Nietzsche said "God is Dead, and We Killed Him."

[Taverner]

So with no one in charge, no heaven, no hell, he suggested we make the best of things and create a race of supermen.

Hitler one upped him and said "We already have the supermen! They are the Nordic Germans! Sure they burn real easily, and their attributes are the result of a recessive gene, but hey, I like blonde chicks!"

We all told him to go fuck himself and he spent his honeymoon in a bunker, and then was covered with gasoline and set alight. Yay!

Anyway, god is still dead, and we're still on our own but you know what - I never really wanted a race of supermen anyway. As long as we are in charge of our destiny, and as long as we can do whatever we want - why not become the gods we once worshipped?

And by that I don't mean act like Zeus and Apollo, but let's make it nice here. Let's ensure that every man, woman and child on this planet can lead a happy and fulfilling life, as long as we want, as comfortably as we want.

Why not make heaven here?

Why not pursue the real hedonist ideal?

Why not make the world a place worth living for?

[FiveGoodMen]

1. Absolutely!

(can't believe I rec'd and it still came out to zero)

[Taverner]

2. I think a lot of people saw the "God is dead" and knee jerked on the unrec

Some people can't handle the truth I guess...

[kanrok]

3. My favorite graffiti was in a bathroom of a ferry to Bainbridge Island, Wa.

Nietzsche is dead.

- God

[B-Stupid]

4. lol, I used to have a Tshirt with that quote...

[Dept of Beer]

5. What if God isn't dead, but just gave up on us and went elsewhere to try again?

"You humans keep on messing with my "word" and changing it so you can be cruel to each other. I'm off now. You're on your own."

[RKP5637]

6. Yeah, wrote us off as a failed experiment! n/t

[Dept of Beer]

7. If there is a creator invisible-cloud-being sky-parent, and

the universe has billions of galaxies I would put good money that we are not the only ones he/she/it/them has hatched.

[RKP5637]

8. Yep, I agree with you 1000% plus. n/t

[Taverner]

10. Then we don't need him

Our fathers were our models for God. If our fathers bailed, what does that tell you about God? You have to consider the possibility that God does not like you. He never wanted you. In all probability, he hates you. This is not the worst thing that can happen.

--Fight Club

[cleanhippie]

44. Then I say good riddance to it.

If god made us, then all of our problems are gods fault. And if god "gave up" on us, then he is no better than the deadbeat dad who abandons his family when times get tough.

[Synicus Maximus]

9. October 10 "God is Dead" Nietzsche

October 11 "Nietzsche is dead" God

[KatyMan]

11. A quote:

Let us create ourselves:
Let us gods be

[Taverner]

15. Is that from Nietzsche?

[felix_numinous]

12. Whether God be dead or alive

We have been given free choice-- to create a harmonious healthy world for all--or join people rich on the belief that they are chosen above other 'lower' forms of life.

[CanSocDem]

13. Yes indeed!

"...let's make it nice here. Let's ensure that every man, woman and child on this planet can lead a happy and fulfilling life, as long as we want, as comfortably as we want."


All we have to do is remove the various cults of Superman we've allowed to flourish, who believe they have the wherewithal to provide 'happiness, fulfillment, good health and security'.

Giving up ALL of our cherished institutions that 'Clark Kent' has convinced us we cannot do without. Teaching ourselves and our children how to become ".. the gods we once worshiped." by encouraging and supporting each individual to assume full responsibility for their 'world'.

"Why not make the world a place worth living for?"

Personally, I think it's because one of those cults convinced the masses that they only had a very limited shot at making things better(a basic human instinct) and here's how you do it...

...'name your poison'.


.






.

[RKP5637]

14. I've often remarked to people looking for the garden of eden or whatever in

"their" next world that this is the garden of eden, and we F'ed it up. That always guarantees a deer in the headlight look. Earth could be a beautiful place for all.

[Solomon]

16. Yep We make heaven or hell right here.

Problem is, the other side knows this to be true and acts accordingly. They create their own heavens, and in so doing, they enslave the rest of us.

