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rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 12:55 AM
Original message
Pope seeks end to death penalty
By The Associated Press
8:56 a.m., Nov. 30, 2011

VATICAN CITY — Pope Benedict XVI voiced support Wednesday for political actions around the world aimed at eliminating the death penalty, reflecting his stance as an opponent of capital punishment.

He made the comments during his weekly public audience to participants at a meeting being promoted by the Catholic Sant'Egidio Community on the theme "No Justice without Life."

He said he hopes "your deliberations will encourage the political and legislative initiatives being promoted in a growing number of countries to eliminate the death penalty."

Benedict, like his predecessor Pope John Paul II, has appealed for commutation in a number of death penalty cases, many in the United States.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2011/nov/30/pope-seeks-end-to-death-penalty/
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ZombieHorde Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 01:06 AM
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1. I agree with Pope Benedict XVI on this issue. nt
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WHEN CRABS ROAR Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 01:09 AM
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2. When the state kills in cold blood it's revenge, pure and simple.
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TreasonousBastard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 01:45 AM
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3. The Catholic Church has been against the death penalty for years...
codified in the Seamless Garment teaching by Cardinal Bernardin in the 80's. It teaches against any unjust taking of life, from abortion to war to assisted suicide, and more.

(Unfortunately, many Popes, including this one, have valued some takings of life more bothersome than others.)
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Major Nikon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 09:58 AM
Response to Reply #3
10. IIRC
The official Catholic position on the death penalty, which has been in place for years, said something to the effect that if a country has the means to imprison people for life, they have no business implementing the death penalty.
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Rageneau Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 03:11 AM
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4. The pope should tell all Catholics to oppose the death penalty.
If Benedict believes in his heart that the death penalty is wrong - that God opposes it -- then he has the power as well as he duty to say so 'ex cathedra.'

The Pope is infallible in matters of faith and morals, and the death penalty is without doubt a matter of morality.

If he opposes it, he ought to step up to the plate and take a real swing -- he should just announce that all Catholics must oppose the death penalty from now on.

But he won't do it, because he knows the rank and file Catholics would revolt. Most of them LOVE the death penalty.

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Old Troop Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #4
16. MOST of them? Have you taken a scientific poll?
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skepticscott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 06:05 AM
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5. And has the pope publicly threatened
politicians who support the death penalty in the same way he has threatened those who support abortion? Has he threatened to deprive them of their cracker on Sunday?
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TexasProgresive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. I don't think any pope in modern times has done such a thing.
I believe you are confusing a few bishops acting on their own. If you have links to specific action by Benedict or John Paul threatening excommunication of a pro choice politician I'd like to read them. Thanks.
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beam me up scottie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. "Pope Rejects Pro-Choice Politicians"
Pope Rejects Pro-Choice Politicians
By Jeff Israely/Sao Paulo
Wednesday, May 09, 2007

It didn't take long for Pope Benedict XVI's first trip to the Western Hemisphere to generate controversy — in fact, it started ten hours before he landed.

On Wednesday, as he flew toward his much anticipated five-day trip in Brazil, the Pope addressed the question of the "good standing" of Catholic politicians who support abortion rights — a delicate issue that has come up in the U.S., Europe and, most recently, Mexico. During an unprecedented 25-minute on-flight press conference, Benedict left little room for interpretation: pro-choice politicians not only should be denied communion, but face outright excommunication from the Church for supporting "the killing of a human child." The Pope's declaration came in response to recent comments from the spokesman of the Mexican bishops conference, who said politicians who pushed through a new Mexico City pro-choice law were to be excommunicated.

Standing before an Alitalia cabin full of reporters, two hours into the 12-hour flight to Sao Paulo, the Pope expressed his support for the Mexican bishops in the face of that country's first-ever law legalizing first term abortions. "Yes, that they are excommunicated isn't something arbitrary. It's envisioned in the law of the Church that � the killing of a human child is incompatible with being in communion with the body of Christ."

Vatican spokesman Rev. Federico Lombardi was quick to clarify that the Pope wasn't excommunicating anyone, and that he did not mean to contradict a recent Vatican document that left it to the conscience of individual politicians to leave the Church on their own if they vote against its teachings. Canon law states that people who participate in abortions — would-be mothers, doctors, nurses — are automatically excommunicated. There has been an ongoing debate about whether this also applies to politicians who vote for abortion legislation. But the Pope's remarks seemed to be a moment of personal candor, leaving no doctrinal wiggle room for pro-choice Catholic politicians. It remains to be seen how it plays out with individual priests and the political leaders in their diocese — and whether it will become an issue in the 2008 Presidential campaign for candidates such as Rudy Giuliani.

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1619070,00.html


Worthiness to Receive Holy Communion
General Principles
by Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger
Issued June 2004

5. Regarding the grave sin of abortion or euthanasia, when a person’s formal cooperation becomes manifest (understood, in the case of a Catholic politician, as his consistently campaigning and voting for permissive abortion and euthanasia laws), his Pastor should meet with him, instructing him about the Church’s teaching, informing him that he is not to present himself for Holy Communion until he brings to an end the objective situation of sin, and warning him that he will otherwise be denied the Eucharist.

6. When "these precautionary measures have not had their effect or in which they were not possible," and the person in question, with obstinate persistence, still presents himself to receive the Holy Eucharist, "the minister of Holy Communion must refuse to distribute it" (cf. Pontifical Council for Legislative Texts Declaration "Holy Communion and Divorced, Civilly Remarried Catholics" <2002>, nos. 3-4). This decision, properly speaking, is not a sanction or a penalty. Nor is the minister of Holy Communion passing judgement on the person’s subjective guilt, but rather is reacting to the person’s public unworthiness to receive Holy Communion due to an objective situation of sin.

http://www.catholicfidelity.com/apologetics-topics/eucharist/worthiness-to-receive-holy-communion-by-cardinal-ratzinger/


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skepticscott Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 06:36 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Thanks for saving me the trouble
Not that 30 seconds on Google wouldn't have told my respondent all he needed to know himself. It's not like this attitude from the Church is a huge secret, but I guess for some, willful ignorance is too attractive to risk damage.
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beam me up scottie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 10:09 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. Don't mention it.
We have a different perspective, that huge blind spot is visible from this angle.
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trotsky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 07:09 AM
Response to Original message
6. Ratzinger and his corrupt church have no moral ground on which to stand.
Appeals by him imploring morality in others will forever ring hollow and serve as continuing examples of the hypocrisy of the church, its leaders, and those who support them.
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Goblinmonger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 09:35 AM
Response to Original message
8. Even a broken clock...
why hasn't he made this declaration ex cathedra?
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rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. It's a de fide tenenda doctrine.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 09:40 AM
Response to Original message
9. On that issue, I am in agreement with the Pope.
I can't think of many others with which I agree with him, though.
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Iggo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 10:31 AM
Response to Original message
11. Yeah. Me, too.
I'm also against aiding and abetting kidfuckers.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-01-11 11:32 AM
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12. Deleted sub-thread
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
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