Check this horrible shit out!

[Jamastiene]

Beware, the disease of ignorance and hate is evident in this post, but I had to share. I know this isn't a place to go for therapy, but I just had to hear the reaction to this on DU. My question is: Am I wrong for being horrified that I am surrounded by people who think this way?

Here are the details:
I am currently taking an online Psychology course. This is the response to a question the instructor asked, posted by someone in the class.

Question asked by instructor:
"The issue of whether psychological disorders are caused primarily by nature (hereditary factors) or nurture (environmental factors) continues. Pick two of the psychological disorders presented in the chapter and prepare arguments for both the nature and the nurture issue for both disorders."

Answer by student:
"Is the person we become a product of innate, inborn tendencies, or a reflection of experiences and upbringing? This is the famous "nature vs. nuture" debate. This debate is argued over the infulece that heredity, or genes, vs. enviroment, or experience, has on thought and behavior of an individual. The big question is : How do genes and experience interact to influence people?

nature- hereditary factors

nurture- enviromental factors"

<snip because the first part doesn't fit this forum and isn't relative>

"2.) Sexual and Gender-Identity Disorder-the desire to become...or the idea that one really is.... a member of the other sex. nature-hereditarly gender confused children tend to have gender confused parents. If the parents are gender confused and or are gay or homosexual than the child is to be so too. A child is a direct copy of the parents. Although it takes a heterosexual couple to make a baby, to say if one parent is gay than that gene will distribut to the offspring. Therefore this making the child homosexual also. Seeing how genes are shared and 24 chromosomes from one parent and 24 from the other. One set will contain homosexual traits. nurture- gender confused people grow and learn to this way. Through society they are born "normal" , but see other gender confused kids and learn how to "act" this way."

<snip>

Am I wrong to be furious that everyone in the class pretty much agrees with the person on this view?

I know I am not supposed to hate people back, but dammit, what am I supposed to do with my outrage? Please tell me what to do with my outrage here.

[readmoreoften]

1. Where did this professor get her degree? Liberty University?

What on-line university is this? I want the professor's name and I want to protest. They are going against the APA.

[Jamastiene]

9. The professor didn't teach it this way.

Here is what her lecture notes said about the entire issue including her merciful definition of pedophilia: (I'm glad she went ahead and defined that or the student would have "went there.")

"Sexual and Gender-Identity Disorders
A. Sexual dysfunction—loss or impairment of ordinary sexual responses, e.g. erectile dysfunction (formerly impotence) and female sexual arousal disorder (formerly frigidity); normal to have occasional problems; ED can be the result of actual physical problems or medications, but both mostly result of trauma/stress/anxiety
B. Paraphilias—obtaining sexual arousal using unconventional means
1. Fetishism—when sexual arousal is attained through the use of inanimate objects, such as shoes, underwear, leather
2. Pedophilia—when a person has sexual fantasies, urges, or behaviors that involve prepubescent children; most child abuse is perpetrated by someone known to the child, often a relative or someone close to the family; perpetrators have often been sexually molested or physically abused as a child, feel inadequate in adult relationships; remember that sexual assault is about power and control over another person, usually someone more helpless
3. Gender-Identity Disorder—when person believes that are of the opposite sex or when they desire to be the opposite sex; causal factors = prenatal hormonal imbalances, family dynamics and learning experiences
"

Honestly, in this case, I know the instructor. Her attitude isn't as bad as the student in this case. She definitely didn't turn me away from rape counseling after I told her I was a lesbian. She does hold the view that it's mentioned in the Bible as a sin, but she definitely doesn't hold the conventional conservative views of extreme hatred. I know that because she got me through my stress after being raped free of charge just like she does the straight women. I would only classify her as slightly homophobic in her "sin" view, but like I said, she didn't teach it the way the student posted.


Edited to add the name of the school:
Richmond Community College in Hamlet, NC

[foreigncorrespondent]

19. Then she should...

...be failing this student, period.

[readmoreoften]

26. Yes, the student should fail. /nt

[foreigncorrespondent]

32. Yep!

There is simply no room for bigotry in the psychology world. Regardless of anyones political or religious belief.

[pepperbear]

43. especially since booboo got it wrong. n/t

[foreigncorrespondent]

17. That is exactly what I was thinking!

They are going against the APA.

The psychologist I was seeing a few years ago was a member of the APA (even though he was an Aussie practicing in Australia) and he was just so supportive of me. He had no hidden agenda.

[jhrobbins]

49. Yeah, he was wrong about the disorder, but he was also wrong..

about the biology. This kid needs to ask for his tuition back if he is being taught that children are 'direct copies' of their parents. If this were the case all siblings would be exactly the same - what was he thinking. There are millions of opportunities for differences with one set of parents.

