Don't blame Peyton and let Brady off the hook.

[nickgutierrez]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writers/dr_z/01/17/z.brady.manning/index.html

:thumbsup:

[joeybee12]

1. Ok, I'm not clicking on the link, but if the title is any indication...the

writer is way off base. Tom has won three Super Bowls and lots of big games...Peyton none.

[nickgutierrez]

5. None of that matters *this* year.

The fact is, Brady didn't do any better than Manning *this* year, and you could argue that at least Manning put his team in a position to at least send the game to OT.

[joeybee12]

7. Yeah, unless you win the Super Bowl every damn year..instead of

3 times out of 4 years, then nothing else matters.

Oh, yeah, didn't Elway win every year he played? How about Montana? Or Marino?

What a load of crap.

[nickgutierrez]

8. Nope.

This year, Brady was no better than Manning. None at all.

[northzax]

9. well, to be fair

Manning had a pro-bowl running back, a pro-bowl wide receiver, a better defense and no major injuries to any key players.

And, of course, Brady actually won a playoff game this year, despite missing most of his key players. Still, they're both gone in the same round, so really, what's the difference? oh yes, Brady didn't blame his team, publically, for the loss.

[friesianrider]

12. Brady won a playoff game this year?

Oh...wow...right, the ever impressive Jacksonville Jaguars. I think my neighbor's kid's JV football team could give them a run for their money.

As you said, "they're both gone in the same round, so what's the difference?" That would be the point in the OP's article. People are jumping all over Manning for sucking when Brady sucked just as bad - and didn't have anywhere near the impressive regular season Manning had.

Brady had most of his guns back and healthy and there was no reason for them to lose. He needed to pull through and didn't - period.

[northzax]

13. you make my point perfectly:

People are jumping all over Manning for sucking when Brady sucked just as bad - and didn't have anywhere near the impressive regular season Manning had.


Manning had a great regular season, and didn't carry it into the playoffs. Brady and the Patriots' performance in the playoffs was easily predicted by their regular season performance. Based on regular season work, the Pats overachieved, the Colts underachieved, again.

[friesianrider]

15. Point noted...

I don't agree the Patriots overachieved (they played so shitty in the RS because everyone was hurt, but they were mostly all back and healthy for the game this past weekend and still bombed), but you're right that the Colts were certainly underachievers in the playoffs. Manning's happy feet in big games are as consistent as gravity!

[joeybee12]

14. Who cares?

Tom has had some great years, and will have more.

Peyton can't win the big one--proved it this year.

Joe Montana didn't always win the big games. So to compare two quarterbacks on the basis of one season is ludicrous.

[friesianrider]

11. I think the point is, none of that matters **here and now**

And here and now, the Patriots were utterly unremarkable while the Colts were remarkable throughout virtually the entire season.

You'll notice when most of the Patriots team was out due to injuries, Brady pretty much sucked, too. Once they came back, he started doing better. Yet still...the team got the majority of their starters back for this past weekend's game and they still bit the big one pretty hard. At least Manning lead his team undefeated until the last two games.

The Patriots won their division because it is a friggin' joke. When you can have a losing record and still win your division, it definitely qualifies as a laughing stock. They won their division that way, and played a shitty wild card team to get this far...I'm just not impressed.

The thing about football is that while you can be respected for what you've done in the past, it doesn't mean that because you won before means you're immune to being shitty this year or next year. And Brady was pretty shitty this year. No one's doubting Brady is a good QB, so chill out :) But to act like he doesn't deserve any criticism for the way their season ended up (because of what he has accomplished in the past) is ridiculous.

[bmbmd]

2. That is the most ridiculous article I've ever read,

on a number of levels. Dr. Z is a numbskull. Brady is a perpetual winner, Manning a perpetual loser.

[LisaM]

3. The Colts benefited from a bad call

the Patriots were the victim of one.

[bmbmd]

4. Okay-take that one away.

Now he just has two rings-the same number as Elway.

[friesianrider]

6. The Brady worshippers won't like this...

But all I gotta say to that article is :thumbsup:

Brady wasn't much of a performer on Saturday, was he? :)

[nickgutierrez]

10. Of course not.

"Brady is not god" article = angry mob.

