How much harder will it be to take what folks say about Kerry

[LittleClarkie]

now that we have confirmation that who we THOUGHT he was, is who he IS.

(gads, that's badly worded, innit.)

How much harder will it be to defend him in a civil manner now that we, esp. those in the Boston contingent, KNOW we are right about him?

Or will it be about the same?

For me, I look at some comments and think "you have no FUCKING idea who this man is -- and you don't even know that you don't know."

Militant ignorance is what I call that. "I dunno, and I'm not gonna find out, either."

So, does it make a difference, esp. to the level of civility you will be able to maintain?

Or is it a dumb question?

[Vektor]

1. It's a great question. I think it will be EASIER to defend him now....

because I will have the further conviction of knowing that I saw for myself what he was like and my words will ring even truer, and I will speak them with greater confidence.

I noticed a HUGE change in the attitude of the Republicans I work with who often tease me for loving Kerry so much when I brought the pics of us at the party to work and showed them. More on that later, but in a nutshell, I could see in their faces and the things they said that they saw him as a human being for the very first time.

I planted a seed.

[emulatorloo]

10. would love to hear about yr co-workers reactions - Please post when you

get a chance.

Bush campaign was all about demonizing and dehumanizing Kerry, and the same thing appears to be going on w the more negative DU'ers.

[jenndar]

2. None.

Every time I'm reminded what we're fighting for, it makes it that much easier.

[karynnj]

3. I actually think it will be easier

In addition to all the clues that he really is the man his closest friends say he is, there are 12 people who I have never met but who I feel I know and trust who all came away with more faith in him then they likely ever thought possible. When you think about it, that's pretty amazing.

I had always heard that it is dangerous to meet your heros (or idols) because there is no way they can live up to your imagined version of who they are and it's just not fair to them. From the comments of the people who went, Teresa and John Kerry were incredibly nice people - which is very consistent with things that they are known to have done. They are just good people, pure and simple.

Kerry, unlike any of his competitors last time or next time (except to a degree Hillary, who will be in history books as a first lady) is the only one who is already an important figure in our history - whether it's written that way or not. If the country ends its about 30 year swing to the right, Kerry may be seen as someone who tried to keep them honest and who by exposing things as he did, kept thinks from getting worse. Even if he's never President (which cheats us and him), he has lived a very good live and has done much good.

- The RW hate him because he helped push Congress to end the funding for the Vietnam war. This likely did end the war faster and it was simply killing people in a stalemate situation. He also was one of the people fighting to get care for the veterans, recognition of agent orange and PTSD - that some of these veterans hate him is ignorance.

-Would the Contras have halted cocaine shipments to the US if Kerry didn't expose them (no one else was brave enough to investigate), The availability of cheap crack cocaine destroyed people. Oddly, Kerry's halting this flow may have helped NYC as much as Guiliani's crack down. Think how many fewer babies were born with crack in their system, how many grownups didn't destroy their lives. (Not to mention, it helped stop atrocities in Central America.) Kerry never won any large amount of praise - but he literally saved lives here and in Central America.

-BLM has explained how his BCCI hearing closed down a terrorist bank - which probably set them back. If the rest of the government or even just the Democrats followed him, he would have done more.

- Even in the Iraq situstion, recently there has been talk of the Iraqis taking over the positions that we had in policing. According to Bush this was in the plan they had written in 2003, but oddly the author was only hired last June. This is not a unique idea - Kerry quotes it as something the millitary agrees with him on - but it's likely that Kerry selling the idea led to it suddenly being a Bush idea. Now if only Bush could co-opt a few more Kerry ideas.

The fact that he's the most inspiring speaker of his generation (including Bill Clinton), a brilliant strategist and diplomat, a very honest, trustwiotrthy good person would have been enough - but that he is friendly, funny and charming on top of it is just extra. (It also explains the people who said part of his problem is that people are jealous.) Not to mention as a bonus we get Teresa as a first lady.

[ProSense]

4. Easier in terms of how he relates to people.

because I can point to the excellent personal accounts and the few news stories that contracdict the media's portrayal. On his record, the facts already speak volumes.

[whometense]

5. It will be

easier to defend him, but much harder to bear the insults that are incessantly hurled at him.

I speak from experience on this.

[WildEyedLiberal]

6. Yeah, I'm with you

A particularly vile post today shot my blood pressure into the danger zone and left my stomach twisting with rage. These vile chickenshit bottom-feeding cockroaches who sit behind the anonymity of their keyboards and DARE to question the courage of someone who has stared death, and evil, in the FACE on a damn regular basis can go FUCK THEMSELVES. I swear to God, I'm glad I believe in a hell. It was made for spineless, weak, backstabbing pieces of shit like them. I hope they get everything that's coming to them and more. Pathetic shitstains. They make me VIOLENT - it's like Vektor's black rage.

I'd sure like one of them to have the balls to say that shit to JK's FACE. Of course, they'd sooner put their tail between their legs and piss their pants and cry than actually say that shit to his face. Their mouth is writing checks their ass can't cash, and BOY would I love to cash it for them.

[beachmom]

7. For me, it will be easier, especially in regards to his character.

Unlike many of you, I'm what you call a "baby Kerry supporter". I have come to this party way late in the game, and really have learned more about him after the election than before. To be honest I am now ashamed that I didn't do more to help him get elected like all of you did, and as much as I would have loved to have gone to Boston with you guys, I don't think I deserve a sit down with JK -- so many others deserve that before me. This is why, KG, I haven't filled out your questionaire because I am embarrassed by how little I have been a help to the Cause. But I can't go back to fix that, so now I am more motivated than ever to help him in any way that I can.

