Serious question: Why does the Pope need a bulletproof cage?

[laconicsax]

All joking aside, if the Pope is God's annointed representative on Earth, why does he need a bulletproof cage? Does he not have faith that his god will protect him? Is it some other reason?

[hlthe2b]

1. Ahh, the paradox...

Why does this not signal his loss of faith? I asked this years ago quite innocently. Never got an answer.

[jobycom]

2. Maybe he believes God sent him a bulletproof cage, just in case.

They've used the Popemobile ever since JP was shot.

[laconicsax]

7. Of course the Pope wouldn't see his assassination as part of God's plan. n/t

[jobycom]

23. People tend to distrust God's mysterious ways for themselves more than for others.

If someone else is shot, it's "Thy will be done." When the gun is pointed at you, it's "Save me, Baby Jesus!"

[Rhiannon12866]

3. Well, the last pope was nearly assassinated...

Though, to be honest, it was pretty much of a miracle that ultimately saved him, though he was injured quite badly... :(

[doc03]

9. Well if he would have died it be God's will, but

he survives it was a miracle.

[Rhiannon12866]

14. What happened was that he bent over at just the right moment

To say hello to a little girl, causing the first two bullets to miss his head. I'm no more religious than anybody else here, but that was pretty remarkable... :shrug:

[laconicsax]

13. Wouldn't that have all been part of God's plan?

:shrug:

[Rhiannon12866]

18. I'm not religious, but I wouldn't think murder would be acceptable

Per The Ten Commandments... :shrug:

[laconicsax]

19. Read the books between Deuteronomy and Matthew.

They're filled with genocide, murder, rape, cruelty, etc. All with God's stamp of approval.

[Rhiannon12866]

21. It's been a long time since I read The Bible, had to read it in school.

And I didn't enjoy it much back then. More recently, I've read The Onion. I much prefer this interpretation... ;)

http://www.theonion.com/articles/god-angrily-clarifies-dont-kill-rule,222/

[DJ13]

4. In case the Methodist, Muslim, Presbyterian, Jewish, Hindu god sends a sniper?

[Poll_Blind]

8. No offense meant to anyone's religion but that struck me as...

...hilarious for some reason. I think mostly because in a simple, straight-forward way it's absolutely the reason why.

:rofl:

PB

[jobycom]

24. Probably the most theologically sound response yet!

:rofl:

[doc03]

5. I often wonder about those things, like when a church burns

down or the roof gets blown off, why didn't God prevent it? Why would a church even need insurance?

[KILL THE WISE ONE]

6. because John Paul was shot maybe ?

[laconicsax]

10. What if that was part of God's plan?

Who is the Pope to try to circumvent God's plan?

[KILL THE WISE ONE]

15. well actually he thought so

he had the bullet soldered onto a FATIMA crown or somthing like that

[laconicsax]

17. That still doesn't explain the bulletproof cage.

If it was God's plan for him to be shot, why get a bulletproof cage?

[KILL THE WISE ONE]

38. keeps his dress from flapping in the wind

[laconicsax]

40. Finally! An answer!

Thanks!

[KILL THE WISE ONE]

41. and the reason it is bullet proof - is to pretend it is butch

[NRaleighLiberal]

11. Related, perhaps...why does fear work so well on ultra religious right-wingers?

For a group of people who are convinced they will be saved, they sure don't behave like it!

[charlie]

12. Cuz that's the way he rolls, m*thaf*ckas

He's going to look like a chicken weenie if anyone is ever killed by a ricochet intended for him.

[Blue Owl]

16. There's a lotta altar-boys-turned-assassins out there

:hide:

[The_Casual_Observer]

20. The Catholic Church subscribes to the idea of man's free will to do right & wrong.

That would include assassination.

[laconicsax]

26. How does the will of an omnipotent god factor into that?

[The_Casual_Observer]

33. It really doesn't. It's one of the mysteries.

That's why there's a heaven & hell apparently.

[laconicsax]

34. "Mysteries" as in "doesn't make a lick of sense," right? n/t

[The_Casual_Observer]

36. It's actually one of the most profound & interesting things about

that faith. It's pretty deep, I doubt most catholics even understand the concept that there really isn't any "God's Will" when it comes to what a guy does or doesn't do. But you pay or benefit for it later on, in heaven or hell.

[laconicsax]

39. "But you pay or benefit for it later on, in heaven or hell."

Can you prove any of that? How do you know there's any form of an afterlife, let alone two distinct possibilities for it?

[The_Casual_Observer]

42. Don't get me wrong, I'm not a believer, I just am interested

in it.

[laconicsax]

44. Got it.

Thanks.

[Ozymanithrax]

22. The assassination attempt on Pope John Paul II proved that it can happen. n/t

[laconicsax]

25. So? Wouldn't that just be part of God's plan?

I'm honestly trying to understand this--if everything that happens is by the Abrahamic god's will, wouldn't that include the Pope getting gunned down (or in the recent case, getting shot but surviving)?

Isn't a bulletproof cage just an arrogant attempt to circumvent God's will?

[Ozymanithrax]

28. Don't know. I'm an agnostic Jew and see no evidence of God.

But there is sufficient evidence of nutcases here on earth that are more than willing to use violence to murder people.

I see the use of a Popemobile as a good precaution in these times, not as a reason to slam the pope or any other political leader. In any case, should there be a God, and said God is exactly as the text of the bible describes, why the hell should said God hang around to catch bullets. Universe to run and all that. I've read the bible, and I don't see anywhere that God is supposed to hang around and protect people.

[struggle4progress]

27. Because he's not obliged to ignore reality just to make you happy?

:shrug:

[dimbear]

29. There have been several popes assassinated, but it's usually

done by the next guy in line. Or whoever figures on pulling that guy's strings. It's a dangerous job.

