Bought some High Heat Furnace Cement today for a repair

[yy4me]

project I need to do to my kitchen fireplace. Perhaps someone can clarify something for me. The directions are pretty clear except for the firing process.

Wire brush to clean surface of dust, grease paint oil...Done
Dampen area to be done (Windex spray bottle?)

In one section (1 brick) I have to fill a chunk that I am told should be done in two applications. How long does it take for the first fill to dry?
Do I have to have a fire between this first application (it is about 2" by 2" by 2" deep) and the rest of the job? The damaged area is about 14" by 6 inches, mostly loss of old mortar and some small chunks of brick missing.

Heat using low temp for initial firing, gradually increase temp to allow cement to cure to a solid and durable mass. Full firing to follow.I gather that I just gradually increase the size of the fire to cure it all but I am concerned about the deep patch that I have to do in two applications.


I was told that it is not dangerous but it looks awful. Any help would be appreciated.

The product was recommended by the Home Depot man,--no Lowe's nearby.

I'm not afraid of the job, done things far more complicated with cement but none required firing.

[yy4me]

1. Well, I went and did it anyway. Still do not know about curing

time but hopefully the company will reply to my e-mail. Not hard to work with but I wish the mortar color was a little darker. I'm sure it will color up when I have a fire.

If this stuff does not work, I'm going to throttle the fellow at Home Depot.

[Wash. state Desk Jet]

2. look at the directions more carefully

Does the stuff require firing or can it cure at room temp over time. A second application is always required with deep impressions. A propane torch may work to fire the patching compound. If you need more detailed spects on the product, google the manufactures web site enter that specific product in the web sites search engine ,get that page up and than ask if it will cure at room temp. You can call their 800 number and ask to speak to a tec. rep.

Firing is just raising the temp to to expedite or activate the process of curring.All you need top find out is, which is it, expedite or activate. There are also other products for that-, that do not require firing.

Otherwise just wait and see.

[yy4me]

3. Howdy, I did call the mfgr. to ask about the curing and he

suggested I use a hair dryer if I wanted to hurry the curing along. I will be doing a second coat on Sunday for the areas that need 2 applications. From what I gathered from speaking with the service rep, you could either wait it out and let it cure by itself or use the dryer. I think I'll just wait it out. It is a little late in the season for a fire and I have no idea how long I would aim the hairdryer at the stuff.

One thing I forgot to clarify is what could I use to color this material. The compound is drying to a sand color, not the grey that I was told. He said I could use anything but it should not contain water. Well, that leaves me thinking. Some of the material unavoidably got into the pores of the old brick. I'm hoping it will wire brush out when I'm done.

[Wash. state Desk Jet]

4. Well done! And thats the way you find out.,

There is concrete dye ,no doubt that will bring the color to what ever it is you want it to be. Black,red,gray what ever. Home depot where the concrete is.
You might just wait till the stuff cures to see what the final result will be. In other words it might turn gray. Or on the next batch mix in a little concrete color dye.

Good job ,and good luck with your project.

[yy4me]

5. Thanks for your encouragement and help. I am not usually

intimidated by projects but this one made me a little nervous because of the eventual use of the fireplace, which we had not used in 5 years. The brickmason we called, who restored the firebox years ago, has kept us waiting 5 years. I finally gave up. I am pleased with the way it has gone so far, and will wait until it is completed to see about the dye. I didn't know it existed. A few fires(in the fall) should color up a lot of it.

You have helped me before and its a good feeling. I try to pass any of my knowledge on. What comes around, goes around.

DUers are great, this place has become by best help and support and I am thankful.

[Wash. state Desk Jet]

6. You are very welcome always,

and thankyou for your comments. Keep up the good work !

[yy4me]

7. I'm going back to Home Depot today and, as nicely as possible

give them holy hell. I don't think I have ever spent so much time on a project, be pleased and then weeks later find out that the recommended material I used did not do the job. Remember my query into cement for the repair of the back wall of my kitchen fireplace?

Well, yesterday I decided to burn a lot of old, personal papers. It has been so cold around here that a small fire would be comfortable, I could just sit on the floor and feed paper into my little log fire. When the paper burning was done, I added a couple of small logs and enjoyed the atmosphere.

Holy Mackerel, when the fire had died and I got around to cleaning out the ash last night, all my patched area had blistered. The back looks like heck. The blisters are hard and hollow. I tried to poke one of them and the compound chunked off, leaving what looks like a crater.

The man at HD said this was just the stuff to use. Not only was he wrong but now I don't know what to do about it. I had a second tub of the stuff that has to go back. I don't even have my receipt any longer.

All that hard work for nothing. High heat Furnace Cement-forget about it.

I guess I have to chunk it all out If it will come off) and use something else.

[Wash. state Desk Jet]

8. Seems the stuff did not cure

did you wire brush by the way ? can you post up a picture of the damaged area, i believe you said old brick, is that correct? And is it correct some of the brick is deteriorating and some of the mortar, is that correct.? And as you mentioned the mixture turned out a different color than (it )said it would be ,than it was either improperly mixed or you got hold of a bad batch. What exactly is the extent of the damaged area ?

You do not have to have yer receipt to do a return at hd.

Contact the manufacturer by it's 800 number get hold of a rep. and ask about the discoloration of the mixture ,remember it did not darken as it should have. All indications are a bad batch or a bad mix.

And, you may very well be able to float over it. it may have been better mixing mortar and fixing it that way. And you can add red brick color dye to mortar. If I could see a pic no doubt I could tell you exact.

My guess is it is not nearly as bad as you think from the way you see it. Take a little simple green to the brick that is blackened unless the only area effected is the patched area. Before you return to home depot, contact the manufacturer ,get the information from the source first.And don't worry about the return, they will scan it and refund yer money, that's it,all there is to it.

Never except defeat.

My impulse is to drive over there and look it over myself, but of course that is not possible. At the same time, I know it is not as bad as you think !

Stand back a bit,take a breather, stick with it ,and readdress the problem. It is not uncommon for something to go wrong on the very first attempt ,we do not always get it right the first time when heading into uncharted waters. But we do learn by our mistakes. And everybody makes mistakes. Even product manufacturers. And sales Representatives are not above making mistakes or misrepresenting a product.
Can you post a pic ?

[yy4me]

9. Morning Ws DJ, You are my best adviser! I have calmed down

since yesterday but could not help looking again this AM. I wish I knew how to post a picture on DU but I don't. Have digital camera and am able to post pictures on things like Craigslist, which is quite simple but the Photobucket stuff is something I have never done.

The bubbles look like craters, one is about 2" in diameter, the others are nickel and dime size. The floor of the fireplace is not too bad, it is the back that looks like the dickens. The craters are hard and hollow. I poked at a couple and the bubble broke, leaving what looks like a big hollow blister.

I will call the mfgr this AM for advice. I'll be very interested in what they say. That would have been my plan before going to HD.

The brick around the damaged area is fine, most of the damage is in the mid section of the back where I put the compound. All the rest of the firebox is fine and it is very old brick. We had the fireplace fixed up and a damper put in 40 years ago by the towns most experienced brickmason. He does the work on all the old houses here.I know he used the correct brick.


I did brush the damaged areas before doing the work and vacuumed the dust up so that I was working with a clean surface. I repointed the areas where the mortar had come out and did the first application in the few areas where the brick had come out in chunks. Filled about half of it and waited over a week to finish. In the finishing process, and this was the hard part, I scored the lines of the brick into the patched area with this long,thin, flat tool that looks like a stiletto, but is rounded on the bottom. I was told that this was the purpose of the tool.

Anyway, it looked great, just sand colored brick. Except for the color, you would never think twice that it was a big patch. I just love redoing jobs that are really a professionals work but I waited 5 years at least and he has still not here. Plus, this was the least expensive way to do the job.

I'll fill you in after talking with the mfgr and, based on what they say, go to HD to return the stuff.

The joys of an old house, the work never ends. I would have preferred regular mortar but the HD fellow said this was just the stuff. Live and learn.

PS, I think todays project will be to learn how to post a pic on DU. Thanks for prompting me.

