Religious Fanaticism

[hyphenate]

Let me start by saying right off the bat that I am not religious to any major extent. I started out Catholic, endured the years of catechism and sunday school, got communion, got confirmed and then promptly said hasta la vista to the church when I was old enough to get out of it.

Through the years since then, I've spent most of my time questioning the church and its place in people's lives, and have come to the conclusion that organized religion is something which is just not my thing. I have since maintained only tenuous ties to any kind of religion, preferring to think in more secular terms, and I refuse to believe in a god in any way that connects to a particular religion. I find way too much hypocrisy in many groups of faith, especially now with the radical religious right.

Dispensing of all that, now, let me finish my story. My best friend in all the world has, in the past ten years, become evangelical, bordering on complete fanaticism. This woman, who I love dearly, went from some mild interest in the fundie and evangelical religious world to a full blown fanatic. She is a teacher with an MA in education, who works with disturbed and problem children in the school system, and who has her hands full with these kids. It doesn't help that her mom, who recently passed away at 85, was on a serious decline for the past couple of years, and that now my friend is alone in the big house, and is already in the midst of a great depression mentally. But now, add to that a woman who now believes not only to the rapture, but to creationism, the prophecies that we're closing in on the apocalypse, that secret societies really run the world, and any other horseshit which the fundies and evagelicals toss around. Add to that a woman who used to have common sense, but who now boasts three religious tattoos on her body--one on her wrist, one on her ankle, and a brand-new one on her neck. I was quite shocked when I saw that today after not seeing her for two weeks.

I know her mom's death has been very difficult to deal with, and that her faith has helped her deal with the loss. I understand that. I also understand her need to put her focus on something that lifts her spirit. But I fail to comprehend how anyone gets to the fanaticism stage where she is willing to put that kind of a statement on her body in such a manner. I also get annoyed when she tries to indoctrinate me into the fantasy world in which she lives. I don't mind people believing in whatever they want to believe as long as they let me do the same. But it is hardly easy to maintain my distance when all I listen to is her near idol worship of the Xtian faith in such a way that it's obviously she's gone overboard.

I get very exasperated at her. I don't love her any less, but I have a lot of frustration in being unable to tell her how much all her religiosity is driving me crazy!!

Anyone have any ideas on what I can do or say? I would never want to hurt her feelings, regardless of any other factor. We've already gone through the "topics we won't discuss" part, but it still pops up regardless. I think if there is no other solution, I guess I will simply just avoid talking about it completely in view of other topics of discussion. I guess I'd rather do that than lose my best friend.

[trotsky]

1. A fundie with tattoos?

I thought they looked down on tattoos.

Sorry to hear about her, though. Sounds like she might be one of the lost causes - just in too far to bring back.

One thing you can try is to pick just one aspect of her beliefs, and constantly question it. Point out inconsistencies. Steer her towards articles and essays that espouse a different point of view. Just keep exposing her to other opinions, as gently as you can. The key goal here, of course, is to get her to take a step back and critically analyze her beliefs. With a fundie, they've thrown up a big wall around everything and so if you can get them to question just one thing, the potential is there to knock the whole thing down.

[GOPFighter]

2. I hear ya'

My wife is convinced that every good thing that happens to her is the result of God watching out for her and blessing her. She never tires of telling me either. :shrug:
She has a Masters in Accounting and is a brilliant woman otherwise.

I agree with Trotsky. If she insists on talking about religion, just mention the inconsistencies in her religion that bother you and keep encouraging her to examine her religion rationally. She will either begin to come around or will eventually quit talking religion.

I think the current religious fanaticism we're seeing in America is just a temporary phase that will eventually wither away, hopefully soon. Like everything else, success breeds contempt.

[progressoid]

3. I hope she's not too far gone.

I think a major hurdle to overcome is her depression. Has she been treated for this? If not, perhaps start there. Seems like she may be "faith-based" medicating.

Also, it may be easier on your freindship to attack the support system rather than her beliefs. Where is she getting these ideas? She obviously didn't come to this point on her own. You may have to treat this like cult deprogramming by interupting the supply of misinformation.

[beam me up scottie]

4. Do you know if someone

or perhaps a group of people have been "helping" your friend move in this direction?

[immoderate]

5. I'd point out that I can't live with the contradictions.

It's OK for others, but not for me.

I accept that everybody has their craziness, but then there's real craziness where some intervention is needed. How to know? :shrug:

BTW, I think it's the old testament that forbids tattoos, along with pork and shellfish, etc.

--IMM

[fshrink]

6. Your friend has "decompensated"

The death of her mother has exceeded the load she was able to handle through a certain psychological organization. In my experience, cases such as your friend's often result from a large amount of guilt when unconscious death wishes come true. Delusional constructions are very frequent at that point and aim at relieving some of the guilt by denying the death of the person, which religious constructions are good at, and, basically amount to. The deviation from reasonable reality testing gives an estimate of the intensity of the unconscious wish. But, since we are talking about unconscious fantasies, there is nothing much you can do, except, perhaps, help her, as a friend, to remember and to grieve...

[Warpy]

7. I once maintained a friendship for YEARS

with a guy who got converted to the JWs. I sat him down and flatly told him that there was no way either of us was going to do any converting, and told him to think about what was more important, making himself feel important by giving religious harangues or being friends in other areas. Then I walked away.

A couple of days later, I ran into him. We were friends for years, never discussing religion. I lost contact when we both moved. I wish him well and hope his newfound, intense religion gave him the support he felt he needed. Since he was willing to respect a person completely outside it, I have to respect his faith. That's just how it works for me.

It's not easy to remain friends with someone in a faith that demands so much of them, but it can be done if they're willing to meet you in that neutral corner of life.

After all, you're not going to change just to suit them. Why should they have to change to suit you and me?

[NMMNG]

8. Are you sure she's not involved in a cult of some sort

the whole tatoo thing makes me wonder...tatoos are forbidden in the Bible for example.

Plus all that stuff about secret societies and prophecies, the apocalypse,etc. It just seems less like mainstream (even fundie) religion and more like a cult.

[China_cat]

9. Is she also filling up the place with frogs?