Big has been scratching and nibbling herself raw in spots ......

[Stinky The Clown]

She has scratched herself to the point of bleeding on the top of her head and the top/back of her ears. She had a course of steroids about a month ago, which helped while she was taking them. Now she's back to the scratching.

We'll get her to the vet in the next day or so, but the vet seemed unsure of the issue the last time, so I'm not confident what he's suggest this time. I really don't want to go through steroids again.

I really feel bad for her. Is there anything I can do to symptomatically relieve the itching?

[Kookaburra]

1. Aloe Vera might calm down the irritation

and I don't think it's toxic to dogs. Not sure though.

[lukasahero]

2. Not knowing the original history...

Have you tried anything with her food? My pup scratched unceasingly until we got her on a high quality protein dog food. I know for myself wheat does me in and it's no surprise dogs don't all do well on it...

I really hope you find the help she needs.

[Stinky The Clown]

3. Both dogs get Iams and have for a long time.

Not sure how much wheat it has in it .....

[Dover]

4. I have found this product brings immediate and lasting relief for severe itching & skin problems.

The alpha hydroxys is the key.




Tropiclean, Oxy Med - Medicated Oatmeal Treatment Rinse - ultra soothing and stops itching fast.

Oxy-Med is an ultra soothing medicated rinse formulated to stop itching, control flaking and reduce shedding. Oxy-Med® contains Alpha Hydroxys which are far more effective than any medicated shampoo at relieving seborrhea and other skin problems. Alpha Hydroxys penetrate the lowermost levels of the skin (stratum corneum) and "clean out" the skins pores. Vitamins and Omega 3 fatty acids supply nourishment for a healthy skin & coat.


Stops itching fast
Ultra soothing
Rehydrates
Oatmeal, Omega 3, Vitamin E + Salicylic Acid

http://www.entirelypets.com/oxymedmedicated.html


Also be sure she's getting plenty of fatty acids (Omega 3/6) in her diet.
http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?c=2+1662&aid=666

[roody]

5. Try liquid Vitamin E on her sores.

It is very soothing. And it is good to lick as well.

[BrklynLiberal]

6. She is GORGEOUS!!! How old is she?

My previous GSD also had that problem. It became so bad that it developed into a lick granuloma which you do not want to have to deal with.
http://www.sniksnak.com/doghealth/lick-gran.html

He was treated with steroids, which I later regretted...a long story for another time.

First, IAMs in NOT a good food. Check the ingredients, and you will see they use a lot of corn as well as a lot of non-human grade ingredients. They were bought by Proctor and Gamble, and the quality has gone downhill since..not to mention their testing on animals.
Check out this fantastic post by Lorien about pet food:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=243&topic_id=4388&mesg_id=4388

Changing her food would be the best place to start. She may be getting a yeast infection in her ears, and the food is a primary factor in that. I use Merricks for my German Shepherd and for my cats. All human grade ingredients. My philosophy is that if you can buy pet food in a grocery store, you shouldn't buy it. The high quality food is more expensive, but you more than come out ahead on what you save on vet bills.

To treat the problems she has now check out this site. Lots of very good info, various pages worth looking at.
If it is an ear yeast infection, antibiotics are the very worst thing for it.
http://www.dogearyeastinfection.com/smelly_dog_ears_could_be_a_sign_of_a_yeast_infection_in_your_dogs_ear.html

Acidophilus is also used to fight yeast ear infections in dogs.
http://forum.lowcarber.org/archive/index.php/t-125623.html

Topically, if there is a hot spot or such as result of her scratching, you can use Sulfodene - They also make an ear cleaner which you can look into, but I am referring to the skin med.
You may be able to use it topically where she is actually scratching herself to relieve the irritation and avoid the possibility of infection.
http://www.sulfodene.com/faqs.htm

I also have used Listerine...the yucky yellow Listerine. Check out the details here.
http://www.peoplespharmacy.com/archives/home_remedies/listerine_for_hot_spots.php

A horse lover shared the following formula she used on the mane and tail of her filly: 1/3 Listerine (original formula) 1/3 baby oil and 1/3 water Put in a spray bottle, shake well and spray it on. This is quite similar to the formula recommended for dogs’ itchy hot spots. The herbal oils in Listerine may have some antifungal or antibacterial activity. Chronic itching may be the result of an allergic reaction. Changing to a hypoallergenic dog food is sometimes helpful.

I hope this helps and Big is soon much much better than new.
Please keep us posted.

PS If for some reason you are forced to give her antibiotics, make sure to give her acidophilus with each dose. It is available at any health food store.

[Stinky The Clown]

8. Hi BL! Thanks for all that! Checking through it now .... ... and in answer .....

..... Big is 5-ish.

[Stinky The Clown]

7. Update - Big is feeling better already ... but we have a long road .....

Okay, so we went to the vet today. We had an ice storm and the vet had a lot of cancellations, so I was able to get a same day appointment.

I saw a different vet than I saw the last time. Today it was a woman who also happens to be the owner of a German Shepard who has similar issues as our girl.

The fact that she cleared up the last time with steroids tells her it is probably an allergy. That said, she took some skin scrapings to look for mange. She was able to tell me in minutes that it was not mange. But the dog does have a skin infection that is secondary to the allergies and the direct result of all the scratching.

Now, if it is allergies, we have a long and maybe painful road to follow. Dogs can be allergic to damned near anything ...... including cats and other dogs! Determining the actual allergy is as hit and miss, as painful, and as expensive for dogs as for humans. So most vets wind up treating them symptomatically. And that's what we're going to do for Big ... for now. The vet said that antihistamines can be very effective and have no know side affects, even if taken every day for life. They don't help with where Big is now, but they are proven to be efficacious as a preventative. Further, there are a number of them available, each working a slightly different way.

So .... right now it is another course of steroids. That will give her pretty fast relief. Then, just before the end of the steroid course, we will start the antihistamine. She said these are effective about 50% of the time. So we start with this one ... evaluate ..... and move to the next and the next if need be.

Plan B is to do the serious allergy testing or put her on steroids for ever. That's where it starts to get really hard.

Here's a link to pictures of the rest of Big's family, all of whom are pulling for her.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=105x8460055#8460104

I have to tell you Big's story ......

She was bought as a puppy direct from an amateur breeder. She is full GSD, but not of any particularly good bloodline. Just your basic German Shepard. The couple that got her were friends with my son since childhood. The wife died of cancer and the husband had a drug problem and was ultimately unable to cope; he's no longer functional. My son and DIL took in the dog, as it was either that or she would have wound up who-knows-where .... maybe euthanized. So they kept her as long as they could, but knew they would be moving and likely not able to keep her. They found a great home for her, but the woman who was to take her couldn't do so for a month or so (whatever ... not sure I trusted the story from the start). "Dad, can you watch her until she can pick her up."

So we take her. Of course, we've known this dog basically since she's been a puppy. The bonding part was unavoidable. We told my son to tell whoever he found to take the dog that the dog is no longer available.

Yeah .... we're saps.

But who couldn't love her? She's just so damned sweet.

[BrklynLiberal]

9. She is a lovely creature and I am sure she is flourishing under your care

and surrounded by Little and Tiny. Tiny watching TV is soooo funny.


EDIT:.. I reread your post and realized that you opted for steroids for now...

Was there any discussion of the yeast infection? Did she look inside the ears? Was there a test for the yeast?
Make sure you give her the acidophilus if she has to take antibiotics.

A food upgrade cannnot do any harm...

I have given my GSD childrens liquid Benedryl and it worked using the childrens dosage as prescribed on the package.
That was for a temporary allergic reaction to some airborne stuff that resulted from my landlady redoing her floors.

Here is a picture of my GSD, Boen...and the cats that let him live here..
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=105&topic_id=8460055&mesg_id=8460856

[Muttocracy]

10. I used some generic version of Benadryl caplets on my GSD mix

He used to have many more skin problems, and an infection in one ear that lasted a couple of years that the vets couldn't solve, but they got better when we moved (after I started getting horrible skin reactions and found a bunch of mold in my apartment) - and he was on a good food, but now he's on an even better grain-free food. I don't know if the Benadryl ever really helped - maybe a little. I would also put Neosporin on some of his spots when I was supervising him (and he wouldn't lick) to help them heal.

[badgerpup]

11. Don't quote me, OK? But you might be looking at psychogenic allopecia.

:wtf:
That's a really fancy way of saying "The furkid gets nervous and stressed and starts licking/biting/scratching his/her fur off as a way of coping".

Had a cat who did that...Misha was a barometer of household stress level.
If his glossy black coat had no bare spots, everything was fine.
When he started licking his fur off (usually the belly or the hips, for him), then it was "Houston, we have a problem."

A prednisone shot solved the immediate licky problem...but then the next step was harder.
Identifying what the stressor was, and then doing what I could to solve the problem.
That was the hard part, because it's not like they can come right out and tell you:
"THIS is the thing that's really bugging me...so can you please DO SOMETHING about it?" :banghead:

One time he really went to town on his belly...licked himself raw. Hurt him so bad he was crying, and I felt terrible too; that I'd let him get this far with it before I'd noticed.
I put some ointment on it- and he tried to lick THAT off...finally had to sedate him until I could get him to the vet next day.

I still miss that big, loud, noisy cat...he was my buddy.

[cate94]

15. I had a dog with severe allergies.

My dog would get hot spots that turned into staph infections very quickly. Neosporin is safe if it is in an area they can't lick, but hydrogen peroxide can be used wherever. It cools the spot and the dog is safe to lick it. (Vets will use hydrogen peroxide to induce vomiting in emergency situations - and it requires well over the amount they could ingest topically.) Hopefully the antihistamine's will work for you.

We had to go the scratch test/antigen therapy route. If it comes to that, it isn't as bad as it sounds. Expensive but worth it. Antigen therapy requires shots and a difficult initial schedule. Eventually you end up with a once a week shot and a dog that isn't sick, itchy and crying. We took ours to a dermatologist, and it was the best thing we ever did. She lived pretty comfortably after that.

Good luck!

[meow2u3]

12. Is she a Shepherd or a Belgian Malinois?

Either way, she's a beautiful bitch (4-legged variety).

[Stinky The Clown]

13. She's a Sheperd

Tall for the breed and thinner than many, but not unusually so.

And a total lovey, wussie, sweetie of a dog.

[sazemisery]

14. My Labrador, Nixon, has been going through the same thing

We did the round of steroids and then he started to break out again. The vet is sure it is a contact allergy but he also said that his skin is extremely dry. Since we heat our house with the fireplace and electric heat, I have wanted to get a humidifier so we could have a humidity level higher that 16%RH. Since I bought the http://www.germguardian.com/prod_humiddigi.asp">Germ Guardian we have had great results for both humans and animals. Nixon's skin has cleared up 99%, Mr.sazemisery and I don't wake up with our sinuses all clogged up.

Just a suggestion. It is working for us.

[MiniMe]

16. Could be dry air or allergies

They actually do have doggie allergy shots and doggie allergists. Food allergies can be really common, corn and wheat are common. If your vet didn't suggest allergies, I might suggest a second opinion. I know one dog who is allergic to grass. He is a black lab and looked like a reverse German Shepard for a while, he was losing his hair and was covered with white spots where his skin showed through. They put him on allergy shots and his coat looks great now. Good luck.