Are you a veteran??

[Amich]

Sen Buyer redefining veterans? any one else hear about this?
I hope this link works..

http://www.military.com/Opinions/0,,Scott_032905-P1,00.html?ESRC=airforce.nl

[Ganja Ninja]

1. I wonder how many yellow ribbons this asshole has on his car?

Typical GOP jerks talking out of both sides of their mouth and screwing the little guy every chance they get.

[Bammo]

41. Instant NeoCon Patriot

Easy to be a instant patriot these days, plaster a made in China "SUPPORT THE TROOPS" yellow free-kin ribbon on your rust bucket to cover the body cancer and you'll help spread the "SHRUB'S" war propaganda and think your a patriot as well!

Un-Free-Kin real how idiotic some sheople can be but when it comes to a fad --guess anything free-kin goes in the land of Uncle Sammy!

Hang Tough~

[Acebass]

44. We know someone like that, don't we bro...n/t

[Name removed]

45. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[1stCav]

48. Agree with you

Couldn't agree with you more, makes me want to chuck. NeoCon game Bammo and nothing more.

[1stCav]

50. The New U.S. Fad

Tell it like it needs to be told Bammo. Those yellow ribbons don't mean shit.

[nadinbrzezinski]

2. These jerks never served

but they suport the troops, BLEACH... they'd rather have the troops die before they become vets, SOBs that is what they are

[TN al]

3. While I agree with the theme of your posting...

...I think that Buyer is a veteran. He served in Gulf War I.

[Monkeyman]

57. Yep he did and has a bronze but it is administrative

[Career Prole]

4. The link works, and boy am I pissed off!

Buyer also took aim at the veterans' service organizations, saying their view that all veterans should have access to VA healthcare abandons values like duty and sacrifice. He chided the service organizations for using inflammatory rhetoric. "I asked them to be very careful with the words they select because ... they have an impact all over the country. It is upsetting to me when someone refers to veterans as whiney," Buyer stated.

Well, there you have it in his own words. The chairman of the House Veterans' Affairs Committee calling our service organizations "whiney" and accusing them of abandoning values like duty and sacrifice.

It would be easy to dismiss Buyer as part of some lunatic fringe on Capitol Hill trying to stick it to veterans. But that is not the case. Buyer speaks for the majority in Congress who speak for the current administration.

I decided to have a look at Buyer's military bona fides and found he'd been awarded the Bronze Star, among the numerous more mundane awards.

As we learned from the recent presidential campaign, a Bronze Star is pretty impressive, right? Unless of course the wearer is a Democrat named John Kerry.

To refresh your memories, hearken to the words of FactCheck.org on the subject...

The most serious allegation in the ad is that Kerry received both the Bronze Star, his second-highest decoration, and his third purple heart, which allowed him to be sent home early, under false pretenses. But that account is flatly contradicted by Jim Rassmann, the former Army Lieutenant whom Kerry rescued that day.

Van O'Dell, a former Navy enlisted man who says he was the gunner on another Swift Boat, states in his affidavit that he was "a few yards away" from Kerry's boat on March 13, 1969 when Kerry pulled Rassman from the water. According to the official medal citations, Kerry's boat was under enemy fire at the time, and Kerry had been wounded when an enemy mine exploded near his own boat. O'Dell insists "there was no fire" at the time, adding: "I did not hear any shots, nor did any hostile fire hit any boats" other than his own, PCF-3.

Others in the ad back up that account. Jack Chenoweth, who was a Lieutenant (junior grade) commanding PCF-3, said Kerry's boat "fled the scene" after a mine blast disabled PCF-3, and returned only later "when it was apparent that there was no return fire." And Larry Thurlow, who says he commanded a third Swift Boat that day, says "Kerry fled while we stayed to fight," and returned only later "after no return fire occurred."

A serious discrepancy in the account of Kerry's accusers came to light Aug. 19, when the Washington Post reported that Navy records describe Thurlow himself as dodging enemy bullets during the same incident, for which Thurlow also was awarded the Bronze Star...

