When it comes to class size, smaller isn't always better

[BridgeTheGap]

Budget cuts! Layoffs! Bigger classes! Oh my! Given the mini-Wisconsins erupting around the country, it's not surprising that parents are worried about their children's schools. At least 45 states will face some budget shortfall for the fiscal year that begins this July, according to The Center on Budget and Policy Priorities. Last week the school board of Providence, Rhode Island gave pink slips to the city's entire teaching force. Rumors of class sizes as large as 60 students circulated in Detroit.

Reality check: There will be teachers teaching in Providence next year. Similar sky-is-falling scenarios will be averted in Detroit and elsewhere, too. But that doesn't mean that there will not be fewer teachers—and larger classes—in many places when school opens this fall. Secretary of Education Arne Duncan may well be right that scarce resources will be the "new normal" for schools.
(Is the Golden Age of Education Spending Over?)

The looming budget cuts are putting the question of class size front and center in local communities and the national education debate. A proposal to raise class sizes in Idaho by laying off more than 700 teachers led to protests around the state. Many other states and cities are considering changes to rules about class size.

Read more: http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,2056571,00.html#ixzz1FYZ2mrdw

[hedgehog]

1. OK, having a good teacher is better than having a bad teacher.

But, if you have a good teacher, are you better off with a class of 45? 35? 25?
Clearly it's assumed there is a variable depending on subject - that's why we have huge lecture classes in college and smaller recitations.

In any case, I'm more interested in the metric used to determine whether a teacher is good or bad. I find it hard to believe anyone has a metric which accounts for the subject (AP English vs remedial English), the students and the bias of the supervisor.

[bluestateguy]

2. Having resources is perhaps more important

A small class is nice, but it makes little difference if you have out of date textbooks, no computers, broken science lab equipment, no heating or air conditioning in the building and a school riddled with crime and violence.

[Zoeisright]

3. Bull. Shit.

Are you trying to say that individual attention isn't needed in the classroom? This is one of the dumbest things I've ever read.

[HereSince1628]

6. I'll need to dig for them, but I've read and I know I have studies for science education

that show losses of student performance related to class size as the class gets larger than 14. The larger the class the worse the students perform. I'm pretty sure they were articles summarizing research in the Chronicle of Higher Education.

The importance of class size is common sensical for most people...

Well, considering how certain majorities were won recently, I should probably say...it makes sense to those who don't think that teaching is the one-way transmission of information.

[groovedaddy]

8. lte time? n/t

[shraby]

4. Some children would do very well no matter what the

class size, but the vast majority would not. They need smaller classes to get more individual attention to help them learn what they need to know.
If they don't get the help they need, it doesn't take long before they are irreparibly behind and then is when they drop out of school and life.

[eilen]

5. Who knows what is next.

After warehousing the kids in large rooms without proper ventilation, feeding them chemical processed goo and giving them behavioral training to fill in the correct circles on the annual exams, the purpose of all this linear education will be moot as the jobs are scarce and the test training has prepared everyone for absolutely nothing. After some reflection, TPTB will gin up more wars to deal with the excess well-subjugated humanage. At the bare minimum, they may arm the teachers with tasers for the most unruly. Next agenda item: they will burn the libraries next and thus will begin our new "Dark Ages."


I find it interesting that with all this teamwork training emphasis our educational system has (insisted upon) provided, they leave the kids to take the tests alone without synergistic problem-solving brain-storming action sessions.

You'll have to forgive, I am recovering from a mandatory mission-training inservice, a ridiculous waste of time, personnel and resources. Religion, pap, self improvement and continuous quality improvement models-- If I really needed that crap I would watch Oprah.

[Electric Monk]

7. It's better having an abusive alcoholic deadbeat dad than none at all?

The RW is trying to frame the public debate, and so far they seem to be winning. At least they are at AOL/Time/Warner/CNN corp media, et al. I wonder why that might be?

[Starry Messenger]

9. Um, yes it is.

Anyone who says otherwise is lying.

[proud2BlibKansan]

10. Baloney

No surprise to see Time continuing its attack on teachers and education.

[goddess40]

11. What about the teacher?

Say the teacher has 3 classes per day with 60 kids per class. She assigns a composition and than has to read and grade 180 compositions. If I were that teacher I'd probably be pretty careful about assigning long, involved papers. Wouldn't this be dumbing down education. And I'm not blaming the teacher in any way.

[lutefisk]

12. Good point, but make that 5 or 6 classes per day

When I left the k-12 classroom several years ago we had 160-180 students per teacher in middle school. The high school teachers had well over 200. That was with a 5 class teaching load. Now, with class size and teaching load restrictions being eliminated, what will the limit be? And I'm sure all the non-licensed teachers being allowed to teach will do a great job with huge classes.