[sinkingfeeling]

2. Is your fellow student 6 or 7 years old? (Based on sentence structure

and spelling, I had to ask).

You've done what you need to do with your 'outrage'. You're venting it here and that's OK. Now you need to complete your assignment by discussing how homosexuality is a natural occurring sexuality throughout nature. Be very clear in your argument and use any stats you can find that disproves this idiot's 'they are born normal, but ...learn to act this way'. (Which is in contrast to his first comments that homosexuality is passed via genes from one or both parents).

In the end, you got to vent. You'll get an A+ on the assignment and this retard will flunk out.

[Jamastiene]

27. They routinely pass students who write just like that.

My English teacher had his hands full last semester. He finally admitted that any revisions I had to do in his class were nitpicking on his part. He told me he had way bigger problems with the majority of students who couldn't even write. He couldn't fail them all, because there would be public outcry. The students knew that too. He ended up making them revise their papers endlessly and passed them for the effort. I hated his class the whole time I was in it, but basically thought I could make friends with him if he just wasn't my English teacher. I am thankful he held me to a higher standard than the illiterates in my class. He turned out to be a person I would count as a friend. The staff and teachers at the school think I am super smart because the example in my OP here is the standard. It's beyond sad.

[mother earth]

3. First off, I'd check into that online school's credentials. This is

garbage. If everyone is pretty much agreeing with this--you have to wonder about them too. It's just not using common sense, much less documented studies.

[Jamastiene]

10. The school is a community college that just happens

to offer the class online. I took it in order to get my elective class credit. It was not voluntary. Richmond Community College in Hamlet, NC is the name. Here is a link to further info on accreditation:
http://www.edref.com/school_list/richmond-community-college

Btw, the book was pretty much in line with what the instructor taught, not what this student posted.

[mother earth]

14. Obviously the book, the course & the professor are out of

touch with reality if they don't "get" that this concept is completely outdated & ignorant. I would file a formal complaint about this with the school.

[AndyA]

4. What bullshit! Your classmates are all idiots if they agree!

Surely there must be tons of research and documentation out there that proves this "theory" is false. I know lots of people with one gay parent, and they're straight as an arrow, in spite of being exposed to the gay lifestyle over the years.

This is just pure crap and speculation. I'd fight it with the facts.

Do your classmates bring their clubs to class, or do they leave them outside next to the Dinosaur parking area? Are their names Fred, Barney, Wilma, and Betty?

[Jamastiene]

11. No, but one wonders.

I have also wondered this: Do they not believe in evolution because they haven't evolved yet? If they haven't evolved, they may not believe in it because they haven't done it. Otherwise, I am not sure.

In answer to your question about the clubs:
They use their clubs in class regularly on anyone who disagrees with them. The term "Bible thumping" means using the Bible as a weapon over the head of anyone who doesn't agree with them. (Disclaimer: This is not in reference to any liberal Christians on DU, just the so-called Christians I am surrounded by in real life in my hometown)

[catmother]

5. all i can say is WTF?

[Jamastiene]

12. I was dumbfounded.

My response was pretty sarcastic. I didn't go into details or fight in this case, because this is my last day dealing with this class. I will be thankfully fininshed after I take the final test today.

[catmother]

18. good luck to you. i hope you're feeling a little better after

talking to the intelligent people on the DU.:hi:

[Jamastiene]

25. Thank you, I am feeling better now.

It is through talking to the fine people of DU that my faith in humanity is restored. It is so nice to have experiences to counteract the idiocy of people who know nothing about what it is to be gay. I thank you all from the bottom of my heart for being here and for letting me know that I am right to take offense to that student's assumptions.

[Kutjara]

6. The author of the piece tells you exactly what their problem is.

Seemingly, they believe that having 48 chromosomes is normal. Perhaps it is in their inbred, fundie family, but most of the rest of us have 46. The damaging effects of all this extra genetic material is evident in their inability to spell, punctuate, construct a coherent sentence or structure a logical argument.

In short, the author is subnormal and should be regarded as deserving of pity and, perhaps, some sort of rudimentary vocational education. What the problem with the rest of your class is, I have no idea. Maybe they're just regular idiots.

[peacebird]

13. Beautiful!

:toast:

[Jamastiene]

15. ROFLMAO

Thank you. I needed to hear a logical sane person analyze this idiot. I was just so dumbfounded by what I read that I couldn't think straight, but then again, I'm not straight, so you know. I love your interpretation. I love intelligent people. Thank God for the fine people of DU.

[Sapphocrat]

7. Wrong to be furious? Of course not.

I think your instructor isn't qualified to teach this course. I'd be more furious about being subjected to this kind of stealth bigotry than I would by the content of it.

(Mind you, I don't get very furious at this stuff anymore, but only because I've grown practically numb to it, and I'm currently dwelling in the pit of they're-going-to-kill-us-all-anyway resignation, but...)

