JK co-sponsors Feingold Censure bill

[globalvillage]

On May 11, John Kerry became the fourth Senator to sign on to the censure bill.

more...


http://progressive.org/mag_wx051306b

[TayTay]

1. Good. Now what will the next big complaint be?

That was a big one on the DKos thread on Thursday.

Hmmm, Senator, you are too tall. Could you sort of hunch over os something. Those of us who are vertically challenged find the height enhanced somewhat intimidating. Fix that, okay?

[globalvillage]

2. "What took so long"?

"For all the good it will do."?
"Fuck censure, Impeach!"?

Whatever the issue is, and whatever he does about it, it won't be good enough for some.
But it is getting better, isn't it?

[globalvillage]

3. LOL

My first guess. Do I win something?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x2623690#2623705

[MH1]

6. What a ------

Non-expletive deleted because I know you all can fill in the blanks.

Seriously, there is probably a good answer to the delay. Two significant events now have brought the NSA program into stark significance - the nomination of Hayden and the revelation of the phone records spying.

I think it was the latter that really did it. Also, it may be that the actual getting one's name to show in Thomas as a cosponsor was seen as a triviality, until he got beat up on dailykos about it. If Feingold and everyone else in DC knew he agreed to support it, maybe he saw no urgency to execute the formality to get it in the books. However it was just made abundantly clear to him that there are folks out here who really do look things up on Thomas, and having it reflected there would have sure saved a lot of air on that diary.

Of course, it could really have been the revelation about the phone records. That shows that the program scope is much more than initially realized.

[globalvillage]

7. I think he answered it the same day he signed on

Enough is Enough.

Another thread asked "What is you tipping point?" I'm sure JK hit his long ago, but revelations the most recent bush* abuse of the Constitution may have done it. Also, Pelosi said this week they would not impeach. Was he waiting?

Or maybe he was just listening to us. He's good at that.

Whatever it was, I'm glad he did it.

[karynnj]

20. You guys were incredible on that thread

Of all the people who could scare her, it's Kerry????

[JohnKleeb]

23. Yeah hahhahaa and you were prophetic

These peawits with their knowledge should know that Kerry couldn't even lead an impeachment of Bush if he wanted to. Since the house does the impeachment and the Senate votes to remove from office.

[ProSense]

5. Exactly!

Frankly, I'm glad he quelled that noise. It still doesn't change my opinion that this administration should be investigated for crimes. The current censure resolution doesn't even address the illegal spying. IMO, reprimanding Bush for warrantless spying is weak! I don't give a shit if he admits and apologizes!

Fiengold's recent statement: I am unaware of this program, and Congress needs to find out exactly what the Administration is doing and whether it is legal.

http://feingold.senate.gov/~feingold/statements/06/05/20060511NSA.html


Fuck censure! Impeach this bastard.

[sandnsea]

8. "quelled the noise"

I'd bet that was it, remove obstacles so people will buy what they need to buy, which is that it's time to scream.

I think the original plan was to make the censure completely non-partisan. The "maverick" Russ Feingold was supposed to lead on the censure because he's the one that voted no on the Patriot Act but yes on nominations, etc. I think they all thought censure would be taken seriously if proposed that way. Feingold said he wanted it to be non-partisan, IIRC. Kerry co-sponsoring would have let the media turn it into a sour grapes Bush bash. That's the same reason Pelosi asked Murtha to lead on the war by himself, so the media couldn't turn it into partisan Bush bashing. She was right on the money with that one and the left STILL doesn't get it.

The politics behind Kerry signing on now, no clue. Either he realized saying he supported it wasn't enough for the lefty loons, or Feingold realized his censure wasn't going to go anywhere without some real muscle behind it, or Kerry muscled Feingold into letting him sign on, or Feingold welcomed Kerry's co-sponsor, or it's just the right time in order to move it forward.

I just wish the rest of the party would realize that people are getting madder by the minute and it's time to stand up and lay out the case against Bush AND Republican policies in general. If we really go into a depression with the dollar dropping, the Democrats are going to be blamed too because they haven't been fighting hard enough.

