What we don't know about Central Falls

[proud2BlibKansan]

1. Attendance rate. Do these kids come to school? Does their attendance meet NCLB standards? Most people who aren't intimately familiar with this despicable piece of legislation don't realize that if your school attendance isn't at a specific percentage (this year I think it is 95%) it doesn't matter what your test scores are, you don't meet AYP. It's also still an undisputed fact that actually attending school is an important component of achievement.

2. Parent involvement. How many parents attended their most recent PT conferences? Open House? How many are involved in PTA?

3. Discipline. How many kids were referred to the office today? What is their suspension rate? What are the offenses? How many have been referred to the district hearing officer?

4. Transient population. I heard a counselor from this school on the radio tonight and he said a higher percentage of kids at this school move in and out of school than graduate. States don't typically exclude transient population when figuring graduation rates. And someone is going to have to explain how they can educate kids and graduate them when they aren't even in that school anymore.

5. Subgroups. Always a test score killer. How many sped kids? ELL? Minorities?

[Robb]

1. You are asking DUers to have all the facts before defending their opinions to the death?

I applaud the effort. :D

[Captain Hilts]

2. For years Central Falls was the drug capital of New England. That was in the '80s. nt

[proud2BlibKansan]

7. Might be an interesting lunch hour at that high school

:)

[paulsby]

15. as a former rhode island resident

i remember that well. central falls was the running joke. we didn't tell polack jokes. we told central falls jokes

[femmocrat]

3. K&R You make excellent points.

But we DO know that it's all the teachers' fault! Fire those lazy parasites who don't want to put in any extra effort!!!

:eyes:

[mattvermont]

4. I can spot

a competent teacher anywhere. Good for asking the pertinent questions.

[sandnsea]

5. No. We don't know the SOLUTIONS implemented

to address those problems.

Listing problems without creating solutions and a plan of action to address them - is called making excuses.

Just trying to hold you accountable.

[baldguy]

6. What we do know: The problems can't be solved by wishing them away.

[proud2BlibKansan]

8. Your point is ??

[baldguy]

10. Firing the teachers isn't a solution to the problem - it's a symptom.

[FBaggins]

9. Some answers

1) Really poor... but reportedly significantly improved over the last couple years.

2) Almost certainly very poor. People working multiple minimum wage jobs rarely have the option of saying "I'm taking off a little early today to meet with my kid's teachers" - the reporting has reflected very low parent participation in meetings related to the current situation.

3) Don't know.

4) The highest in the state.

5) About as "score killer" as you could wish to avoid. ESL and minorities at very high levels... don't know about sped.


One you left off:

6) The rate of students who go to college: Very low, but substantially higher than just a few years back.


Much of this was covered in that interview I linked to you last night (that started off with Gallo but 2/3 of it was with the school guidance counselor who was references in an earlier article.

[mike_c]

11. I think the important point isn't that the OP know those answers...

...but rather that they be part of the debate about the labor dispute at Central Falls. For the most part, I don't think they have been, and they should be. Lots of views have been expressed by folks who have little of the relevant information in hand.

There is a certain irony here, i.e. that one of the most difficult things to teach is critical thinking, and when debates about teaching revolve around and around issues that reflect lapses in critical thought on the part of the debaters, it makes me want to run screaming from the room.

[FBaggins]

12. That's a common misperception.

There are two different arguments here.

1) Does the law make sense?

2) Given the law, how should the district/school/union/teachers respond?


The debate about whether those factors should have been considered is long over. That debate should have been held back when the law was passed and/or when a new national administration took over. It has essentially been determined that none of that matters. The test scores and graduation rate say the school sucks and it isn't "fixed" within the given remediation period... we move on to argument 2.

Now... it isn't too late to hold that debate (#1) in other parts of the country and maybe save some schools where this would happen in a couple years... but that debate is over in this case.

We're left with argument #2... and one of the errors that the union has been making has been to continue to relitigate argument #1.

[mike_c]

13. I understand-- I was talking about the public debate in which...

...we nonparticipants seek to understand the dispute, how we got to this point, and the context in which argument #2 takes place. I agree with you-- in the specific case of Central Falls, the issue is at #2, not #1. But for the rest of us to understand how the union AND the school district approach #2, context is useful and illuminating.

[FBaggins]

14. I agree.

We should certainly have the conversation re: preparing to bring #1 back into the public debate.

I fear that it will not be possible until a few years down the road if these ideas have demonstrably failed. "Not the teachers' fauly" is too tough a sell. Not because it isn't necessarily true, but because too few people will believe it.

[proud2BlibKansan]

16. +1

[Reader Rabbit]

17. Arne Duncan is an educational chicken hawk.

What he doesn't know about how to teach would fill the Library of Congress.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=433x197148

[LWolf]

18. All important pieces of information when choosing a course of action.

Here's a little information I ran across this weekend:

http://schoolfinance101.wordpress.com/2010/02/25/some-statistical-context-for-central-falls/

[Catshrink]

19. Very interesting read.

So why was Central chosen as the school and make an example of (besides the obvious fact of the superintendent being an ass)? It's in a low poverty area and the parents have little political power or will to fight it. I'm sure that RI can find 74 better teachers eager to replace those that were canned to take on this monumental task. (Yeah, that was sarcasm.) These replacements will go in knowing that they'll most likely get canned if the tests scores don't improve. Only a very naive person would anticipate their success. The problems that school faces go far beyond the competency of the teachers.

[LWolf]

20. Of course it faces many other problems.

The desperate frenzy to scapegoat teachers works to cover up the non-action on so many other fronts.