[trotsky]

30. So divine protection isn't reality?

Glad we finally agree on something.

[cleanhippie]

32. But ignoring reality is what religion is all about!

[laconicsax]

35. Funny you should use that word...

"Reality" huh? Are you admitting that your god isn't real?

[ladjf]

31. A thousand years of crimes against society will create a lot of

animosity. (It's about time.) nt

[DeSwiss]

37. I've heard this issue raised before.....

"I still say a church steeple with a lightening rod on top shows a complete lack of confidence." ~ Doug McLeod.

:)

[laconicsax]

43. I found the answer!

http://www.smbc-comics.com/index.php?db=comics&id=1557

[jeepnstein]

45. It cuts down on the casual attempts...

on his life. You know the angry loner who lives in his basement who suddenly decides since the Pope is in town he'll take a whack at fame? All those flying bullets would be a real problem for everyone in the area. He draws haters and whackos like nobody's business. Make it too easy for the haters and they'll quickly stifle any attempt he makes to connect with his congregation.

Do I believe the Popemobile could stop a serious attempt? No way. There are vehicles out there that can take a hit far better than a ballistic fishbowl on wheels. I'm not sure the current Pope even worries about it that much.

[GliderGuider]

46. There's an Islamic saying about this:

"Trust Allah, but tie your camel."

Which loosely translates to, "God helps those who help themselves."

[laconicsax]

48. So the Pope is Muslim?

Who knew?

[AlecBGreen]

47. good question

We (believers) SHOULD trust God but that doesnt mean we shouldnt look both ways when crossing the street :) Nothing wrong with taking sensible precautions.

[laconicsax]

49. That implies a lack of trust.

Surely if your god meant for you to cross safely, you shouldn't need to look.

[AlecBGreen]

50. I dont believe it implies that

I believe we have brains for a reason. The Bible offers both sides on this issue (of course). There are many examples to choose from but these are the first that popped to mind.

In favor of being sensible, practical:

1) The book of proverbs rails against "fools" and says wisdom is more precious than gold or gemstones.
2) Jesus commands believers to "be wise as serpents yet as innocent as a dove."
3) Paul decides not to take Mark with him on a journey "because he had deserted them in Pamphylia and had not continued with them in the work.'

In favor of throwing caution to the wind:

"Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat; or about your body, what you will wear. Life is more than food, and the body more than clothes. Consider the ravens: They do not sow or reap, they have no storeroom or barn; yet God feeds them. And how much more valuable you are than birds! Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life? Since you cannot do this very little thing, why do you worry about the rest?"

... and dont call me Shirley :P

[Dorian Gray]

52. Or He could give you two eyes

and the common sense to look both ways to ensure a safe crossing.

[skepticscott]

53. So if God has already given us

everything we need to take care of ourselves, why do so many people ask him for help and protection every day?

Can't have it both ways.

[AlecBGreen]

55. that doesnt compute

I give my students all the help they need to succeed in my class - notes, lecture, demonstrations, etc. Does that mean they shouldnt ask for extra help if they still cant master a concept? They have everything they need, including the ability to ask for assistance.

As believers we are taught that we are wholly dependent upon God. We are to use the gifts he gave us (our bodies, our logic, our skills & talents, etc) but that doesnt mean we should be too proud to ask for guidance or help. As it says, "My grace is sufficient."

[skepticscott]

58. Well, since they're asking for more

obviously you DIDN'T give them everything they needed to succeed in your class.

And saying that god gives us everything we need, including the ability to ask for assistance, is just more special pleading (paired with the silly little ditty that "god answers all requests, but sometimes the answer is no"), to try to hide the fact that the world looks exactly as it would if there were no god.

[AlecBGreen]

59. this is where the old adage is applicable

You can lead a horse to water but you cant make it drink. I DO give the students what they need to succeed. It is their choice whether or not they take advantage of it.

Saying "God gives us everything we need" isn't special pleading; its a personal declaration of what I believe.

[Dorian Gray]

57. Why not?

My parents gave me life, yet I still ask them for moral support every day.

People ask for more all the time.

[AlecBGreen]

60. I was listening to JC yesterday

Johnny Cash that is (;) ) and the song was "bird on a wire"

I saw a beggar leaning on his wooden crutch /
He said to me, "You must not ask for so much" /
I saw a young woman leaning in her darkened door /
She cried out to me, "Hey why not ask for more?"

Great song

[Dorian Gray]

51. There were attempts on previous popes lives

He also believes that human beings have free agency and free will, so if they want to carry out assassination attempts, then he may as well try to protect himself.

I just don't see this as one of the things to be critical about.

[laconicsax]

54. The question that doesn't answer is of God's will.

If the previous pope saw it as God's will that he get shot at, why wouldn't other assassination attempts be seen as God's will?

[ChadwickHenryWard]

56. Becuase somebody might shoot him.

You're really in trouble when you start believing your own bullshit. Applies to popes as well.

[olegramps]

61. I had to laugh when I saw John Paul II riding around in the Popemobile.

All I could think of was he looked like Quasimodo, the hunchback of Notre Dame in Victor Hugo's novel.

[rug]

62. How hard were you laughing when he was shot

before the bulletproof glass?

[laconicsax]

63. How powerless was his god to prevent it?

I notice you didn't offer an explanation of why the Pope should need a bulletproof cage...does he not believe that his god will protect him? Shouldn't he take the position that an assassin could be his god's way of replacing him?

[rug]

65. It's a stupid question.

[laconicsax]

66. Only if you don't believe in gods. n/t

[LAGC]

64. (self-delete)

wrong spot.