I sure would like to have a gander at the citation for Buyer's Bronze Star because his only combat-zone time was spent as an Army lawyer!
Who was shooting at lawyers during Desert Storm?
Any input, Senator Cornyn? Were they gunning for activist Army lawyers back then?

In the fall of 1990, Congressman Buyer was called to active duty on three days notice to participate in OPERATION DESERT SHIELD/DESERT STORM. As an Operational Law Judge Advocate, Buyer provided legal advice to forward-deployed combat service support units within the combat zone of operations. He also provided legal advice to the Commander, 22nd Support Command. In addition, he was assigned to the Western Enemy Prisoner of War Camp, providing legal advice on international law and the Geneva Conventions regarding the treatment of prisoners of war, detained civilians, and refugees. He also served as an Armed Forces liaison with delegates of the International Committee of the Red Cross.

How does one go about finding this guy's Bronze Star citation? :evilgrin:

[Jo March]

6. Career Prole, I'd check with Walt Starr here on DU

He did a lot of work on *'s ribbons back before the election. He'd know where to start looking.

[Career Prole]

9. Thanks! n/t

[Jo March]

10. You're welcome. I'm interested in seeing what shakes out!

You know, when you lift up a rotting log, there are always some interesting creepy crawlies living under it!!!

:evilgrin:

[Pinboy]

15. The Bronze Star is awarded not only for heroism

Unlike the Silver Star, which is awarded ONLY for valor in combat, the Bronze Star can be awarded EITHER for valor in combat, OR for meritorious achievement or service. When the medal is awarded for valor, the orders indicate that it is awarded "with v-device," which is a small bronze letter "V" attached to the face of the ribbon. The non-valorous version of the ribbon is identical, but is worn without the v-device.

Buyer could have been awarded a Bronze Star as a lawyer simply for doing an exceptionally good job qualifying as "meritorious achievement or service."

[Dharma_Bum]

27. TRUE TRUE ... i WAS GOING TO ADD THIS!

[1stCav]

47. Right

You got it straight Pinboy. Forgot one thing though, if you knew someone high up you could get your pick.

[bluescribbler]

54. meritorious achievement or service?

So basically, he got his Bronze Star for keeping his CO out of the slammer?

[BikeWriter]

25. He provided legal advice and got a Bronze Star? Watch out...

for those paper cuts! :(

[punpirate]

5. This country has never acknowledged...

... the real costs of fighting multiple foreign wars and maintaining a military capable of doing so. So, when the debt piles up, they go after precisely the people they needed for that adventurism.

One day, maybe they'll smarten up, but, apparently, not soon. In the meantime, I hope the vets' groups tear Buyer a new asshole. And, just for the record, this guy is a vet himself:

Party: Republican
Residence: Monticello
Marital Status: Married (Joni)
Prev. Occupation: Attorney
Prev. Political Exp.: IN Dep. Atty. General, 1987-88; White Co. Republican Party Vice-Chair, 1988-90
Education: BS The Citadel, 1980; JD Valparaiso University, 1984
Military: USA, 1984-87; USAR, 1980-84, 1987-present

Never did care much for the military school types....

[davidwhite0570]

7. This is B.S. I hope all those Vets who

voted for * because he promised to take care of them are happy....I am a Vet and it burns my a**.....

[Steel City Slim]

12. I Second That

[Jo March]

8. This man is pathetic

He's a veteran yet he wants to short-change other veterans?!? This guy has got to be stopped.

Time for letters to other veteran leaders around the country including Kerry and Wes Clark!!

[MADem]

13. He doesn't NEED to care, see...

Congress has the best medical plan going. Even the retirees jump ahead of active duty wounded in line at Walter Reed.

What you are hearing from him is screw you, vets, I got mine!

[1stCav]

49. Nothing New

Been doing that for years while the people here say okay do it more, its our tax dollars.

[Steel City Slim]

11. I'm A Vet

These chicken hawks piss me off!!!!

[Ezlivin]

14. I'm a vet...I think

Wow, so he wants me (100% disabled service-connected veteran) to not have access to the VA because I wasn't injured in combat?

Wow.

I guess I should have been the driver, not the bicyclist in the hit-and-run accident in base housing. Or wrestled the controls of my submarine away from the helmsman and run ashore.

Damn. What other promises are they going to retroactively break?

Next thing you know they'll want a refund for my vocational rehab.

[Lowell]

16. And all the time I thought I was a vet

11 years in the Army, three in the navy and I would have a hard time qualifying as a vet under this guys criteria. Screw him and all these chickenhawks running this administration. Now I wish I'd had a anal fistula or something to keep me out.

They wonder why they can't fill their recruiting goals. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out. They increase the risk while they decrease the benefit. I say we draft young republicans.

[AtTheEndOfTheDay]

17. So soon I may not be a veteran.

I'm a peace time veteran that broke his neck on a chaplain sponsored ski trip. I had one month active duty remaining and was 24. 22 wheelchair bound years later I'm collecting my VA check and I'm one grateful dude to get it. It's a weird position to be in because I myself have questioned my "good fortune" to have suffered such a debilitating injury yet have the financial support that allowed me to avoid poverty and have somewhat of a life simply because I had this Army thing going. I confess it's a feeling of thankful guilt. I know I didn't do anything of valor but maybe I would have. I was a medic. Anyway, bottom line is it's a godsend and without it I'd probably be dead. As a high quadriplegic I'm hard pressed to bring home an income. This fascist bunch is really scaring me. Hitler came for the handicapped first.

[GravyLs230]

18. Sort of

I'm an active duty Marine.

[Pinboy]

19. Welcome to DU, GravyLs230...

...and thanks for your service. You're in good company here -- check out this thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=3734985

[Freedomfried]

20. self deleted

by me, of course

[And so it goes]

21. Draft Young Republicans: Las Vegas July 6-10

http://www.operationyellowelephant.com

http://www.yrnc2005.com

-

[usedtobesick]

22. it follows a Bush/republican precedent

if you don't like something then redefine it so you can control it. I guess I would still qualify being a disabled vet but still if they can even open a window of doubt they can begin to make these changes without even legislating it out. Less chance of people finding out what they are doing. It seems that some one like Bush who claims to be a friend of Veterans would insure that his administration would work to protect our rights but, that isn't what is happening.

[Left_Winger]

23. My DD-214 says so

[Rick Myers]

32. Same here...

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[genie_weenie]

26. I'm a G*D Damn Veteran!

Really what this is about, is cutting money from Vets. Recall David S Chu's comments on the way benefits for Veterans and their families was the direct cause of and future cause of all DoD budget shortfalls. This is nothing new, the Government has for years thrown aside those it has used up in Wars. The Bonus Army anyone? The Captain of the USS Indianapolis? The WWII vets experminted upon during the war...

Chu Comments Link:
link: http://www.gopusa.com/commentary/tsegel/2005/ts_0215p.shtml

[Army]

28. Benefits Cut While in Country

I'm in Iraq now, going 'outside the wire' 2-5 times a week and my wife received a letter that I am being moved to a medical plan with less benefits. Nice to see the Chicken Hawk Republicans sticking up for us while we fight their oil war.

<http://www.myspace.com/baghdadgun>

[Wickerman]

29. Sorry to hear that

their travesties never cease.

Keep your head down and thanks for posting.

[Wickerman]

30. Veteran (Pissed off on MANY fronts, too)

Pround of my Vet status, but am stunned at the way this country tolerates the erosion of respect to those we send off to fight our battles.

Read this about how we treat our war dead:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=132683&mesg_id=132683

[genie_weenie]

33. Where are you?

Couldn't get anywhere with your myspace link. All my boys who I shamefully abandoned by not re-upping for another tour are in Blue Diamond or Camp Ramadi and Camp Fallujah. Which they report is big and sucks...

[Army]

35. Camp Liberty

In the middle of Baghdad. Our AO is all of Baghdad, down to the border in the south. 11 more weeks of dodging mortars and car bombs and IED's (oh my!). But who's counting?

