon, the Beirut Center for Research and Information queried 800 citizens regarding Hizbullah's July 12 capture of two Israeli soldiers, the resistance's military operations against Israel and the American position on the crisis. Respondents were also asked to assess the Lebanese government's performance on the diplomatic front and its handling of relief efforts. This survey was conducted by Lebanese statistician Abdo Saad between July 24 and July 26 according to confessional and regional distribution, including the opinion of the displaced in the regions of emigration.
(...)

The survey showed 87 percent support for Hizbullah's retaliatory attacks on northern Israel . Such a high level of support must be attributed to Hizbullah's political and military performance, in addition to a national consensus identifying Israel as Lebanon 's main enemy.

The survey suggests that Hizbullah's military performance has bolstered confidence in the resistance's abilities as 63 percent of respondents expected a Hizbullah victory over Israel .

The survey showed that a large majority of Lebanese do not consider the US to be an honest mediator (89.5 percent). A similar survey conducted by the Beirut Center for Research and Information published in As-Safir on January 31 showed 38.2 percent support for the US role in Lebanon. This drop is due to the close political cooperation between the US and Israel.

http://www.beirutcenter.info/default.asp?contentid=692&MenuID=46

[Junkdrawer]

28. Thanks. Perhaps that poll warrants a separate post...

:thumbsup:

[Junkdrawer]

27. IMPORTANT: Juan Cole linked to this LTTE on his website with...

the phrase "A letter to the editor worth reading". As far as I know, Juan himself neither helped to write nor did he sign the letter.

I'm sorry if anyone was confused by my post.

[Junkdrawer]

37. ^^^^ ^^^^ ^^^^^^

I stlll see people getting confused.

[Junkdrawer]

46. ^^^^ ^^^^ ^^^^^^

I've asked the mods to put this in the OP.

[malaise]

30. Great letter

The fix is in. See link on this thread.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x1817005
Blair knew the attack on Lebanon was coming but he didn't try to stop it, because he didn't want to. He has made this country an accomplice, destroying what remained of our influence abroad while putting us all at greater risk of attack.

I am told that the Israelis informed George W Bush in advance of their plans to "destroy" Hezbollah by bombing villages in southern Lebanon. The Americans duly informed the British. So Blair knew. This exposes as a fraud the debate of the past week about calling for a ceasefire. Indeed, one of the reasons why negotiations failed in Rome was British obduracy. This has been a case not of turning a blind eye and failing to halt the onslaught, but of providing active support.

Blair, like Bush, had no intention of urging the Israelis to slow down their bombardment, believing somehow that this struggle was winnable. Israel has a right to self-defence, but it could have responded to the seizure of its soldiers, and to the rocket attacks, by the diplomatic route. That would have ensured greater sympathy. Now, growing numbers in Israel itself realise that military action will bring no long-term solution.
--------------
To the Hague!

[k_jerome]

31. Juan Cole spewing filth about Israel...

thats new.

[Junkdrawer]

32. See Post #27. The LTTE was from Noam Chomsky, Howard Zinn et. al.

Now, as for "spewing filth", while I agree that Israel's actions are indeed filthy, I think it is unfair to characterize anyone who accurately describes those filthy actions as "spewing".

[k_jerome]

33. I would take him a little more seriously...

if he didn't have to spend so much time defending his filth. But we obviously disagree. If he is saying the things you like to hear, then by all means, you will continue to support him. I for one do not think jews or zionists are controlling the United States governmment. Perhaps this is what has placed him on the lunatic fringe along with Pat Buchanan and David Duke, who, while occupying different territory on the political map, say just about the same things he does.

[Junkdrawer]

34. First he's the new Ann Coulter, now he's David Duke....

Honestly, the "Israel is never wrong" gang is getting quite a tin ear in regards to its critics. Most of us see big differences between David Duke and Juan Cole and don't believe he says "just about the same things he does".

[k_jerome]

38. I was just pointing out the striking similarity between some of his...

statements and David Duke and Pat Buchanan.

[Warren Stupidity]

43. Self delete.

I was on the verge of saying something quite rude. Nevermind.

[Warren Stupidity]

36. "jews or zionists are controlling the United States governmment"

I'm sorry but I do not see that point made in the posted letter.

Did you somehow get this from the posted letter? If so where? Or do you have another source for your assertion that this is Prof. Cole's stated position?

[k_jerome]

40. he has said it before. I am also...

well aware that his many fans are well versed in his positions and his need to defend himself from charges of bigotry in the past, which his supporters claim are false. Well, I see lots of smoke, and am pretty sure there is fire there somewhere.

"The Founding Fathers of the United States deeply feared that a foreign government might gain this level of control over a branch of the United States government, and their fears have been vindicated," -Juan Cole

[Warren Stupidity]

41. In other words, you have no evidence.

So if we ask you to provide evidence of your assertion that is proof that your assertion is true? Is that your position?

[k_jerome]

44. well, writing that zionists....

control a branch of our government is my evidence.

[muriel_volestrangler]

47. He was talking about Likud and AIPAC influence over Congress

His only mention of 'Zion' is "Christian Zionists", who are indeed bizarre, and whose real feeling about Israelis are highly suspect. Given the piece was talking about the investigation of US government employees spying on behalf of Israel - which has now been admitted - I think he has a good point that AIPAC and Likud have too much influence over the American government.

[Warren Stupidity]

48. You are giving our friend too much credit.

He still has not provided one link to support his assertions.

[muriel_volestrangler]

49. Which may be because he didn';t read Cole's article

but just saw the quote, out of context. I'd like to know what our friend says about Israeli spying on the US government.

[k_jerome]

50. I have read Coles article and many others...

I have seen his favorable links on his blog to colleagues that claim Mossad had knowledge of 9/11. I have thankfully seen him voted down in a position at Yale because of the charges that have dogged him. Do I think Cole is an anti-semite? I am witholding judgement. Do I think he is a hack with an axe to grind with Israel? Yes. Bursting on the scene after 9/11, and proclaiming a knowledge of the contemporary middle east with a less than stellar background in that area, coupled with an almost obssesive focus on Israels role in dominating U.S. politics causes me to dismiss him as I do those of his ilk. As he seems to mirror much of what those that are anti Israel or anti zionist say, I am not surprised that he is so popular with that crowd. Do not expect him to be popular with Jews or those that support Israel.

[muriel_volestrangler]

52. And yet you say he 'spews filth' about Israel

but you haven't shown us any. All you have are innuendo and baseless charges. That's all the effort to stop him getting the Yale position had. But too many people in American public life are afraid of AIPAC.

[k_jerome]

54. why are so many afraid of AIPAC? nt.

[Junkdrawer]

55. I don't know, ask the Senators themselves....

AIPAC says "jump" and they say "how high?".

[k_jerome]

56. I see. nt.

[Junkdrawer]

57. An infamous quote:

...


Aipac’s leaders can be immoderately frank about the group’s influence. At dinner that night with Steven Rosen, I mentioned a controversy that had enveloped aipac in 1992. David Steiner, a New Jersey real-estate developer who was then serving as aipac’s president, was caught on tape boasting that he had “cut a deal” with the Administration of George H. W. Bush to provide more aid to Israel. Steiner also said that he was “negotiating” with the incoming Clinton Administration over the appointment of a pro-Israel Secretary of State. “We have a dozen people in his”—Clinton’s—“headquarters . . . and they are all going to get big jobs,” Steiner said. Soon after the tape’s existence was disclosed, Steiner resigned his post. I asked Rosen if aipac suffered a loss of influence after the Steiner affair. A half smile appeared on his face, and he pushed a napkin across the table. “You see this napkin?” he said. “In twenty-four hours, we could have the signatures of seventy senators on this napkin.”


http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/articles/050704fa_fact

[Warren Stupidity]

53. You have not provided one shred of evidence.

You insinuated that Cole's position is that "jews or zionists are controlling the United States governmment". Please provide documentation that this is his stated opinion.

[MsMagnificent]

63. *crickets chirping*

[KitSileya]

45. So are you saying

that Juan Cole is implying that it is Israel that has gained "this level of control over a branch of the United States government"? And that that is the same as saying Jews have gained control, like David Duke said?


Hm, I didn't realize that the 21% of the Israeli population that aren't Jewish didn't count. Nor that American Jews are the same as Israel so that any say they have in American politics is automatically pro-Israel and treasonous.

(edited to correct the transposing of the numbers in the percentage of Israeli population which is not Jewish.)

[JAbuchan08]

42. If the US supports Israeli actions

there must be a reason, and it falls to those who support Israel to describe criticisms of the undue influence and support that the Israeli government in general (and likkudniks in particular) enjoy, in the most hyperbolic manner possible to maximize the charge of anti-semitism.

[scarletwoman]

39. When has Juan Cole EVER said anything like that?

You imply that Professor Cole says things such as this:

"...jews or zionists are controlling the United States governmment."

That's absolutely absurd. I've been reading Cole since the Iraq invasion, he has NEVER said or even remotely implied that he holds such a belief.

Either link to a specific statement or statements that he's made on his website to this effect, or quit spewing nonsense. Back up your accusations with FACTS.

sw

[jonnyblitz]

51. outstanding letter!

:thumbsup:

[BuyingThyme]

59. Juan tried to set Al Franken straight yesterday. Franken was spewing

all of the anti-Arab hate nonsense that we've seen here from the supremacists, and Juan simply used facts to put Franken in his place.

[Bozita]

61. Juan Cole is on live NOW with Thom Hartmann - stream

http://linux.redbird.com:8000/listen.pls

[Douglas Carpenter]

62. thank you. Juan Cole is on Democracy Now today.

link to listen/watch/or read transcipt:


http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=06/08/04/1418253