Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Faith Based initiative Unconstitutional. - James Madison

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Religion/Theology Donate to DU
 
Freedom_from_Chains Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:55 PM
Original message
Faith Based initiative Unconstitutional. - James Madison
PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH'S UNCONSTITUTIONAL FAITH-BASED INITIATIVE LAW AND THE RELATED DISTORTION OF WHAT DISCRIMINATION MEANS
by Gene Garman


The constitutional prohibition against religion institutions getting their hands in the taxpayers' pocketbook is not discrimination, unless it allows some religions to feed out of the taxpayers' purse and not others. The Establishment Clause prohibits government funding of religion. President Bush's misguided action providing tax money for "faith-based" institutions is unconstitutional. Yet, the President proudly proclaimed the fact that, by Executive Order, he directed taxpayer funding of religion organizations. He is in direct violation of the supreme law of the land. Who says so? James Madison.

James Madison, author of the 1785 "Memorial and Remonstrance" against religion assessments (taxes for support of religion institutions and teachers of the Christian religion--the most significant statement ever written in American history on the subject of religion freedom), must have rolled over in his grave.

Such efforts by pandering politicians is nothing new. James Madison wrote, "Strongly guarded as is the separation between Religion and Government in the Constitution of the United States, the danger of encroachment by Ecclesiastical Bodies, may be illustrated by precedents already furnished in their short history" (William and Mary Quarterly, 1946, 3:555). Go to a college library and read it for yourself because obviously I do not see much about the "Father of the Constitution" in most commentaries on this subject. James Madison addressed the issue:

In two February 1811 veto messages President Madison stated his constitutional objections to congressionally passed faith-based initiative bills. On February 21, President Madison wrote:

"I now return the bill to the House of Representatives, in which it originated, with the following objections:

"Because the Bill exceeds the rightful authority, to which Governments are limited by the essential distinction between Civil and Religious functions, and violates, in particular, the Article of the Constitution of the United States which declares, that 'Congress shall make no law respecting a religious establishment.' ... This particular Church, therefore, would so far be a religious establishment by law....

"Because the Bill vests in the said incorporated Church, an authority to provide for the support of the poor, and the education of poor children of the same; an authority which ... would be a precedent for giving to religious Societies, as such, a legal agency in carrying into effect a public and civil duty" (The Papers of James Madison, Presidential Series, 3:176).

On February 28, President Madison wrote:

"Having examined and considered the Bill ... I now return the same to the House of Representatives in which it originated, with the following objection:

"Because the Bill, in reserving a certain parcel of land of the United States for the use of said Baptist Church, comprises a principle and precedent for the appropriation of funds of the United States, for the use and support of Religious Societies; contrary to the Article of the Constitution which declares that Congress shall make no law respecting a Religious Establishment" (Papers, Presidential Series, 3:193).

In the United States of America, religion is to be supported voluntarily. Taxes are not given voluntarily. Voluntarism is the essence of the constitutional principle of separation between religion and government ("no test," Art. 6., Sec. 3. and "no law," First Amendment). Government is the essence of coercion. Religion, therefore, is not the business of government at any level. Americans should object to President Bush's unconstitutional action because public tax funds are for public institutions which are owned by all taxpayers (theists and atheists) and because what is directly prohibited cannot be indirectly permitted lest the Constitution and the Establishment Clause become a mockery. "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion"--neither shall Presidents.

http://www.sunnetworks.net/~ggarman/unconst-faith-based.html
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
stopbush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
1. But, but, but...the Founding Fathers were all Xians who
based the Constitution on Jeebus and the story of Lot! Who's this Madison guy? Wasn't that
the name of the mermaid girl in the movie, Splash? Are we really going to listen to some
ficticious mermaid over the flesh and blood Jeebus?

Sometimes history is as stupid as the facts that have a liberal bias.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tanuki Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 01:45 PM
Response to Original message
2. k & r
Thanks for posting this---I am addicted to DU because I find that posters like you are constantly improving my education!:toast:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 05:29 PM
Response to Original message
3. Bah! The Constitution is just a GD piece of paper!
:sarcasm:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sat May 04th 2024, 12:28 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Religion/Theology Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC