Hamza: Living among "non-believers" is like living "inside a toilet"

[BurtWorm]

I wonder how many "believers" (regardless of belief) feel the same way...

Hamza is the cleric Brits arrested last year just after Blair's government imposed a sort of British "Patriot Act." His trial is testing the power of the government to define speech like this as a form of terrorism:

"We ask Muslims to do that ... to be capable to bleed the enemies of Allah anywhere, by any means. You can't do it by nuclear weapon, you do it by the kitchen knife."


http://www.guardian.co.uk/terrorism/story/0,12780,1684970,00.html?gusrc=rss

Hamza jury shown video

Staff and agencies
Thursday January 12, 2006

Living among "non-believers" is like living "inside a toilet", the Muslim cleric Abu Hamza said in a videotape played today to jurors trying him on race hate charges.

The tape was played on the second day of the 47-year-old's trial at the Old Bailey. It was the first time jurors had heard the voice of the defendant.

In the tape he says that democracy is failing and describes how the White House will be run by the re-establishment of the Khilafa, "the authority of Allah on earth".

...

Mr Perry said yesterday that the prosecution's case was that Mr Hamza had encouraged his followers to murder "non believers" and had preached hatred. Mr Hamza denies 14 race hate charges and one charge relating to his alleged ownership of a "terrorism manual".

..

[undeterred]

1. I thought this was about living with Repubs

:shrug:

[Crunchy Frog]

2. Sounds like the sort of thing that Pat Robertson would say. n/t

[notadmblnd]

5. Hey maybe we could put the two in a room together and see who's god comes

out on top?

[fujiyama]

13. It'd kind of be like a cockfight

but I don't see any animal right's activists making a fuss out of it!

[FreedomAngel82]

15. Sad and true

[GrpCaptMandrake]

17. The fundies in America

have far more in common with Osama's fundies than they do with real Americans or real followers of Yeshua.

No drinking, no gambling, no smoking, no dancing, no womens' rights, no secularism, no fun. That's the American Religion Industry *and* Wahabism in a nutshell.

[Crunchy Frog]

18. And on top of that,

advocate for the assassinations of foreign heads of state and the detonation of nuclear devices at the State Department, the NYT building, and the city of San Fransisco, as well as attributing deaths or illnesses of major public figures to the wrath of God and the hope that others such as "liberal" Supreme Court justices will be smote in similar fashion.

I'm guessing that the only real difference is that their psycho followers are unlikely to actually blow themselves up when they finally begin seriously acting on what they're getting continuously pushed on them. Their Heaven doesn't come with the attraction of the 72 virgins which must make it considerably less attractive, so I don't see them offing themselves when they actually get around to carrying out terrorist attacks.

[MindPilot]

3. But remember, we have to respect and tolerate religion

Because Islam--like Christianity--is all about peace. :sarcasm:

[newswolf56]

6. Well said. n/t

[sui generis]

4. I think my opinion is probably harsher than posting rules allow

We live in a rose garden with many varieties of roses, and even other flowers, but gardens are fertile places. If we fear to distinguish between roses and weeds our gardens are doomed to become nothing more than beds of weeds.

I believe muslim and christian extremism are weeds - actually, any form of extremism, but religious extremism tends to rely on violence more readily and more notably than other forms.

I don't know what the solution is without conflicting with the very constitutional concepts that make our "garden" fertile to begin with, but I'm happy to see that guy on the way out.

[newswolf56]

9. Mine certainly is -- not the least because I know that slaughter...

in the name of the Abrahamic religions (Judaism, Christianity, Islam) has killed more humans than all other causes of violence combined: as if these infinitely harsh creeds were ultimate forms of population control. Trouble is, this mode of population control -- thanks to its implacable hatred of nature -- destroys the non-human environment too.

And as to "infinitely harsh" -- what could be harsher (or more infinite) than "eternal damnation."

[Johnyawl]

7. Then why does he chose to live in a country of non-believers?

It would be a rather simple matter for him to return home to his native Egypt, and live surrounded by believers. Perhaps it's because he personally enjoys the luxury and decadence that a nation of non-believers can provide him with? What a hypocrite.

[hogwyld]

8. Perhaps it's his mission from God

To "enlighten" the heathen masses of England, and convert the european continent to his religion of peace, harmony, and tolerance! :sarcasm:

[BurtWorm]

11. Mubarak would roast his ass if he returned to Egypt.

It's one of the paradoxes of liberal democracies that they harbor and tolerate their mortal enemies.

[Skidmore]

10. There are people the Islamic world who will complete a ritual bath

if coming in contact with anything handeled by an "infidel" or touching an "infidel". The stickler is how you define "infidel". Some people are willing to accept Christians and Jews as believers in the Books (Torah and Bible) from which Mohammed took some teachings.

[oneoftheboys]

12. Living among those who believe in the supernatural

Is like living in the twilight zone.

[Ikonoklast]

14. Hatred and intolerance are the hallmarks

of all "true believers", no matter what religion they espouse.

My god is greater than yours, and if you don't succumb to his will it is my duty to kill you.

Works pretty well coming from any fundamentalists' mouth, just fill in the name. Robertson, Falwell, Hamza, Bin-Laden, ad infinitum, ad nauseam.

The whole world would be better off without using their god as the reason to hate those that look, act, or believe differently. Some are just haters, period.

[Igel]

16. He must like living in a toilet.

That toilet provided him with a home and food.

Says something about the man, that does.