CNN: Obama wants to overhaul education system

[Reader Rabbit]

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/03/10/obama.education/

I have to say that I'm a bit disappointed. I know I shouldn't bash the program until I read the details, but it sounds like more of the same old stuff that we were handed by the Bush regime.

He also reiterated a promise to support merit pay, as well as extra pay for math and science teachers with the goal of ending a shortage in both of those subjects.

On what basis will a teacher earn merit pay? Who decides? Why are math and science teachers worth more than those who have a similar level of expertise, but in different subjects? One of the main things that makes a school successful is the level of cohesion and cooperation among its staff. These ideas seem designed to pit teachers against each other.

At the same time, however, the president warned that ineffective teachers should not be allowed to remain on the job.

"If a teacher is given a chance but still does not improve, there is no excuse for that person to continue teaching," he said. "I reject a system that rewards failure and protects a person from its consequences."

Again, how is it determined whether a teacher is effective or not? My brother and I were a year apart in school, so we had many of the same teachers. Almost without fail, those who were effective for him were not as effective for me; those who really jump started my interest were rarely the ones who also motivated him.

Fourth, Obama called for the promotion of educational "innovation and excellence" by renewing his campaign pledge to support charter schools. He called on states to lift caps on the number of allowable charter schools.

Charter schools can be a good thing, but they can also foster societal division and elitism, particularly when the parents view it as a symbol of prestige. Charter schools are viewed as the facilities offering the best education. As test scores are often a determinant in admitting students to charter schools, that leaves lower scoring students grouped together in certain schools. Are these children somehow less deserving of a good education than those admitted to the charter schools? And if teachers choose to work in the non-charter school, are they somehow stigmatized as less effective educators?

Public education should not be an exercise in social Darwinism.

[LisaM]

1. I was against his education agenda in the primaries

And this was one of the reasons he wasn't my first choice.

My father was a public school teacher for his entire career. Our school had appropriate funds, and a good student to teacher ratio. But some students just will never succeed and some of it must come from their home environment. I remember one night he was grading papers, and he looked up and said in his mild way, "did you know that when he died, Woodrow Wilson was hung upside down by his heels and stoned by an angry mob?"

Are you telling me that my dad taught someone that? Or that anyone who came from even a mildly academic home environment wouldn't be able to match that answer up (it was multiple choice) with a better guess?

[madfloridian]

2. Sadly under a Democratic administration...I fear we will see the end of public schools.

in America.

Obama plans to continue, and perhaps expand, I think....NCLB.

There will be an end of schools that teach children as individuals and human beings...and there will only be a nation of test takers.

[adnelson60087]

14. I agree wholeheartedly.

Obama's been pretty good so far in many of his policy points, but his stand on Education and the "Free Trade" are both fatally flawed. As a teacher of science for 16yrs now, I can honestly say that I don't have the time to share the love of my discipline like I did pre-NCLB. Learning and enrichment practices seem to take a back seat to learning to bubble in a sheet.

[tonysam]

20. Yep. Obama is Turning into the Neoliberal I Always Feared.

Remember Bill Clinton and "welfare reform." Clinton did something the GOP would NEVER have gotten away with. Obama is trying this crap with public education.

I look forward to him trying to destroy Social Security as well.

[biopowertoday]

3. I recall during the primaries he said he was open to charter schools and

I have been leary of his educational 'reform' ever since.

[LisaM]

4. Yep - and no one would listen.

I got in many arugments with my SO during the primaries - I could never pin him down on which particular issues made him prefer Obama, especially the education issue - and he would never discuss issues and basically admitted he preferred him on personality. Don't get me wrong - I generally like Obama, and voted for him, and was happy when he won. But he is DEAD WRONG on this issue.

[Dinger]

8. Candidate Obama Was Somewhat Less Vocal About His Education Policies

during the primaries. Yes, he did talk about education, but the voters didn't think education was a top priority, I suppose it got put on the back burner.
The political problem with that is that teachers' unions worked very hard to get him elected, and many other Democrats too. They won't forget this. I know I won't.

[tonysam]

21. Actually He Said the Same Thing in the Primaries.

There is nothing really different if people had just bothered to look.