Since you're probably not going to be able to convince this lynch mob that they're wrong (which they are; I can get a second opinion from my sister the ex-geneticist if you need ammo), what I would do with that outrage is channel it into a calm, logic-based rebuttal, and reframe the whole thing as an ethics question. Take their ball and run with it. Throw in a few "logical" arguments from William Shockley and the rest of the eugenics crowd, and then ask them: If they're convinced they're right, what are they going to do about it? Start aborting gay fetuses?

P.S. If I'm a "direct copy" of my parents, then I have been wrong about being a lesbian for the past 45 years -- I must be straight!

[foreigncorrespondent]

16. Uh-oh!

Should I be worried. ;)

[Sapphocrat]

30. Only if...

...Jamastiene's sorry excuse for an "instructor" (who probably believes "The Flintstones" is an accurate representation of man's interaction with dinosaurs) turns out to be correct.

In other words, no. :)

[foreigncorrespondent]

33. Oh...

...thank God for that!!! I was worried all day. ;)

[jarnocan]

8. very disturbing to think

this crap is getting 'taught' as fact at a college level. IMHO they need to have better quality control for online college classes. Having a degree should mean something.

[Jamastiene]

24. Your view on this restores my faith in

humanity. In my daily real life, I am surrounded by this idiocy. I come to DU and hear opinions that are more like my own. One psychologist once called me a "cultural isolate" because I am against homophobia despite the fact that most everyone else around this area is homophobic. It's disheartening to be surrounded by that type of bullshit on a daily basis in life. Thanks to the fine people of DU, my faith in humanity gets restored when I share my experiences. It's my unofficial therapy. Thanks for being alive and being here.

[foreigncorrespondent]

20. This is exactly why...

...bible thumpers should not become psychologists. Psychology is a science and bible thumpers don't agree with science.

I would hate for these students to actually pass this course become practicing physiologists and be let lose of the world. Then one day for a gay person to walk into their office and face shit like this.

[Jamastiene]

28. So true.

They base their version of science on the Bible and eschew anything the real scientists have to say on the subject of science. Their logic, or should I say extreme lack of logic, never ceases to amaze me.

[foreigncorrespondent]

34. Never ceases to amaze me either!

If they want to follow the bible then they need to stay out of science all together, because the two just don't mix.

[tulsakatz]

21. this person clearly has no personal experience with gays...

If he/she had some personal experience, they would know it doesn't work that way.

I know it has not been proven but homosexuality is not the kind of thing that is passed down from one generation to the next. And even if it were, that kind of thing usually skips a generation anyway!!
So just because a person is gay, that does not mean that the child of that person will be gay too!!

As to the environment issue, that doesn't make any sense either. Just because a person is around gay people doesn't mean it will make someone gay purely from being 'exposed' to it! I mean, it's not a disease!!

I speak from experience on this too. I spent many yrs hanging out in gay bars and not once was I ever tempted to have a gay experience or relationship.

[Jamastiene]

29. Thank you.

Too bad people like that student will never let themselves learn the truth.

[tulsakatz]

36. you're welcome....

....if that person remains in their small, limited universe (and there is good reason to assume they will), then it's very likely that they will never know the value of a diverse culture.

And just because someone is different, doesn't make them wrong, it just makes them different.

[mzteris]

22. then how do they account for the fact that the

VAST majority of gays/lesbians have STRAIGHT parents?!?

duh.

[Jamastiene]

23. They say that doesn't happen.

Their explanation is that the person is confused and just needs to find the "right person" of the opposite sex to be normal. Hence, I got raped over 10 years ago by people with that mindset. I still like women and I am a woman. They were wrong.

[NMMNG]

31. This imbecile

obviously has no real knowledge of genetics, nature or nurture.

1. Humans have 46 chromosomes, not 48 (though the inbreds you go to school with may differ).

2. If gay offspring only come from a gay parent, why is it that most of us have two heterosexual parents?

3. Where is his/her proof that "gender-confused" kids come from "gender-confused" parents?

[Jamastiene]

44. They don't need proof. Logic flies out the window when

dealing with those types of people.

[Ian David]

35. Well, if this were actually true...

then encouraging gay people to "turn straight" or to stay in the closet and have sham heterosexual marriages, would simply encourage the breeding of more "gay genes."

If this person's theory were true, then legalizing gay marriage would encourage gay people to stop marrying straight people (and breeding)which and would then lead to a reduction in the gay population.

In any case, I'd bring-up stuff about "The God-Spot" in the brain and "The God Gene."

[Jamastiene]

37. I know what you mean.

I finished up the work for that class. I am glad it is over now. I'll still talk to my psychologist friend who taught the class, because I know she didn't teach them that way. I went back and checked all her lecture notes and searched the index in the book. The only mention of homosexuality was that gay people wanted the same relationships as straight people and tended to split house chores up a little more equally. Also, that when gay people have children, one partnet does tend to do a little more of the PTA, soccer practice trips, etc. duties. That was all I could find from searching the index and re-reading those sections in the book. Nothing I could find that was taught even came close to what that student said. I was pretty sarcastic in my response to her. It was hard not to be.

I do appreciate your response to this topic, because before sharing this with DU, I was pretty upset.

[sui generis]

38. Occam's razor

1. not everyone who is gay is gender confused
2. the student's answers are speculative and derivative
3. gender identity seems to be pretty polar, while "gayness" seems to both exist on a sliding scale and can even be temporally more one thing than the other.
4. we have been around since the dawn of time, when women were hunting boars and men were sitting at home knitting, or at least, hunting and knitting were family affairs.

gender identity interpreted by 21st century standards is utter bullshit. Men wore bigger wigs than women in 18th century france and england. I would call out the instructor for presenting this highly marginal and non-standard view of sexuality and gender as unqualified to do so.

[Jamastiene]

41. Another thing I noticed was that

the student automatically confused homosexuality with transgendered people. I personally think neither is unnatural or "learned," but I do see them as two separate states of being. I sure will be glad when I know I am finished with that class and community college altogether. I am beyond ready to move on.

[kevinbgoode]

39. You need to send the text of this exchange to the department

head. . .and to other administrative officials. Ask them to prove the basis for this discussion and its contribution to the class, and ask why the instructor did not appear to question this point of view at all.

[tonekat]

40. What Sort of Accreditation Does this School Have?

Because if it's accredited by any nationally functioning organization, or state (maybe) or, for that matter, anything beyond a local jurisdiction, the requirements of the granted accreditation will extend to the quality of course content and methodology, and that will include not teaching fallacy as facts! Nor encouraging the acceptance of fallacy.

Accreditation is a very valuable thing for any institution to have. It's a bragging right, money in the bank. So questioning that may have some effect.

Because this nonsense needs to stop.

[Jamastiene]

42. Here is the info and a link to the source for the info on acreditation.

"Richmond Community College is accredited regionally by the Southern Association of Colleges and Schools, Commission on Colleges (SACSCC). The school is state accredited."

http://www.edref.com/school_list/richmond-community-college

They even have a rule in the handbook that states that it is against the rules to pick on a student because of sexual orientation, but I have seen that it is just for looks time and time again. I have heard several teachers say nasty things about gay people. The school is in Hamlet, NC, the next town over from where I live. This whole place is a cesspool of obnoxious fundies. I wish I knew where to begin to fight them.

[racaulk]

45. That student is a complete dumbass.

"If the parents are gender confused and or are gay or homosexual than the child is to be so too. A child is a direct copy of the parents."

That's a complete load of bull. Both of my parents are heterosexual, and I am not. (In fact, they're both Republicans as well!) And there are countless cases of the opposite being true, where children raised in households with two parents of the same gender growing up to be heterosexual. And people with gender dysphoria certainly didn't "learn" that from their parents, I believe that to be very innate. I'm sure Gwen Araujo and Brandon Teena would tell us the same if they were alive today.

"Through society they are born "normal" , but see other gender confused kids and learn how to "act" this way."

Please. I would challenge that student to find one documented case where someone with gender dysphoria claimed that they learned how to "act" transexual after they met "other gender confused kids." Just one. I imagine that student will be hard pressed to do so.

"Seeing how genes are shared and 24 chromosomes from one parent and 24 from the other. One set will contain homosexual traits."

That student needs to go back to Freshman year and retake Biology 101. Each gamete (the sperm cell and the egg cell) contains 23 chromosomes, not 24.

Homosexuality and gender dysphoria are not diseases, ignorance is. And your classmate is obviously suffering from it.

[Obamarama]

46. What do you expect from someone thinking humans have 48 chromosones...

And I quote from your classmate's reply: "Seeing how genes are shared and 24 chromosomes from one parent and 24 from the other...". When I took Human Physiology and Cellular Biology - hell, when I took MIDDLE SCHOOL biology for that matter - I distinctly remember learning we have 46 chromosones...you know, 23 from each parent. Am I the only one who learned this basic fact???:sarcasm:

It would appear whichever chromosone affects human intelligence is clearly flawed in your cyber-classmate. The asshole better get genetic counseling before he/she "nurtures" any equally stupid offspring.

[and-justice-for-all]

47. I dont have Gay Parent(s)...

So their anaylsis is bunk to me...means shit.

[Kerrytravelers]

48. I would print out a copy of this spew and turn it in along with any other

supporting documents when you turn this class in as advised above.