[jakefrep]

20. Dr. Z has presented more cogent analysis....

than any of the knee-jerk "ManningIsAChoker"-types have on this matter.

Brady stunk up the joint in the playoffs - this year.

[MrSlayer]

16. Right a perennial playoff choker vs. a sure fire hall of famer and champ.

The former nearly benefits from some ridiculous home cooking and the latter is sunk by it. Brady might have been off a bit but he was never scared the way Manning is in the playoffs, he didn't choke. You can see it in his eyes, Manning will never win the big one because he has no heart.

[kathy14-0]

17. Manning was scared

And Brady just lacked the talent to make a big play when one was needed?>> What was his excuse? His entire season was wholly unimpressive.

[MrSlayer]

18. How can you say the guy lacked the talent when he's won 3 Bowls?

And 2 MVPs in the Super Bowl game? That's just ridiculous.

And to say he didn't have a good season is also kind of crazy.

4,100 yards, 26 TDs, 63% completion, 92.3 QB rating.

Come on, you just hate the guy.

[Ekirh]

19. UNIMPRESSIVE

Have you looked at his RS stats?

While the Patriots were hurt by injuries he kept this team floating long enough to ensure them another trip to the playoffs

Brady had a bad playoff game . . . that doesn't diminish what else he has achieved in playoff pasts. Manning has a history of choking during the playoffs . . . he buckles under pressure.... and for three straight quarters he was the Steeler's bitch.


Not to mention Brady again suffered from bad officiating.... were Manning and the Colts at times benefited from it.

I'm with Mr. Slayer on this one.

[Robeson]

22. "His entire season was wholly unimpressive"....

Question: Do you follow football? He carried the Patriots - and my fantasy team - on his back this year. Statistically, it was his best year ever, but I'll try not to confuse you with the facts....
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/players/5228/career;_ylt=AjNWY6UQ4SJCf.Ll5_zQjD7.uLYF

[WilliamPitt]

24. One of the dumbest statements ever made on this board.

Brady threw for more than 4,000 yards this season. He pretty much carried the team when everyone else was hurt. Yes, he geeked it during that game. So did the five guys who put the ball on the ground five times. It was a terribly played game. But saying "His entire season was wholly unimpressive" tells me you paid little to no attention to him this year.

Stats for Brady:

4,110 yards, 92.3 QB rating, 63% of throws completed, 26 touchdowns, 14 interceptions

Compare this to Manning:

3,743 yards, 104.1 QB rating, 67.3% of throws completed, 28 touchdowns, 10 interceptions

And Rothliesburger:

2,385 yards, 98.6 QB rating, 62.7% of throws completed, 17 touchdowns, 9 interceptions

Pretty damned good compared to the two guys who played last weekend against each other. Bear in mind, as well, that 45 different starters were down with injuries. The Patriots were 4-4 halfway through. They made it as far as they did mostly because of Brady.

[fishwax]

21. Brady didn't have a great game on Saturday

but he has, at least, come up big in the past. With Brady, it was an anomaly. With Manning, it's been a pretty solid pattern.

[Awsi Dooger]

23. Brady had a terrific season

Overall his best in the regular season. His completion percentage of 63% was excellent and his yards per attempt, always the vital stat, was terrific at 7.8. It matched 2004 and was much better than his numbers in 2001 and 2003: http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/BradTo00.htm

Plus, you have to realize the Pats were far more reliant on Brady this year. The rushing attempts were down 5 per game from last year and much fewer than any of the Super Bowl years, understandable with two rookies on the offensive line.

Brady threw the one terrible pick against Denver that turned the game, but 36 attempts for 341 yards is hardly poor. That's more than 9 yards per attempt on the road against a rested team with top flight defenders.

[nickgutierrez]

25. Manning's game wasn't crap either

290 yards, 1 TD and no picks against one of the better defenses in football isn't dog food. And, as I mentioned upthread, he put his team in a position where they really should have sent it to OT - you expect a Pro Bowl-caliber kicker to make a 44-yard field goal.

Ok, the Polamalu play should have been a pick - that's still one *less* INT than Brady had.