Kerry: The first 2004 prez candidate to make Doonesbury

[elshiva]

Dennis Kucinich making a late showing yesterday:


But Kerry made it in 1971!


Sexy even as a cartoon character...

[ginnyinWI]

1. lol

That is so cool! :)

[elshiva]

2. Yes it is cool!

Actually it's a serial with Kerry in it for four more strips. I think that one (the first one) is the only one online. They were all kind of riffs on the whole "Kerry is obssessed with himself" vibe, but the whole Doonesbury strip was against Nam. It ended with a twist: B.D. questioning Kerry at a talk about why Kerry threw away his ribbons with B.D. claiming it was unpatriotic. I like B.D. always conservative but goodhearted even at those stupid freep moments. Of course B.D.'s an amputee now...:cry:

[ginnyinWI]

3. I've only seen that first one

Maybe if I did some digging I could find the rest. I've liked Doonsbury for years.

[TayTay]

4. Lord, how many famous people went to Yale in the mid-60's?

Geez, there were a lot of folks there then who are influential now.

[elshiva]

6. Howard Dean went to Yale too. Trudeau is a Yalie.

[ginnyinWI]

13. Yale aims at turning out leaders

I can see that they do-- some very NICE ones. ;)

[ginnyinWI]

16. I googled Yale and found a list

of celebs who attended Yale:

http://www.amiannoying.com/(g2utn545wp54y5afgpbxek45)/collection.aspx?collection=642

Jomentum did, and Bob Woodward, Ron Reagan Jr, etc

edit: stupid link won't work--you'd have to go there then search for Yale, then History-Education. oh well!

[elshiva]

17. Except

for Dubya :(

[ginnyinWI]

20. yeah, also

Poppy, and Grand-Poppy! :(

[elshiva]

21. Yes! Damn it!

[elshiva]

5. Here is the bibliographic info:

This was printed in a Doonesbury book:

Trudeau, G.B. "The President Is a Lot Smarter Than You Think" New York: Holt, Rinehart, and Winston, 1973.

I found it a used book store.

[ginnyinWI]

7. thanks! n/t

[elshiva]

8. You are welcome! I love your sig line!

[ginnyinWI]

10. ha--I just changed it tonight--you can thank the speaker--JK

I guess I should go back and attribute it to him.

[elshiva]

12. Yeah, I knew it was JK! Thanks JK! Silly stuff...

[LittleClarkie]

24. I thought it was cute the first time one of BD's men came to see him

and he asked "You can't take your eyes off it, can you." The soldier replied something like "You have hair!"

In thirty years, we'd never seen that man's hair. He's quite fetching without the football helmet.

I thought Trudeau did a pretty good job of humanizing BD after that, and even Boopsie, which I didn't think was possible. Suddenly she's quite serious.

Gary does a good job all the way around. I think he tries to be non-partisan, and so went after the Waffler too, but his best stuff is still under the Republican presidents.

[BlueIris]

9. I always thought Trudeau was very mean to Kerry.

Even though he managed to draw him attractively. Have you seen the one in which he characterizes Kerry as a "self-glorifying preppy"? Not nice.

[LittleClarkie]

11. Oh yeah,

"You're really clicking tonight, you gorgeous preppy!" with his arms up.

I guess he figured since he was a fellow Yale guy. He is a Yale guy, isn't Trudeau?

[elshiva]

14. Yes! Yes! Gorgeous Preppy he is, too!

Trudeau is a Yalie.

[LittleClarkie]

18. Here's a link to a couple more

including the BD one. From Slate.

http://www.doonesbury.com/strip/kerry_faq.html

[elshiva]

19. These are the ones! Thank YOU, LittleClarkie!

[ginnyinWI]

23. hmm, let's see now

Gorgeous Preppy...

<img src="" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">

Check!

[europegirl4jfk]

25. Curious

Is there a story going along with this picture? He looks really... wet. LOL Do you know what happened to him?

[karynnj]

26. There is a story

It is a picture from his first wedding taken by his friend, George Butler. Several of Kerry's friends threw him into a pond. (Weird that no one looks particularly surprised in the picture.) I'm amazed that he still looks neatly dressed and his hair looks good, when he's obiously quite wet.

[ginnyinWI]

28. yes--

He had just gotten married to his first wife, Julia, and his buddies got him and threw him into a pond!

edit: sometimes I answer posts from the list, before I check the thread itself--didn't see that Karen had already answered the question! We got our stories straight anyway! :)

[europegirl4jfk]

30. Thanks Karen and Ginny...

...for sharing this funny story. That must have been a crazy wedding. LOL

[ginnyinWI]

22. I wouldn't guess he meant it maliciously,

and I don't think he did. Also JK wasn't running for office at that time, or anything, so it was harmless. Not the same as the bloodthirsty repubs we have today in campaigning, that's for sure.

[elshiva]

15. Yes and No.

Although critizes him here is last conversation of the serial
JK: "My Friends, this war has costed us billions of dollars and thousands of lives! Wasted! All wasted!

B.D.: You Flaming Hypocrite!

How can you moralize after throwing all your medals on the capitol steps last spring!

Do you have any idea how much those medals cost the government?

----
Spaces indicate change in cells. I think the first line is good and sounds Kerry-like.