[wakemeupwhenitsover]

36. A double digit midget.

Keep your head down, Army!

:hug:

[bothwell]

31. Yes I am

But a British one and as such am mightily impressed by the power excercised by the various Vet associations and bodies you have in the USA, we just dont have them, in fact I noticed a post about Gulf War Syndrome, cases are being fought here on an individual basis and the government still ahs to admit it actually exsists, so more power to you

[Acebass]

34. I pity the poor bastard...

That says I'm not, to my face!...

[Name removed]

43. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[BlueCollar]

37. my DD214 says so

thanks to God and my shipmates I emerged from my service without the need for VA medical benefits...but this is BULLSHIT

I'd almost love to see this SOB walk through a prop arc

[57_TomCat]

38. I too have a DD214

that says I am. One of the illustrious "Viet Nam Era" types no less though other than a tree chopping incident in Korea I had very little active duty time that was dangerous.

I was turned down by the VA when I tried to join about 4 years ago due to being in "Category 8". I made too much money and had a good insurance plan so was not eligible without a service connected disability. Life goes on.

I still consider myself a veteran though! :)

[Loneranger]

39. I'm a veteran but no hero

I am a veteran that served in the U.S. Army right after the Korea War, stateside. My son joined the Army and was sent to Viet Nam where he was wounded and spent many months in a military hospital. Then he spent more time in a Veterans Hospital. He still goes in and out of this hospital on a routine basis. Viet Nam, much like George W. Bush's war in Iraq is a no win situation in my oppinion. My son did come home but I no longer knew the boy who left for Viet Nam because he now is a stranger to me, and has been for over 36 years. Will the veterans of George Bush's Iraq be treated any different than those that fought in Viet Nam? According to the Viet Nam veterans that my son has for friends, they think these vets will be treated as bad or worse. Reason why is because it is a no win situation in Iraq. Does anyone think any GOP politician that started this war will take responsibility or will it be put on the American Soldier, like it was in Viet Nam? I think after many visits to the veterans hospital to see my son that these veterans will take the blame for Iraq and will be lost Americans like many Viet Nam veterans were and still are.

[AbsoluteArmorer]

40. Drafted into war

I was drafted into the Vietnam War. I never discussed much about it until several months ago after being on a couple forums and hooking up with some real veterans on them. Prior to that, I just never felt comfortable to speak about that 'wrong' war that was based on lies as well. Since I have found this veteran's section here, I may or may not speak much about experiences I had over there, but I do wish to expose those who claim to be 'real' vets while they beat on their chests like a bunch of tarzans.

For the record, I'd like to share this much about those who played military stateside or floated around in safe peacetime foreign countries. Your service served is honorable, but it's not comparable to anyone who has been in a war zone. That does not make you less a person, but those who falsely beef up their records disgraces and downgrades those who have.

I also feel that Pentagon/Congress has overstepped their boundaries when they hand out medals and ribbons to those who have not served in any in-country combat conditions to those who served in that era in another land in order to glorify the status of being in the military. I feel it's wrong to share the same medals/ribbons of those who were in direct combat with those who were not. I'm fine with 'other' sets of medals/ribbons for those who were not in-country of a war zone. They deserve some recognition as well.

I myself, was not 'officially' 11B20 in Vietnam, but I did pull infantry duties along with my other MOSs in a chopper unit. Therefore I have never claimed that I earned the CIB badge, simply because I shouldn't have in the first place. That's holding respect and honor to those who have and do deserve the CIB. That's how it's done among the 'real' vets who serve together in the same war zone. Honor will find it's own way without any fake adage.

I too am no hero. I went when I had to, even though it was against my will and belief. My Vietnam War represents those who was there in our own hell .... we won nothing... we gained nothing.... that's all it was... and is. We together as Americans lost... because we together were duped same same as we are duped today. I love my American heritage, but not our New World Order Crusade.