[RKP5637]

18. Yep, and it was really supposed to be about sharing. I guess they didn't get the memo or

read it correctly!

[Dreamer Tatum]

17. Because yesterday you told us to go on General Strike. nt

[RKP5637]

19. I can't stop laughing!!!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[RKP5637]

22. I was just joking! n/t

[Name removed]

20. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[humblebum]

23. you are right in affirming the connection between Nietzsche and Hitler. NT

[Taverner]

24. Nietzsche was not an anti-semite however

His sister was, but he wasn't - in fact he had a hatred of anti-semites, and often tried to talk sense into his friend, Wagner

Still, everything past 'God is dead', at least to me, is crazy talk

Make heaven HERE

Like Lennon would say "Starvation is over - if you want it"

[Ninjaneer]

29. Depends on what you're reading from him.

IIRC, he's made statements on both sides of the fence. When it comes to his being an anti-semite, the issue is not really clear cut.

[Taverner]

31. True....

We will never know how much of his work was edited by his sister

After all, he went crazy long before he died

[struggle4progress]

26. Maybe not. Nietzsche's reputation in Nazi Germany might be the work of his sister,

an ardent Nazi supporter and manager of the Nietzsche Archive: she obtained government funding for the Nietzsche Archive in the Nazi era by promoting the idea that Nietzsche's philosophy justified National Socialism

[Taverner]

28. Yes, it was his sister, Wagner's wife (or was it cousin?)

And Liszt fit in there somewhere...I forget

Nietzsche's sister even tried moving to Brazil to bring about the master race on a plantation. She died of Malaria, I think. So much for the master race.

[onager]

38. Doubtful, as even Wikipedia notes...

Nietzsche's growing prominence suffered a severe setback when his works became closely associated with Adolf Hitler and the German Reich. Many political leaders of the twentieth century were at least superficially familiar with Nietzsche's ideas, although it is not always possible to determine whether or not they actually read his work.

Hitler, for example, probably never read Nietzsche, and if he did, his reading was not extensive,<90> although he was a frequent visitor to the Nietzsche museum in Weimar and did use expressions of Nietzsche's, such as "lords of the earth" in Mein Kampf.<91>

The U.S. Army seized the remains of Hitler's personal library after WWII, which is still in Washington today. Biographers and researchers rarely mention his library, and they tend to notice what is NOT there more than what is: no Nietzsche, no Schopenhauer, not even any Shakespeare. One exception is a complete set of Fichte, a gift from Leni Riefenstahl after she pissed off the Fuehrer.

His surviving library mainly consists of anti-Semitic crap, the cheap cowboy fiction of Karl May (who, like Hitler, never set foot in America) and a lot of what we would nowadays call woo-woo about Nostradamus, ghosts, etc.

Here's a detailed article from The Atlantic about the Hitler library. I don't think you'll be too happy about it...

I also found, however, a Hitler I had not anticipated: a man with a sustained interest in spirituality.

Among the piles of Nazi tripe...are more than 130 books on religious and spiritual subjects, ranging from Occidental occultism to Eastern mysticism to the teachings of Jesus Christ — books with titles such as Sunday Meditations; On Prayer; A Primer for Religious Questions, Large and Small; Large Truths About Mankind, the World and God.

Also included were a German translation of E. Stanley Jones's 1931 best seller, The Christ of the Mount; and a 500-page work on the life and teachings of Jesus, published in 1935 under the title The Son: The Evangelical Sources and Pronouncements of Jesus of Nazareth in Their Original Form and With the Jewish Influences. Some volumes date from the early 1920s, when Hitler was an obscure rabble-rouser on the fringe of Munich political life; others from his last years, when he dominated Europe.