[karynnj]

21. Or that in Kerry's opinion the events that have happened

have led to him feeling that there is an open and shut case that Bush willingly, arrogantly violated the law without even trying to do something legal. When he was proscecutor, he fought cases when he had all his ducks in a row - he wasn't a person who would grandstand arguing a case that was shaky, he was a very serious, diligent lawyer.

[sandnsea]

22. Entirely possible

Like I said, I've got no clue why he decided to sign on now. I do remember when Feingold proposed the censure he said he wanted it to be nonpartisan. That's the same language Boxer used with the electoral college vote, the same strategy used with Murtha. So I think that's why there wasn't a lot of co-sponsors to start on the censure, they wanted it that way.

Exactly why Kerry decided to go ahead and co-sponsor now, I've got no clue. A whole bunch of possibilities, I don't think the circumstances surrounding Bush have changed all that much in the last few weeks.

[Island Blue]

9. The next complaint will probably be

"He didn't sign it before he signed it."

[MH1]

4. Thanks so much for posting this! It sure came in handy here:

http://www.dailykos.com/comments/2006/5/12/85957/4132/30#c30

(click on "View Story" to see the mis-informed diatribe I was replying to.)

[WildEyedLiberal]

10. Whoop de do

Now when is Feingold going to sign the DSM letter?

That's my new response to this shit.

[beachmom]

11. Well, I suppose we could look for everytime Feingold has a

post on dKos, and then flame away, DEMANDING Feingold co-sponsor Kerry's X, Y, and Z bills along with DSM, and so on and so forth, and until he does "we're not talking to him".

Frankly, I hope to God he didn't co-sponsor because of those Kossak retards. I think it's wrong to reward ignorance and disrespect. But maybe, he was also receiving calls from constituents, which WOULD make more sense. Or like all of you said, perhaps it was the phone records story that pushed him over the edge.

I'm not a big fan of this censure thing. Like WEL said before, it's just red meat for the base that in the end, changes nothing. But whatever, I suppose it's a start.

[MH1]

12. He had already decided to support it

and said so publicly, and Feingold had publicly thanked him.

He may have just been lackadaisical about getting his name put on it, or maybe there was a significant reason like the phone records, but I don't think the crap at dailykos caused him to do anything he wasn't already planning to do. At most it encouraged him to knock it off the list instead of putting it off.

[_dynamicdems]

13. I honestly think he waited to sign so as to let Russ have the spotlight on

this. John Kerry is more well-known and more a national figure and he didn't want to steal the thunder from Senator Feingold. That is such a Kerry thing to do. He said right from the beginning he supported RUSS and his office confirmed it from day one. That is the key: he supported Senator Feingold on Senator Feingold's bill. But he let the bill be firmly associated with Russ Feingold before he signed so as not to co-opt it. He was being a friend and it wouldn't surprise me one bit if this wasn't discussed between the two of them previously. Russ was right there (one of the first) to support JK after his speech on Iraq.

To be sure, the individuals involved know more about it than do a bunch of whiners in the blogosphere. Senators discuss these things and they plan. The bunch of wet-behind-the-ears losers on KOS simply have no clue what goes on behind closed doors when senators talk and they certainly are not going to be privy to Democratic strategy.

[JI7]

14. awwwww, too bad for the phony asses who don't really care for this

other than to use it to bash Kerry.

[JI7]

15. btw, i hope Kerry isn't taking those phony asses too seriously

[MH1]

16. I'm sure he's not, but even in idiocy a point can be made.

Many people are turning away from the MSM. Even I didn't know that Feingold had praised Kerry on one of the pundit shows for supporting the censure motion, until another person posted that info. But I had looked it up in thomas and seen that Kerry wasn't listed as a cosponsor. Even though I knew Kerry had come out in support, it wasn't the same as actually cosponsoring - even though I think that 99% of the public couldn't care less. It's true that the vast majority of Americans have no clue that thomas even exists or how to use it, let alone the interest to use it. But if you assume that people who post on political blogs are influencers of political opinion in their circles, and you come to realize that these people are relying on info from authoritative sources (i.e. thomas) rather than unreliable sources (pundits), then it's time to make sure the authoritative sources are updated to reflect what you are supporting.

All that may have had nothing to do with this particular instance. But hopefully the point was made, if it was needed, that the formal act of cosponsorship is important for high-profile issues.