[Name removed]

42. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[1stCav]

46. 1st Cav

Vietnam 1st Cav 2nd of the 7th Vietnam 1967. 11bravo got hit and shipped back here. Joined AA, not that smart of a move. No hero here, and your right, what was there to win in the Nam? Same thing as what there is to win in Iraq, nothing.

[SKKY]

51. I'm a Vet, and I don't give two left nuts what Buyer thinks about it...

[AbsolutNickUSN76]

55. I'm a vet who just got back from Iraq

I'm not sure any on e person can say who a vet is other than the known definition of someone who has served in the military.

[Recursion]

52. Great!

Does this mean I get those 7 years of my life back?

[LiberalVoiceLyes]

53. Veteran & Retired ANG

I'm in the worse case veteran, I hororable discharged from USAF and a twenty year retiree from the Air National Guard. Make to much money for VA benefits and don't receive my ANG benefits till I'm 60 years old. Eleven more years till that happens...

[FILAM23]

56. Yes,

I'm a Vet, enlisted during VietNam retired after Gulf War.
All my DD214's say I'm a vet so must be

[Monkeyman]

58. Brothers and Sister vets

Buyer is again pushing for all PTSD case to be reviewed. The Veterans Commission in it report after Nov 6th will call for the same thing.

[johnmccarthy]

59. I think so, but the VA doesn't.......

I sent the following to the International Herald Tribune in Paris, France, on December 22, 2006. Not just a few Bcc went out along with it. If this ain't a veterans issue, I don't know what is. Federal District Court in DC says these matters fall under the Feres Doctrine and since the allegations of criminal conduct by members of the US Government are "incident to service", the civil suit must be dismissed. Ironically, the Veterans Administration says my application for PTSD is NOT SERVICE RELATED. I wonder who has the higher authority or who might see this and use it to force the issue in the media?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Greetings,

I read with great interest the article written by Scott Shane, below, re the declassification of millions of documents hidden from inquiring eyes for 25 years by US Government Agencies. Unfortunately, some "important and interesting documents" will fall into the "exempt" category, even though it is a crime to classify material to cover a criminal act which has about as much effect on National Security as the dust on my computer screen.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/12/21/america/web.1221declassify.php

Ironically, the following article was published by the Los Angeles Times on Monday, December 18, 2006.

http://www.latimes.com/news/la-na-intel18dec18,1,5355358.story

I responded to the author, Greg Miller, with the following information:

The following URL contains information on treason in wartime submitted to two US Senators on the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence and to the former Attorney General, Ashcroft, the highest law enforcement officer in the United States, in 2001, without response.

http://johnmccarthy90066.tripod.com/id258.html

I suggested that Mr. Miller may wish to contact Marine General Michael Ennis for his reaction to these yet unresolved matters when directing CIA overview of espionage missions conducted by Special Forces allegedly approved by the highest authority and NOT in conflict with Presidential Directives as in the above matter.

I also have a request lingering in the Department of Justice offices requesting the declassification of once top secret matters from a judicial procedure that took place in 1968. The Clerk of The Court responded by saying I would be notified when a decision on this matter was ascertained. Note the date of submission in August, 2005. The Top Secret classification affixed to this paperwork included a stamp indicating "DOD Directive 5200 Does Not Apply". This Directive governs the time frame for declassification of documents under US Government control. Thirty eight years later it is quite evident why this stamp was affixed.

http://johnmccarthy90066.tripod.com/id299.html

There follows a case for Mis-prison, a felony which carries a five year penalty of incarceration for those who are notified of the crime of treason and willfully fail to notify a Federal Judge OR the President, aggravated in this instance during wartime.

I have had 174 thousand visitors to my Web Site, above, showing world wide interest in all matters and documents already published on my site. The once Top Secret information has been read in the capitals of most countries on the planet. King Sihanouk is also in receipt.

"What's interesting and important" while concerned people are still alive lies hidden in these documents. Expanding the Vietnam War into Cambodia in a reverse domino theory was the intended result of this treason. Has it happened again? Look at Iraq and Iran to see the pattern continuing to emerge.

Bests,
John McCarthy