[yy4me]

10. Just got off the phone with the mfgr of the cement. Very helpful

to me and as you thought, he said the product did not cure. I told the fellow of my sequence and that it has been about 8 weeks from the date I did the work and that I did let the first application dry(I thought. He said that moisture was trapped behind the compound and that bubbled and caused the blisters. His suggestion was to scrape the blisters level and, if the surface is flat, just leave it.

He questioned the use of the compound and I told him how I came to use it. His thought was that I should have used mortar instead. What's done is done. I'll try to make it as smooth as possible. I'm still going to go to HD and suggest that they not recommend this product for small jobs like this one. The ease of use was nice but I'd have rather done it the hard way if I had known this would happen.

Best laid plans...and all that.

Thanks.

[yy4me]

11. First try-Photobucket . Complicated for a novice.

Deleted that because I didn't do something right.

trying again:

http://s667.photobucket.com/albums/vv39/yy4me_2009/

Geeze, that was an experience, Obviously I have to study the process a while. Is tinyurl any easier for a novice at this stuff?

PS, the picture of the real wall is in there in error but in care you are curious, It is the beginning of a repair of the 120 year old dry laid 9 foot wall at the rear of our back yard that collapsed this spring(They own it, not me)

[Wash. state Desk Jet]

12. Your on the right track

I suspected moisture caused the air pits and the blistering. I wanted you to do the research, /make the phone calls and find out what the facts are.You know;, when people pressure wash the exterior of the house before painting and do not let it dry completely,or when they just scrape and prime than paint, without checking for moisture, well the moisture gets trapped in behind the paint, and, you now know just what happens. It blisters and it pits.

OK , so now you have seen and experienced what happens. The learning experience will carry over and the next time you venture into uncharted waters, you will do the leg work, make phone calls and find out all you can first. OK, so if you had known more about the process of curing with that particular product, simply, it would have worked. ! And a bag of mortar, simply, would have worked. High heat patching compound/mortar, hay, toss up !

We must know the formulas for using the materials we choose to work with.
You done good, Now readdress the problem and get it good.

Good luck !
And keep up the good work.
The corrective measures you are fallowing through with now, will become a asset to you in future project planning.

[yy4me]

13. You are great, coming east for vacation? Free room and board

in exchange for advice. This old lady is on her own and is learning a lot of lessons the hard way.

Your comment about the paint is well taken, it just so happens that I have exterior painting to do too. I'll scrape to the second floor and get some big burly guy to go higher. At 67, I'm not as brave as I used to be. These projects were always a two-man effort. My late husband would give me the dickens if he knew what I was up to but money rules all right now.


Thanks for all your advice, the folks in your area are lucky to have your services.

[Wash. state Desk Jet]

14. As always you are very welcome !

And thanks for the invite ! Still have family back east, !
And, work it out on those pics. It recently came into my awareness about some of the most recent advances in latex paint, in fact exterior . I am looking at the American Tradition brand, still holds a high rating in consumer reports. This advancement has to do weather. In the northwest we have very much rain and little snow in the western parts of Washington. So you figure moisture and rain are a huge issue. This new paint allows you to paint when weather conditions are not friendly. Although that does not mean it's OK to seal the moisture in the wood behind the paint !~, As I have mentioned before, latex paint has come a long way, to the point where there is little and no reason to buy oil base paint anymore. I have been keeping up with the changes in paint since Bher was number one in consumer reports a very long time ago and of course before Bher cooperation sold name and all ,and their entire product line went straight to the bottom because they changed the ingredients and did not say so. Their stain became the worst of the worst. In fact Bher was sued by many unhappy campers that used that falsely number one rated exterior stain fer decks.

But that's not the point, the point is latex paint has gotten unbelievably better and better over the years. But, to keep up with it you must have some insight into what paint is the new wave and what company's operate under old hat ingredients. Example, I hate Sherwin Williams,or my painting compressor does. It' watery ! Requires I have a helper back roll. The self leveling latex based is very cool. And it is not just the acrylic /enamel they add in to it, there are other properties as well.

Anywhoooo, I'm always around. Administration will notify my email about privet mail.

Let me know how it goes and good luck !