[ProSense]

19. Here is Kerry on MTP, April 9

MR. GONZALES: The president has the constitutional authority to make the decision as to what, what is in that national interest of the country.

REP. NADLER: For whatever reason he feels like.

MR. GONZALES: He has the authority under the Constitution to make that determination.

REP. NADLER: OK.

(End videotape)

RUSSERT: Do you agree with that legal reasoning?

SEN. KERRY: I think it’s time for the attorney general to start standing up and protecting the Constitution and the country, and not the politics of this administration. The fact is, on, you know—I mean, on one side, this is the first evidence we’ve had that the president was actually in the White House loop. On the second side, it is wrong for the president of the United States, who has the right, obviously, to declassify material, to declassify it selectively in order to buttress phony arguments to go to war, and not declassify the counter arguments. And it is wrong for the president to do it in a way that attacks people politically. That’s what this was for. This was not a declassification in order to really educate America. This was a declassification order to mislead America, in order to mislead them about that yellow cake from Nigeria, the uranium material, and in order to buttress their phony argument about the war. And I think it’s a disgrace. The fact is...

MR. RUSSERT: But it’s not—it’s not illegal.

SEN. KERRY: Well, the president has the right, obviously, to declassify. Whether he has the right to declassify for these kinds of political purposes, I don’t know. Let me read you what his father said. Do you know what his father said? George Herbert Walker Bush said in 1991 at the dedication of the George Bush CIA headquarters, he said, “Even though I’m a tranquil guy now at this stage of my life, I have nothing but contempt and anger for those who betray the trust by exposing the name of our sources. They are, in my view, the most insidious of traitors.”

MR. RUSSERT: But there’s no one suggesting...

SEN. KERRY: George Herbert Walker—no.

MR. RUSSERT: ...there’s no one suggesting that President Bush revealed the name...

SEN. KERRY: No, absolutely nothing. But one thing led to another, Tim. This administration did reveal the name. We know repeatedly now from the Fitzpatrick documents that not only Scooter Libby but Karl Rove and others told the name to people. They were using the name, and, and I’m—I just think all Americans are tired of this. We now have evidence in a court in San Francisco that documents show that they were eavesdropping through I think it was AOL, that they were getting into American accounts. So there’s now evidence, not just of foreign eavesdropping surveillance, but of domestic eavesdropping surveillance on a blanket basis.

MR. RUSSERT: Senator Russ Feingold, your Democratic colleague from Wisconsin, said the president should be censured for his eavesdropping program because he did not seek authority that Feingold insists is demanded by statute. Would you vote to censure President Bush?

SEN. KERRY: Yes.

MR. RUSSERT: What would be the penalty?

SEN. KERRY: The penalty is the censure itself, is the reprimand by the United State Congress for action that is inappropriate.

MR. RUSSERT: Did he violate the Constitution?

SEN. KERRY: He violated the law, in my judgment.

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/12169680

[zann725]

17. The point IS: He did. Now there's four...

Tomorrow...more...and more.

Several states have also begun or approved their own Impeachment proceedings against the Admin. Things are snowballing.

JK's also done some mighty good speeches lately, particularly to Students, urging Truth to Authority.

I'm happy with the Man...'human' at times though he may be.

[ProSense]

18. Kerry's move did put it back in the news

Kerry adds support to Feingold's censure measure

May 14, 2006 (WASHINGTON) - Wisconsin Senator Russ Feingold's measure to censure President Bush has gained a third supporter.

Massachusetts Senator John Kerry has officially signed on to the bill. He joins fellow Democrats Tom Harkin from Iowa and Barbara Boxer from California as co-sponsors.

It's unclear whether the Judiciary Committee will ever bring up the censure proposal for a vote.

Kerry initially held off on supporting the measure. He said the president should be held accountable but Kerry wanted to make sure a censure was the best way to do it.

Feingold introduced the resolution in March to censure Bush for authorizing domestic eavesdropping and misleading Americans about its legality.

Republican opponents have dismissed the resolution as political grandstanding and say it would only weaken the presidency.

http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=local&id=4171103

Of course, the media's spin is that he's just supporting it even though he announced support for it on television. Also, they are trying to spin it as "the best way." Hardly, Kerry has been and is still calling for a full investigation.