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IE8 Update ready to install. How do I get rid of it?

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Born_A_Truman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 09:42 PM
Original message
IE8 Update ready to install. How do I get rid of it?
I have been watching for the IE8 update, so I've been clicking on custom install so I can see what the update is before installing.

I don't want to install this update but I can't seem to get rid of it either. The little icon is sitting there and I want to delete it and not install.

Any suggestions?

TIA!
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Why Syzygy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 09:49 PM
Response to Original message
1. I just did a fresh system install
and had to update Windows. While it was running the install, a pop-up asked me specifically if I wanted to install IE8. There was the option to say "no". Make sure you already have SP 3 installed. If so, and IE8 manages to install itself, you can always uninstall it.
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Born_A_Truman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jun-18-09 09:56 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. I figured it out...
I clicked on custom install and unchecked the box for IE8 and hit close and a pop up window came up and said it would not be installed. I checked the box to not remind me of the update again.

Yes, I have SP3 here on my laptop.

I'm concerned about my HP PC because my updates on that machine have been automatically installed. I think I need to see if I can change that option before IE8 installs on that PC.
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Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-21-09 09:34 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. They will ask you if you want to install IE8
I tried and found it unusable. Microshaft must know they have a problem, because there's a way to uninstall it and go back to IE7 at their site.

It's just not ready for prime time.
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Why Syzygy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-22-09 01:15 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. I'm using it ..
and really like it a lot. If there are compatibility issues with certain websites, you can click to select to conform to older standards. The tab system is great for my usage. It doesn't run well with Avira though. I had issues with Comodo and uninstalled it. Avira slowed browsing to a snail's crawl. Right now I'm just running Zone Alarm. I use the Google tool bar which gives a whole new functionality to IE or Firefox. I also finally found the file that kicks off automatic toolbar updates and renamed it so it will STFU.

I don't think I have JAVA or Quick Time yet. It would be great if I never need them. Have Flash.
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madokie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-22-09 07:43 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. I use IE8 and like it better than any of the others and I've tried 'em all
I'm using only the firewall that came with xp home and am now using Panda's Cloud antivirus. I'm really liking Cloud too as it has a small footprint and so far it hasn't bugged me about anything nor has it allowed any nasties to come through. Both of which I can't say the same for AVG nor Avast. I started using Cloud a few days after it was released.
I haven't installed Quicktime nor Java on my machine the last couple times I've reformated and reloaded windows. I haven't found I need either as only once have something I wanted to do wouldn't because of not having java loaded.

http://www.cloudantivirus.com/
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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-22-09 08:42 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Don't miss Firefox 3.5
It's set to land soon, maybe before the end of the month. It'll be a major upgrade with, among other things, private browsing, a new faster Javascript engine, and HTML 5 support. One notable feature of HTML 5 is native embeddable video and audio (in other words, a potential Flash killer). YouTube and DailyMotion already have HTML 5 video proof-of-concept pages up. Look for YouTube in particular to be an early supporter, since Google is a big HTML 5 proponent.
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madokie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-22-09 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. I will be checking it out
anything that says faster is going to get my attention. I'm on a slow dsl line so anything I can do on my end to speed things up I'm interested in. From the sounds of this I may be switching to firefox before it's all said and done.
If the learning curve wasn't what it is for me I would have already switched to one of the linux's, plus and this is a big plus, if I could make autoCad work.
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Why Syzygy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-22-09 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. I've already downloaded
Cloud, and it will be my next trial. With Comodo, my Game installed just fine. It has a nice feature to allow installs without corrupting the registry. However. The Game would not launch. The process started and immediately shut down. Playing that Game was my reward for all the effort spent setting up a new system. I thought it might be an IE8 conflict. But Comodo was the culprit. As soon as I uninstalled it, the Game ran normally. There may be a work around, but it wasn't readily apparent and I didn't have the patience to pursue.

Encouraging that you manage without JAVA and QT. I hope to do the same.

btw, I used the Windows firewall for awhile before deciding exactly what to install. AFAIK it works well.
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RoyGBiv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-22-09 02:08 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. FWIW ...

This kind of approach would not fit in a best practices manual.

If your security software is preventing a newly installed software package from functioning properly, there's generally a reason for that. Now, the reason could simply be that the new software has changed the rules of the game, so to speak, in a way that will not be a problem once those new rules propagate. But, you're really playing with fire simply uninstalling security software that's preventing something from running. That's pretty much what security software is designed to do, in fact.

Now, of course, I don't know the details of what you're dealing with here, so it may not matter in your particular case.

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Why Syzygy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-22-09 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. It's a game I've had installed
Edited on Mon Jun-22-09 02:30 PM by Why Syzygy
for years (EA Games). Nothing new, or I would whole heartedly agree. I don't understand "changing the rules" and "rules propogate". I would never disable security to try something entirely new. There were no error messages or warnings when the .exe attempted to start. When it installed, Comodo had the option to treat it as an "application or installation", which is what prevented errors in the install. I had a heck of a time getting the installation to execute from the CD as well. That's never happened. Comodo also runs *updates* about 50 times a day, complete with notification each time. Annoying.

Does the fact that the game was historically installed on the system make a difference in your assessment?
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RoyGBiv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-22-09 02:44 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Not really ...

EA has some anti-piracy schemes that do things like that. One of their DRM methods will do exactly what you describe if you have any software installed that mimics or seems to mimic a virtual storage device. This is intended to prevent things like MagicISO from being used to make copies, but it can go well beyond that. It's the DRM technology itself interpreting something as a "false positive" when encountering certain kinds of software.

Again, I don't know if that's what's going on in your case. Anti-virus programs in particular have developed to the point that a lot of false positives are triggered by seemingly random things. That could be the problem.

What Comodo are you using, just the anti-virus?

As for updates, you want your anti-virus to update as often as possible. This is one of the things that distinguishes good anti-virus software from mediocre or bad. I would hope you could turn off the notifications process. I don't use Comodo anti-virus, so I dunno.
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Why Syzygy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-22-09 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. I read about the
Edited on Mon Jun-22-09 03:44 PM by Why Syzygy
anti-piracy issue while trying to resolve. That could have implicated "Windows Movie Maker", as I've never seen that on my system before and don't know much about it. (I'm sure that it was a Gateway add on. The install had the benefit of allowing me to opt out of a bunch of garbage which was factory installed. AOL, for one.) I have no other copying device, other than XP. EA has a FAQ set up for players who encounter this issue. It didn't seem to fit my situation.

I was using the suite, FW, AV and .. malware? I think there was a third tool, but can't remember, and cannot find the information on their site. I had not installed ZA at that time. Sometime when I'm feeling um. (to avoid the word you hate) 'software inclined', I may try to discover what the issue was. I had spent a good 12 hours reinstalling my system and wanted to play for relaxation. I also demo'd their Cleaner product. At first it was very impressive in the number of 'registry errors' it detected. I've been happily using CCleaner. However, after the required reboot following the scan, the result was a fraction of the identified objects; the rest being labeled as 'system usage' or something. IOW, it might 'id' 100 entries and only choose to delete 10 of them. Likewise with the regular files it initially marked for deletion. When I ran CCleaner after that, it listed several files as "marked for deletion"!?

If constant updating interferes with browsing, it is rather defeating the purpose of a more current definition. Like, if I can't browse, who needs anti-virus?? :crazy:

There may be a way to disable notification. I didn't find the GUI very UF. That's 'me', someone who has used every imaginable hybrid software as well as mainstream for the past *more years than I care to mention*.

ON EDIT:
Oh my stars! Take a look at their "support" forum:
http://forums.comodo.com/
It reads like an infomercial.

Egads. It's likely I won't be digging around in THIS to determine what went wrong:
https://support.comodo.com/index.php?_m=knowledgebase&_a=view

2nd Edit:
Good grief. I don't want a security program that requires this intensity.
http://forums.comodo.com/empty-t35104.0.html
Which reminds me. The game was blocked from launching even when all of Comodo's settings were DISABLED.
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RoyGBiv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-23-09 12:39 AM
Response to Reply #14
18. Weird ...
Edited on Tue Jun-23-09 12:39 AM by RoyGBiv
Well, the only Comodo product I've ever used is the firewall, so I can't comment on how it deals with anti-virus, malware, etc. The firewall works well.

I still am inclined to think there's another issue at play than simply an incompatibility problem, but I couldn't guess what it is without a lot of detailed information. I'll just say that I've experienced problems similar to what you experienced, and in all those cases the issue turned out to be some screwed up thing the DRM was doing.

I loathe Electronic Arts, partly because I love their games. I'm addicted to the Sims and just got the Sims 3 this past weekend, so I'm dealing with my Windows box more than usual. It has a new download manager and a program launcher that are positively the worst pieces of crap I have ever seen in a commercial game as far as intrusiveness into the system and lack of freedom of choice. I had to fart around with my firewall settings for awhile before the damn thing would load in under 5 minutes ... and it *forces* the use of Internet Exploiter, which I had blocked entirely from even running. It will eventually load without IE being able to connect to the Internet, but you sorta have to fake not having a network connection to prevent IE from doing its thing. If you want the custom content available from EA, you *have* to allow the program launcher to use IE; there's no way around it that I've found so far.

As for updates so frequent that you can't even surf the web, well, yeah, that's one way to prevent virus infection ... not a very practical one, but it would work, sorta like unplugging the thing from the wall would work. As I said, I've not used their full suite, so I don't know what it could be doing. It strikes me as odd that it is updating that frequently, however. The firewall program does a check once per day for updates ... which reminds me, it uses Internet Exploiter too. Dammit ... that's why it got the error. I'll have to do manual updates. Blah.



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Why Syzygy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-23-09 01:43 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. You are kidding me!!
Edited on Tue Jun-23-09 01:58 AM by Why Syzygy
That's the "Game" I've been mentioning (2). It's my "secret" addiction. My system is not up to running '3', and I'm not sure I like all the changes I've seen written. Do you use a DVD or CD? I had to start over last summer because something became corrupted. It worked out to advantage because I knew a lot more cheats the second time around. Now, I've started YET AGAIN. But that's fine because I had made too many kids for one family. Possible incest was looming large. I guess now you can understand why I was absolutely willing to axe Comodo in an effort to get it going. I posted a thread on their BBS, but figured it out from here. I always have Zone Alarm blocking all Internet traffic AND running in Game Mode. I tried to pack up a lot, but it just ran endlessly. No success (with Internet enabled obviously). I want to try that again because building gets tedious, even though decorating is sometimes one of my favorite things. On Sims 1, I had a lot of Mods, but have nothing custom on '2'.

I'm so glad you told me!

eta: You probably like the vampires and ghosts? I like the idea of community graveyards because I delete all the tombstones and urns. Those ghosts are just pests. It would be nice to keep them around somewhere.
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RoyGBiv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-23-09 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #20
24. The Sims

I actually had a hunch it was The Sims after you said it was EA. Its DRM schemes for the Sims specifically are notorious for causing the kinds of problems you were experiencing. I'll just summarize that part of the conversation by saying that my point is that it's the DRM that's causing the problem, in one way or another. I think it's absurd that you need to get rid of or change your security software because EA's draconian methods won't function properly otherwise.

Anyway ...

I'll preface my answer to one of your questions by noting that I have purchased Sims 1, 2, and now 3 and *every single* expansion except the Sims Stories things. (I still don't even know what those things are.) I've also bought all the Sims 2 expansions a second time for my daughter. I've paid my fees, in other words.

I installed it from DVDs, to answer that question.

I don't currently use a DVD or a CD. Without going into all the details, a friend and I were trying to get it to work under Wine or in a virtual Windows machine, and the DRM prevents that. We (mostly he, actually) fiddled with some things, but we couldn't get it to work under Linux properly. However, it did leave me with an installation on my Windows box that doesn't require the discs. I still have them, but I don't use them. Game runs faster too.

I had so many mods, if we include SimsResource objects, clothing, etc., for Sims 2 I filled a DVD with them. I screwed up once and just decided to install a ton of stuff all at once and discovered I had a conflict with one of the mods after I'd been playing for days. My lowest point of Sims addiction was sitting at my computer four hours and hours on end testing individual mod files trying to find the culprit. I mean, you know how long it takes to load the game. I had to remove a mod file, then restart, check if the problem still existed, then repeat. I was able to narrow it down to about a hundred possible files in the beginning by a process of elimination with where the problem was happening and what the mods did, but still. I found three files causing the problem eventually.

It was pathetic.

Sims 3 is ... different. I'm reserving judgment until I've played it some more. Most of the people complaining about certain aspects of it played it a full day before they blew their tops, and it's all really rather silly. It is different, and it requires a different approach to how you play.

One element I *love* about it is that you can walk across the damn street or next door or wherever and knock on your neighbor's door to say hello ... or rifle through their trash if you're inclined. It's a living neighborhood now, not just your house or individual houses working independently of each other.

It needs some expansions to give it the kind of flavor I'm used to with Sims 2, but it's keeping me interested with discovering things. I'll post a review of sorts later.
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Why Syzygy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-23-09 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. That would be cool!
Edited on Tue Jun-23-09 12:34 PM by Why Syzygy
I'll post a review of sorts later.


The "living neighborhood" is the one thing that sounds most handicapping to me. I make liberal use of "aging off" and "elixir of life" to customize the ages of each household. It would be nice if it could be engaged selectively, to turn on neighborhood aging for only certain lots, though. The ones you want to hurry up and pass over ;) . From what I've read at the BBS, it sounds like they are much more likely to die by accidental causes? Do you have control of the ghosts? That would be a good thing. As I mentioned, they are really annoying.

It just constantly trips me. I've been playing consistently for about a couple of years. I had the program since 2004 (it was a gift), but when I first tried it, the 3D manipulations threw me, and it ran unbearably slow. Something inspired me to give another try, and I'm SO glad I did. I discovered something entirely new just yesterday. Something they do that just makes you LOL. (can't remember what right now) Do you know why some of them insist on nude hot tubbing? What a bother! It's a mystery to me. In my earlier game, I aged the one guy that did that, just to hurry his passing (well he didn't really have any story lines either.) I just created two custom Sims and they are BOTH that way!

I rarely allow them to have TVs. There doesn't seem to be a unique sound control for JUST items like those. Right? I like the sounds turned up, but cannot stand those blaring TVs. I'm not using the Bingo game (?) (my mind is having an elder day) so much because they just flock to it every idle opportunity. It makes a good homing device, however. You will always know where they are!

What a hoot it is.
Look forward to your reveiw and any other stuff you have to share about the game.

eta: Greetings to Born_A_Truman! Sorry your thread has gone OT wild. It's fun though!
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RoyGBiv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-23-09 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. Yeah, sorry Truman ...

Did the original issue ever reach a resolution of any sort?
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madokie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-22-09 09:48 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Cloud seems to be working fine and it doesn't have to update like the other antivirus's do
So far I really like it. Check it out when you get a chance and let us know what you think, if you will. TIA :hi:
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Why Syzygy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-22-09 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. I will!
I already have it downloaded. After my sound scare, I installed Windows Live One Care and ran the virus/spyware scan. It's free for three months. Not aware of any conflicts of interest SO FAR. I've heard good things about Cloud. :hi:
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RoyGBiv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-23-09 12:24 AM
Response to Reply #15
17. Anti-virus ...
I've heard good things about Cloud, particular with regard to its small footprint. Anti-virus software is becoming bloated across the board. There are reasons for that, but some of the reasons aren't good ones.

To be perfectly honest though, I don't use a Windows machine often enough to offer a detailed comparison of any one specific anti-virus package over another beyond some generalities. (One generality is that Norton is still garbage ... just had to get that in there.) I use Windows at work because I have to, and the work computers have some variation of McAfee that's totally beyond my control. At home, I have Avast installed on the Windows partition and have never had an issue with it. None of the computers on which I've installed it that I still maintain from time to time have had any virus problems since installation.

On my Linux box, my security scheme is a combination of many things, including a virus scanner that works totally in the background and checks for virus definition updates every few hours. I check those logs occasionally, and the only viruses it has encountered were things I intentionally allowed it to encounter. None of those would have run on that machine anyway. The point of allowing the attempted infection was to make sure everything I had running was working properly and preventing passing on viruses to others via some networking mechanism.

But this brings me to my point about updates. I have the virus detection set to update so frequently in order to keep the virus definitions database as up-to-date as possible. Without a pre-defined virus definition, virus checkers work primarily with heuristic analysis, which is the geek term for guessing. It's educated guessing, but it's still guessing, and some virus scanners do it better than others. Heuristic analysis is often what leads to false positives as well. You'll note upon reading genuinely independent reviews of virus scanning software that the better rated software often has the problem of generating a higher incidence of false positives.

In any case, it's not that your virus scanner software doesn't *need* to update very frequently. It's simply that it doesn't. Often the difference between commercial virus software and the free versions is the frequency of definition database updates. Usually, you're not even allowed to connect to a server that updates more than once per day, so even if you are able to update frequently via the program itself, you're not actually getting anything new from it. That's how AVG works, IIRC. The free version has updates available once per day, with the commercial version something like every four hours or so. Hell, some companies don't even update their definitions more than a few times per week.

Lacking a specific definition for a specific virus, all your scanner has to work with is its heuristic analysis algorithm, which, again, can only guess.

As I've said before -- and I'm sorry to belabor the point -- the primary cause of virus infection is bad habits. I've been using this same Windows partition for something like three years without doing a reinstall. At one point I was using AVG, but I switched to Avast for various reasons. Checking through the logs just now, Avast has not even encountered an alert since it was installed. (Of course, a large part of this is due to the fact that I rarely even open a web browser on my Windows installation. I'm posting this from my Windows box because I wanted to check some things before writing this.) But I used Windows and DOS exclusively until five or six years ago, from the time I got my first MSDOS based machine back in 1988. I didn't even use a virus scanner until I got broadband Internet access somewhere around 2000. I can recall only a couple of actual infections that weren't intentionally allowed to happen, one from me stupidly executing a binary downloaded from Usenet without running it through a scanner, the other a trojan that got installed with some theme for the Windows eye-candy package Styler. Again, I failed to scan the file, thinking, ignorantly, that surely no commercial software company would allow such a thing to happen. I mean, I paid for Styler! Surely they could keep the third-party sites that distribute themes for their software free from malware.

Learned my lesson there, I did.

A virus scanner is backup. That's all. It's like the chain-link fencing behind the catcher on a baseball field. The ball most likely will not get through that fence, but if you repeatedly put your face up against it, you're going to get your nose smashed eventually, and the ball actually can go through those holes if it hits the fence just so. The best thing is not to stand behind the fence, or if you do, to stand back a fair piece.

In other words, if you only rely on virus protection software to save you from infections and frequently engage in behaviors that are prone to allowing infections, you will be infected. I guarantee it. This is one reason you won't (often) see me complaining how easily a Windows machine can get a virus infection nor bragging about a Linux box being less susceptible to them. If, as a Linux user, I rely on the latter, I'm setting myself up for catastrophic problems. I use the security tools available to me, and I attempt to practice good habits. In those cases where I intentionally engage in more dangerous behaviors, I set up as many chain link fences as I can, put on a helmet, pads, and carry around a catchers mitt of my own. I'll get burned one day probably anyway, which is why I keep my system backed up in a condition where I can restore it to a pristine state in an afternoon.

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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-23-09 09:59 AM
Response to Reply #17
22. What Roy said
And it can't be said OFTEN ENOUGH.

The prime determinant in whether you get infected, invaded, shanghaied, ripped off, whatever, is your own behavior. What you DO has consequences above and over the protection you HAVE.
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Why Syzygy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-23-09 10:35 AM
Response to Reply #22
23. That's why I'm not
worried about not running an active AV shield right now. After I gave up AVG, I ran that way for quite awhile with no issues. Strangely, with AVG there were always "Trojans" identified, but after abandoning it, none. I don't go to suspicious sites. Most of my browsing is done on less than a dozen sites. It also seems to me that spyware is much more prevalent than viruses.
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Why Syzygy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-29-09 02:45 AM
Response to Reply #5
27. Well. I'm using Safari now...
at least for the time being. It isn't compatible with the Google toolbar, so many of the research features aren't available, nor the built in spell check :( . IE went "not responding" when I tried to view a playlist index on youtube. I tried three times. Had to end task each time. This was after I found a small program online to reset the favicons. The DU icon was showing the favicon for first Windows Live One Care, which I'm running every day right now. Then it switched to the Google icon. There's a nice little utility to get them all to function correctly. Are you having that issue with the tabs? There are still many things I'm not familiar with on Safari. Hopefully there will be a way to add on a spell check.

I also had to uninstall Cloud. It was the best I've tried so far. My game was running slow, so I turned Cloud to "off" to see if that made an improvement. It would not come back "on"; not even by restarting from the .exe file. I play the game offline with Zone Alarm set to block all Internet access.

hmm.. just noticed that "favicons" is underlined in red, so apparently there IS spell check somewhere.
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Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-22-09 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. There was no way to enable any add on, including Java
in the version they stuck me with a few weeks ago.

Since all I use MSIE for is playing a few stupid timewaster games, I grew to dislike the whole idea very quickly.

I'll pass, thanks.
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Why Syzygy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-22-09 02:37 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. I have
Flash and Google toolbar listed as add ons. Some page prompted IE8 for permission to install Java. I declined. I especially enjoy the recent open/closed pages view and function. As I understand it, Chrome offers that as well.

Chrome may also have the feature of multiple "home pages". IE8 launch opens three preset tabs. I haven't figured out how to launch just one of them, as I would like to do most of the time after already in browsing mode. I by no means have the full functionality discovered.
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RoyGBiv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-23-09 12:49 AM
Response to Reply #12
19. FWIW ...

All that has been available in Firefox and before that Opera for a long time. These elements are things MS has copied from others.

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Why Syzygy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-23-09 01:52 AM
Response to Reply #19
21. I didn't know FireFox had
multiple home page settings. I finally did realize I could launch with previous tabs open. Also, I never saw any of the recent page thumbnails. Wish I had.

Let me tell you what I think hosed my system. I was trying to rollback to an earlier version of FF. I forget why now, but it's somewhere in this group. When I used Revo Uninstaller for FF, the registry entries presented for 'possible' deletion included "FTP", "HTTP" and "HTTPS". That gave me pause. I don't remember the entire string, and wasn't sure if they were relating specific to FF or Windows. I figured if it were Windows, that the OS would regenerate them on restart, like it does so many other files. So I allowed them to be deleted. It never recovered from the reboot after that. Check Disk came on, I aborted it once. Wouldn't start in Safe Mode. I finally let it run Chkdsk, but it still wouldn't load. I went to my restore CD, and it informed me there was nothing on the HD. Need to format. End of the line. I was actually pretty grateful because the only other time I've run into mandatory Chkdsk, I didn't have a hard drive at all when it got done. That was my '95 system, which I was still running in 2002 mostly from obstinacy at not wanting IE to be part of the OS. So, I'm relieved to still be in business, no matter the files I lost.
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