None of the other Democratic candidates were peddling neoliberal ideas, but the media already decided on a candidate.

[endersdragon34]

7. Being a formerly impoverished aspie...

I LOVE THE IDEA OF CHARTER SCHOOLS! Seriously I do. I get the problems, but I think many of them can be fixed. When I was in elementry school I had to basically slow up my learning because there was no such thing as charter schools, this continued on and on throughout school. The neighborhood school was so busy trying to deal with the average (which was below average in general) kids that the extent of my instruction was giving me an assignment that I knew how to do years ago. There is no fix for this, and its bound to happen in the general public education setting. Yes I know one can diffentiate instuction more, but when a kids as far ahead as I was (2-3 year in my worst subjects 4-5 in my best) and you have a bunch of kids struggling to stay at grade level at best, it can be hard.

So my mom looked for various options but being impoverished it was near impossible. Montessori costs money (and generally goes up to the third garde tops), private education costs a lot of money, open enrollment can be (and frequently is) denied, and is hated worst . And being disabled with some impulse control issues makes it even harder as they can kick me out if I have any problems. I know a charter school doesn't solve all of these problems, but it certainly helps out. As it is, kids like me are just expected to put our learning on pause for a while (or at least slow it up). Then when you add in the bullying you get for having asperger's... normal public school sucks.

I was talking to a mom the other day and basically she said the programs like they have now is like being with their grade level peers 1 hour a week (if your lucky) while being around mentally retarded people the rest of the time. Being around people that are way below you isn't bad if its every now and then, but all the time... it can be stressful.

[LisaM]

5. K&R

People need to read about this.

[madrchsod]

6. his education plans are not reality based

they sound really nice but not one of them will work.

[Smarmie Doofus]

9. Rec # 5. He sounds *thoroughly* unfamiliar with this terrain.

And if he's relying on Sec. Duncan, it's a question of who's more clueless.

This is NOT "The Basketball Diaries".

Sounds like he needs some ( LEGIT !) fact-finding done. He should then formulate a policy.

[flyarm]

10. yeah like he is unfamiliar with Kissinger..yeah right..

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=5214381&mesg_id=5214381

what happened to ready on day one????????

lmao.......if it wasn't so pitiful!

[2Design]

11. Sorry you can not push a wet noodle up a hill - some students do not

try and do no homework and expect A without any effort

[LWolf]

12. I'm not disappointed.

I didn't expect anything positive to look forward to for public education under an Obama administration.

I paid attention during the primaries. This is consistent with what he offered during the campaign.

Which is one of several reasons why he never earned my support.

[adnelson60087]

15. Yup, we got what he said he'd do, and its just plain bad for schools.

[tonysam]

22. Same Here.

There were red flags all over the place about this guy, but now that he's in, we are stuck.

We just have to put pressure on him to act like a Democrat.

He could get rid of Arne Duncan for starters.

[femmocrat]

13. I thought he had modified his stance since the primaries.

Guess I was wrong! This is repuke-lite. The only thing missing is vouchers. Oh, and prayer in schools. :eyes: This reeks of Arne Duncan's influence.

And what annoys the crap out of me is NEA rolling over and playing dead. They basically said that since he didn't tie "merit pay" to actual student test scores, it must be OK. They are claiming that merit pay will only be for teachers who attain national certification. Well, he didn't say that either!

I did not support his educational plan in the primaries either, but it was all sort of overlooked in the excitement of the election. Richardson had the best plan for public education, IMO.

[shesaidshesaid]

16. If charter schools are good about accepting students from all walks of life,

I have zero qualms about them. It's an improvement on the insanity in some urban school systems...

[proud2BlibKansan]

17. But they aren't

Charters are selective about who they admit and they routinely kick out kids they don't want. I don't know where this idea that charters are open to every kid came from but it is a myth.

[Dinger]

18. Hmmm, Interesting Profile You Have There (nt)

[Taitertots]

19. Sounds fine

There is a shortage of science and math teachers. Pay them more to get more math and science teachers.

Pay better teachers more money.

Charter schools offer better conditions for smarter students. Sounds like a great idea. Too bad for the children who are not smart.