The thing is is that when you are ignorant of all things Kerry (which I was and most of the country still is) you are more likely to buy all of the bad things said about him, especially when it comes to character which is not an exact science. So even though I was defending him, I would read one negative thing after another (esp. on Kos), and sort of think, well, gee, maybe they know something I don't know. Maybe he isn't that nice a guy, and is only doing things for himself. Then I would tell myself: no, go with your first instinct that says he is the "Real Deal", a politician who thinks of others, and would never betray "the people" for personal ambition or gain. Yet, still, there were lingering doubts, since I don't know him. But an accumulation of evidence has been gathering that continues to renew my faith, and now that this special day in Boston has happened, all doubt is gone. Doubt takes up precious time and energy, you know. When all doubt has been lifted, then your mind can clearly focus on the issue at hand and defense of his character is easy. I still remember Whometense writing that impassioned statement of Kerry on dailykos, and Armando being completely blown away by her statement. I think we shouldn't insult other bloggers, but just figure that they have believed the lies and propaganda, and need to be gently told the truth with passion. Not everyone will believe us, but some may change their minds, and who knows how wonderful an effect it will have on the lurkers.

And just one question to the Boston group: can we use your "A beer with John Kerry" story? I'm not talking about what was said, but simply the fact that he took time out from his family to come see you, and was really fun, smart, considerate, down to earth, et al. Or would you prefer that that story just stay in this forum? Because to be honest, I propose we start a whisper campaign about what a great guy he is on a personal level. We always hear about the Republicans starting negative whisper campaigns that are usually of a personal nature often spread through the College Republicans (and IMO, through the military). Well why not a positive whisper campaign that we can fan through the country? Just a thought. Let me know what you think.

[rox63]

8. I don't have a problem with it

But I don't know what the rest of the group that was there thinks. We might have to craft the story a certain way, so as to bring out the best points, without saying anything that canb be twisted the wrong way. The fact that he came out to visit with us on his birthday (apart from the fundraiser and the 'official' party) just blew me away.

[globalvillage]

9. The e-mail I sent to my family was titled

"On Having a Beer with John Kerry".
They knew about the party, but the bar story blew them away. Provided there are no details of the conversations, I don't see a problem with it. How cool is a Senator who takes the time, on his birthday, to hang out at a bar with his supporters? Even the wingnuts can't twist that one (she said with some trepidation).

[whometense]

11. I don't have a problem with it either.

Considering that if he wears his corduroys instead of jeans there will be somebody out there slamming him for not being a "man of the people" or some such rubbish, just telling how wonderful he was to us can't hurt his image.

[TayTay]

12. Put this in too! (For people at this forum after 12/3/04)

We talked about this last weekend as well. We all deride the state of discussion about Sen. Kerry in the media and about how many people write awful things about him on dKos and DU. But, you know, there are a lot of defenders out there as well. That's because this good man touched their hearts.

So go ahead, put in the story about 'having a beer with John Kerry.' It was a fun moment and very humanizing. But I also had a beer with man who went through a lot last year and whose family went through a lot last year. I had a beer with a man who was personally demonized in a 'whatever it takes' way by these horrible greedy thugs who are running this country right now. And I had a beer with a man who responded, after that crushing loss and the brickbats thrown by fair-weather friends after the election by doing this three weeks after that election loss:

What John Kerry did today

www.dailykos.com/story/2004/12/2/213925/009 (Cut and paste into a new browser, per Ray's instructions.)

He didn't go away and spend three months navel-gazing about the loss at the some beach resort and lock himself away from all the pain and such. He went on. He is still there, fighting. And damn it, that means something. That's why so many of us are still here and why we get so mad about all the comments. Cuz we know how special this was and is and will be.

So tell the story about having a beer. It adds another piece of the jigsaw puzzle that the media just wants to sweep off the table. But, do me a favor, and add this piece in too! Cuz, it is also another incredible insight into this incredible man. There is a whole picture there and it just amazes and comforts me.

[StoryTeller]

13. Yeah, what Beachmom said!

Beachmom, your story sounds very similar to mine. When I first heard John Kerry was going to run for president, I got him confused for a moment with our former Nebraska senator Bob Kerrey. I had no idea who the guy was--never heard of him before. We learned as much as we could about him before the election--enough to know we wanted to vote for him. But we didn't help out in any way. And I wish we had.

I had a "rotten, horrible, no-good, very bad day" yesterday, and in the evening, I read Vektor's very moving story about what JK has meant to her, and I felt a bit discouraged. I'm really a pretty idealistic person by nature, but I've been so incredibly cynical about politics for most of my adult life. (And before I was an adult, I was too busy reading books to care about the "outside world.") JK is really the first person in government that I think I can trust and who really appears to be in it for the common good. And I feel like I missed my chance to support this ethical, integrity-rich person.

And then I wonder what I could have done anyway. And then I wonder if it would even matter. I mean, even a really, really good president can't work miracles. (And this is coming from a person of faith!) :) And I wonder at this deep cynicism in me--where did it come from, and how can I pull it out by the roots...because I do not admire it in myself.

I'm still working on discovering what I feel God wants my level of political involvement to be, and what variety of activities. Partly because of my upbringing, partly because of my own temperament, I've never had any heroes. I tend to be too aware of how utterly fallable we humans all are, and so I try not to put any of us up on pedestals. So I don't think I will ever be comfortable feeling as passionate about a public figure like Vektor does about JK. But I am hoping that, in spite of the odds, I get a second chance to support him and show how much it means to me to know that there are people like him in our government.

I read a book once that was about the biblical Martha (sister to Mary and Lazarus, and friend of Jesus) called I CAME TO LOVE YOU LATE. Though I definitely don't see JK as a sort of messiah figure--my loyalty to JC makes me a "one-savior kind of gal"--the title sums up how I feel about JK. I came to love him late, and that makes me glad and sad all at once.