[karynnj]

27. He actually seems jealous of Kerry

Other than the frame where Kerry is supposed to be thinking he's a gorgeous preppy, even the use of the Love story line is pro-Kerry. BD's criticism has to be perceived as vapid - and the look drawn on Kerry's face is sort of bemused.

In virtually every article on the protests, Kerry was described as clean cut, handsome, polite, well mannered as a contrast to the long haired hippies, who implicitly were not. His eloquence was noted even by those who disliked him, even the Nixon people said he looked like a Kennedy and talked like a Kennedy. He clearly became a star overnight. With this background, it's not surprising if Trudeau hypothesized that Kerry was aware that he was a gorgeous preppy.

In fact, it may be O'Neil's resentment that he looked like a poorly dressed, short nerd next to the impeccably dressed gorgeous preppy who similarly outclassed him in intelligence, personality, and eloquence that cause him to still hate Kerry.

[ginnyinWI]

29. you may have something there

If I were a guy back then around that same age, I'd have been envious of Kerry. And O'Neill was short, scrawny and kind of wimpy looking. A little twirp, we'd have said then. And here comes Kerry, tall, dark and handsome, who can speak eloquently, and has natural grace, charm and good breeding, a natural leader, went to Yale--how could he not be envious? And you can almost read that on his face on the Cavett show--that defensiveness and resentment is more than about the military. If looks could kill....

And I think it may have worked against JK at times in his life. People might have decided he was just a pretty face, someone who had slid by in life with his looks and manners. They assume that he could not have been a hero in combat--it goes against the stereotype of the elite preppy. He could not have become a good prosecuter or Senator on his merits--he must have had connections like * had with his daddy's friends. So creeps like Rush Limbaugh can come along and take advantage of people's misperceptions.

[LittleClarkie]

32. How do I put this

O'Neill came of as sort of a ... well, jag, I guess it the word. I can't describe it. His whole demeanor was like some junior executive ankle biter.

I loved the whole "Geneva Convention. Heard of it?" smartass exchange from the Dick Cavett segment. Kerry's trying to talk facts, while O'Neill is just being an attack dog. Kerry wasn't terribly pleased by the end at not being able to talk issues, but having to defend himself against O'Neill's half truths instead. The allegations haven't changed much either, have they. Same shit, different day. O'Neill sure wasn't there an honest discussion.

I wish we still had shows like that.

[karynnj]

33. I loved that exchange as well

When he said "Geneva Convention. Heard of it", I loved the face he was made. Kerry had so much presence and O'Neil had none. Even on little things, O'Neil came in and sat down, Kerry walked over, shook hands with Cavett and exchanged greetings - O'Neil had to know he was outclassed. The audience was so on Kerry's side it was funny.

Before asking the question about war crimes, O'Neil was almost smirking. I think he thought he was pushing Kerry into a corner, where he would either have to admit to things he personally did or to back away from his assertions that what people were being asked to do were wrong. I admired Kerry's answer in that he was not excluding himself, but taking responsibility. What's strange is that O'Neil's response seemed to reject that these were war crimes - and gave me the impression that these things were routine, proving Kerry's point.

O'Neil is supposedly intelligent, but I think what he missed was the entire concept of morality and personal responsibility. I think you're right that he also didn't want to talk about issues. In one of the clips, Kerry was trying to explain that the mission that Kerry was there for ended shortly after Kerry returned home - so O'Neil wasn't even doing the same thing. (they were later going out less in safer places.)

I loved the Dick Cavett show. It was so much more sophisticated and interesting than ay of the shows now. It's hard to believe with over 100 channels, there are none that carry that kind of conversation. A few years ago, My husband, kids and I saw him in the Broadway version of Rocky Horror - he had a small speaking only part. My oldest daughter had wanted to see it because Joan Jett played one of the parts.

[CBHagman]

37. Love your description of O'Neill, Little Clarkie

"His whole demeanor was like some junior executive ankle biter."

O'Neill is a type who most of us have been unfortunate enough to run into, whether it's during rush week at university or by the water cooler in the break room. The phrase "sold his soul" comes to mind.

[BlueIris]

31. I really love Kerry Vs. O'Neill.

That's JK at his best. Surly, yet charming, sincere and convicing. Rhetorically, he is very spritely. I thought that was the attitude we saw in the first presidential debate last fall.

[TayTay]

34. It is a real pleasure to see him in full debate mode

He is quite nimble on his feet and very, very intelligent. He is able to parry questions back quickly and comes across as a master of his subjects. I have seen him debate many times over the years and he is usually pretty good.

He had 8 debates with Gov. Bill Weld in that '96 Senate race. (Can you imagine 8 debates with *. He would have been a drooling idiot by the end of that. Well, I mean even more so.)

I can see from the Cavett Show that he had the skill at the beginning of his public career. I think he got better. I am truly hoping that the national Dems find a way of bringing this skill out a bit more. I think Kerry has warmed up as a public speaker (oh no, not that debate again!) and has become more interactive and accessible with an audience. (There, is that okay?)

[BlueIris]

35. Yes, totally. When I think "podium" and "Kerry" I also think:

more, please. Hear that, DNC?

[WildEyedLiberal]

36. That's funny

When I hear "Kerry" I think, more please.

:evilgrin:

[elshiva]

38. Yes!

:evilgrin: