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jabeguy Donating Member (19 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 02:28 PM
Original message
Pure Energy Systems Network +
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 02:28 PM by jabeguy
Here are some GREAT sites for those interested in thinking outside the box and believe outside the (Soon to be old) western science box of thinking.

www.pureenergysystems.com
www.peswiki.com
www.freeenergynews.com
www.PESN.com

Myspace pages for these organizations (get updates on myspace bulletins):
www.myspace.com/pesnetwork
www.myspace.com/freeenergynowpodcast

If you know anyone with working technology like this, there is an award program w/ protection from the powers-that-be:
www.aero2012.com/en/award.html
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FiveGoodMen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 02:38 PM
Response to Original message
1. Yeah, that western science stuff hasn't come up with much, has it?
What forum am I on again?
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jabeguy Donating Member (19 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 02:45 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. You are in the science forum. lol
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 02:50 PM by jabeguy
Did I say science hasn't? Ofcourse science is outstanding, and has brought us to serious developments! DUH! And so what is "wrong" with thinking outside the box? Take a look at this stuff before ridiculing in your mind about it. One can thinkin' of new ideas, without letting go of current stuff. Be skeptical! Its healthy. It is the way to progress. We can't just accept everything at face value, or there is no point to life.
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FiveGoodMen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 02:50 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. What part of "(Soon to be old) western science box of thinking" WASN'T a slam on science?
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phantom power Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 03:46 PM
Response to Original message
4. Science is not a box. It's a methodology.
The only "constraints" that it operates under are that arguments must be based on observations, repeatable experiments and falsifiable hypotheses.

I'm somewhat suspicious of anybody who thinks of those constraints as a "box."
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HiFructosePronSyrup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 04:10 PM
Response to Original message
5. So are you one of the cons, or one of the marks?
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caraher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 05:10 PM
Response to Original message
6. Like I said about your other link, this looks like a mix of reasonable ideas and nonsense
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 05:12 PM by caraher
These folks are cleverly mixing some legitimate ideas (such as the work on what amounts to creating much more efficient solar cells or tapping geothermal energy) with complete nonsense (like anything that Tom Bearden does).

You need several shakers' worth of salt for any of the schemes based on supposed new physics. And bear in mind, I say this not because their ideas clash with everything I've learned in my physics education but because their writings betray a profound misunderstanding of the conventional physics they purport to overthrow. Their "explanations" and "radical new theories" are full of jargon and buzzwords that sound impressive to the uninitiated but are literally meaningless. For instance, I read Bearden's web pages and what he says of the relationship among classical electromagnetic theory, gravitation and quantum mechanics as conventionally understood is hopelessly wrong. I admire his energy and dedication but his work is ignored not because it challenges orthodox physics but because it is sheer gibberish.

My "sniff tests" for crackpottery include the following:

- Conspiracy theories about why their work is ignored/suppressed

- Conspiracy theories that the government is hiding magical technologies for various nefarious reasons

- The person is hawking (usually self-published) books, tapes, etc. to support their work

- Evident lack of conventional formal education in the field of their "breakthroughs" (Many of these folks are clearly quite bright and often accomplished in some field such as medicine, but usually do not hold advanced degrees in physics or electrical or mechanical engineering. True, there are a few who have done great work without a PhD in their field, but these people are remarkable because they are the exception.)

- Connections with unconventional religious/spiritual movements (For instance, Steven Greer, described by the PES site you list as "One of the most knowledgeable and best people to coordinate the funding, promotion and release of zero-point energy," holds his PhD from Maharishi University, the Iowa school devoted to Transcendental Meditation and home of frequent "Natural Law Party" presidential candidate John Hagelin. I see from the school's web site that it's PhD is offered either in Management or "Maharishi Vedic Science" in a program that seems more about TM than science. Hagelin is an interesting guy, too. He has a PhD from MIT and evidently did some very good work in theoretical particle physics early in his career, but is really more into Eastern spirituality and TM than anything recognizable as good science. Also, I want to clarify that this "sniff test" category is not anti-Eastern or New Age religion/spirituality; I'm just as skeptical of the credentials of someone who went to Liberty University or any of the other Christian fundamentalist schools. The issue is the whole approach to science. If you come to your scientific work with a predetermined set of answers based on your religious beliefs, you're a lot less likely to let the "reality therapy" of experimental data properly inform your understanding of the world.

- "Theories of Everything" It's very hard to advance knowledge even within one fairly narrow field. That's why scientists specialize. Crackpots are far more likely to make highly extravagant claims about their pet theories. For instance, Tom Bearden doesn't just put forward a radical new theory of electromagnetism. He also has an elaborate reading of 20th century history based on secret science. He purports to explain a huge array of cataclysms (hurricanes, sinking submarines, the Challenger disaster) as the result of Soviet (or, more recently, Japanese organized crime) use of this suppressed science to create magical weapons.

- Emphasis on their work being contrary to conventional wisdom. Members of physics departments often receive unsolicited mail from "lone geniuses" regarding their pet theories and these usually include a proclamation that "Einstein was wrong." Well, no kidding - Einstein was wrong about a lot of things. Most scientific ideas don't pan out. Einstein is an iconic figure because of what he did right, not because he was infallible.

Yes, I've read Kuhn. I understand that scientific revolutions, by definition, entail a radical overthrow of the previous scientific orthodoxy. But the architects of these revolutions have always been perfectly capable of understanding the science their insights would overthrow. Pretty much every "lone genius" I run across either completely omits a detailed critique of the orthodox science or provides one so riddled with misapprehensions that they literally do not know what they are talking about. People who can scarcely give a coherent account of the "old science" are not the vanguard of a new science. They are simply wrong - or, to quote the all-time best science insult ever, "not even wrong."
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rayofreason Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
7. What Bullshit!
From link 1-

Interview - David Wells, Weather Control Via Newman-Like Device - A dozen years ago, while pursuing a possible overunity machine, Mr. Wells discovered that the machine was effecting local weather. Several machines and years later, the effect is much better understood and refined.

From link 2-
January 7, 2008

Suppression / Organizations > PES Interview with Steve Greer Transcribed - One of the most knowledgeable and best people to coordinate the funding, promotion and release of zero-point energy, Dr. Steven Greer discusses free energy suppression and his personal effort to bring forth the technology, including his plan to spearhead the massive public disclosure of a key technology, to help ignite the new clean energy revolution poised to begin. (PESWiki; Jan. 7, 2008)

Cold Fusion > G.E.M. Technologies "Omega Energy Cell" - Recent tests by Princeton Electrochemical Engineer confirm significant overunity in what is alleged to be a cold fusion reaction, capable of powering all modern machines. Allegedly, a device the size of a cantaloupe could power a vehicle. (PESWiki; Jan. 7, 2008)


Weather control, zero-point energy, cold fusion!!!! What a trifecta! More than enough reason to call bullshit. But the aero2012 link takes the cake. They claim to have a network that "...includes 'A-list' celebrities, Nobel Prize winners, current and former heads of State and millions of people who follow our work." Yeah, sure. The CEO headed up the "Disclosure Project", and held a press conference "Over 1 billion people heard of the press conference" (another "Yeah, sure")) . From the disclosure project website-

The Disclosure Project is a nonprofit research project working to fully disclose the facts about UFOs, extraterrestrial intelligence, and classified advanced energy and propulsion systems. We have over 400 government, military, and intelligence community witnesses testifying to their direct, personal, first hand experience with UFOs, ETs, ET technology, and the cover-up that keeps this information secret.


So there we have it. UFOs and ETs as well. I guess that that wraps up the whole nutball of wax.
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NickB79 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 06:42 PM
Response to Original message
8. Come on guys, be open-minded. After all, they have a MySpace page!
All the great thinkers had them. Einstein, Galileo, Hawking, Linnaeus.

You should see the bitching wallpaper that Newton has up on his MySpace page. I mean, that guy has like 1,000 friends!
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