One leather-bound tome — with WORTE CHRISTI, or "Words of Christ," embossed in gold on the cover — was well worn, the silky, supple leather peeling upward in gentle curls along the edges. Human hands had obviously spent a lot of time with this book...

http://www.theatlantic.com/past/docs/issues/2003/05/ryback.htm

[struggle4progress]

25. The early Christians beat Nietzsche to the "man killed god" line by about two millennia

[Taverner]

27. What he was referring to was a little different than that

Basically, who do you go to when you're sick. A doctor. No matter how pious you are, you see a doctor to fix your health, a mechanic to fix your car, a therapist to fix your head, etc.

In the old days, people went to the church for all those things. Mainly because there were no doctors, no scientists. Hell, even doing an autopsy was considered a mortal sin.

So when the Renaissance happened, man began the process of "killing" god. We stripped him of his power, we stripped him of his mystery, and Nietzsche and I would say (and I assume you wouldn't) that the emperor had no clothes. There was nothing behind the curtain. Where we thought there was a god instead showed a dark abyss, filled with emptiness.

That's what Nietzsche was trying to say.

[struggle4progress]

32. You should learn some history of medicine, before claiming that before the Renaissance

people only sought religious cures: it is simply untrue

You also seem to think that skepticism was rare and ineffective in the classical world, which is also untrue: it must have been quite influential -- otherwise, almost every record of it would have been lost and we should today know almost nothing about it in that era

[Taverner]

33. Three words: Bernardo de Guy

I know skepticism was rare in the Dark Ages because it never took root. Those who questioned things were executed for blasphemy. Yes, there were technical discoveries, but there is no doubt among historians that during the time between the fall of Rome, and the Renaissance that a lot of technology was lost. That is why we skeptics ae so afraid of a theocracy - just because we have the technologies now does not mean our species will always have them. Think: the Library of Alexandria, Hypatia and you get a taste of what I'm talking about.

Yes, there was medicine but it was pretty ineffective other than willow bark and alcohol. When people were sick, they prayed, period. Doctors at the time were about as effective as prayer, which meant as effective as doing nothing.

We are poised to go back into the dark ages if we do not reign in our religious fervor. It is the little death that brings complete oblivion if not checked.

Again, I keep pointing to the Hagia Sofia in Alexandria and poor Hypatia. Religious fervor was what destroyed that library. Christians can make all kinds of excuses that it wasn't really religion that destroyed it, that it was really sexism but I ask where did that state sanctioned sexism come from? You aren't born sexist or racist, you have to learn it. And where better to learn it than a belief system that claims to be more real, than reality?

[Marengo]

35. Did you mean the Hagia Sophia? If so, that's a basilica in Istanbul N?t

[okasha]

36. Actually, it's now a mosque.

n/t

[Marengo]

39. No, it was built as a basilica and does not currently function as a mosque

The Hagia Sophia is a museum, use of the complex for religious purposes is prohibited by the Turkish government.

[okasha]

45. Right you are.

It became a mosque after Constantinople fell to the Ottomans in the fifteenth century, and remained such until it became a museum.

[Leontius]

46. At on time there was an attempt to let Christian and Moslems

use side areas to pray and hold services. I think the new government killed the idea.

[Taverner]

37. Oops, meant the library of Alexandria

I was tired when I posted that

[Marengo]

40. No biggie, I was pretty sure that's what you meant.

Just wondering if there was another Hagia Sophia that I didn't know about :D

[Taverner]

41. Of course now some folks are trying to exculpate "St" Cyril of its burning

And of the destruction of poor Hypatia

[struggle4progress]

42. "... Alexandria suffered much in the years up to 391 AD. Augustus reduced it, Caracalla massacred

many of its citizens over a perceived insult and Aurelian also sacked the city and the palace quarter in which the Museum was situated. Finally, the city was taken with great destruction by Diocletian at the start of the fourth century ..."
The Mysterious Fate of the Great Library of Alexandria
http://www.bede.org.uk/library.htm

[Odin2005]

43. Back in the day going to a doctor was more dangerous than praying.

Remember that was back when doctors bled people and gave them toxic concoctions based on Galen's woo-woo.

[Ninjaneer]

30. K&R

Already in the process, sir! :toast:

[dimbear]

34. Saint George killed a dragon. Not. n/t