There's never been a Jesuit Pope?

[El Supremo]

That is what I read recently. Why is that? The Church wants "civilian control"?

[tubbacheez]

1. I'm not well-versed in this subject, but aren't the various orders

separate entities from the official hierarchy, whereas the Pope gets chosen from the Diocesan ranks?


Anybody have the scoop on this?

[knight_of_the_star]

3. From what I've heard

Any male Catholic can be made pope in theory.

[El Supremo]

6. I think you have to have been ordained a least as a priest.

But you are right. You don't have to be a Cardinal.

[Dookus]

11. No

you do not have to be a priest.

You simply have to be an unmarried male catholic.

[Sandpiper]

2. Haven't you ever heard of the "Black Pope" conspiracy?

According to the theory, the real head of the Catholic Church is the "Black Pope" or head of the Jesuit Order.

[Mrs. Overall]

4. It's my understanding that you can't be a bishop or cardinal

or therefore a pope if you are part of a religious order--Jesuit, Dominican, Franciscan, Benedictine, Carmelite, etc...

Diocesan priests (not part of an "order") are the priests who "climb the ladder" to bishop, archbishop, cardinal, pope.

[El Supremo]

5. Well, they were probably members of an order before they became bishops. n

[Mrs. Overall]

7. I don't think so.

As an ex-clergy member, I'm almost positive that those in religious orders (males) do not become bishops.

[El Supremo]

8. I believe you.

I read about the differences between Diocian and Religious Priests. But all I found is that Religious Priests take an additional vow of poverty.

I think that a long time ago some Religious Bishops or Cardinals did become Pope (e.g. Sixtus the whatever), but not anymore.

What can I say? I'm a died-in-the-wool Reformed Church member who really doesn't know much about Roman Catholic hierarchy.

[imenja]

10. that strikes me as very odd

since most priests were traditionally members of one order or another.

Wikipedia notes: "The Pope is usually a member of the Sacred College of Cardinals, but theoretically any male Catholic (including a layman) may be elected; Pope Urban VI, elected 1378, was the last Pope who was not already a cardinal at the time of his election. Canon law requires that if a layman or non-bishop is elected, he receives episcopal consecration from the Dean of the College of Cardinals before assuming the Pontificate. Under present canon law, the Pope is elected by the cardinal electors, comprising those cardinals who are under the age of 80."

[muriel_volestrangler]

12. The late Basil Hume became Archbishop of Westminster

(and a cardinal) straight from being Abbot of Ampleforth Abbey, a Benedictine-run school. He had become a Benedictine monk first, and was ordianed as a priest a few years after that.

http://www.catholic-ew.org.uk/briefing/9907a/9907a001.htm

[Mrs. Overall]

13. I'm WRONG--

Just did some further research and found out that it is rare for a priest of an order (non-diocesan) to become a bishop, but that it does happen.


Here is a current list of voting Cardinals who are members of religious orders: (Three Jesuits (S.J) are Cardinals)

Miguel Cardinal Obando Bravo, S.D.B. (Salesians of Saint John Bosco)
Archbishop Emeritus of Managua, Nicaragua

Carlo Maria Cardinal Martini, S.J. (Jesuit)
Archbishop Emeritus of Milano {Milan}, Italy

László Cardinal Paskai, O.F.M. (Franciscan)
Archbishop Emeritus of Esztergom-Budapest, Hungary

Varkey Cardinal Vithayathil, C.SS.R. (Congregation of the Most Holy Redeemer)
Major Archbishop of Ernakulam-Angamaly (Syro-Malabarese), India

Frédéric Cardinal Etsou-Nzabi-Bamungwabi, C.I.C.M. (Congregation of the Immaculate Heart of Mary)
Archbishop of Kinshasa, Congo (Dem. Rep.)

sé Cardinal Saraiva Martins, C.M.F. (Missionary Sons of the Immaculate Heart of Mary)
Prefect Emeritus of Causes of Saints, Roman Curia

Eusébio Oscar Cardinal Scheid, S.C.I. (Congregation of the Priests of the Sacred Heart)
Archbishop of São Sebastião do Rio de Janeiro, Brazil

Cláudio Cardinal Hummes, O.F.M. (Franciscan)
Archbishop of São Paulo, Sao Paulo, Brazil

Carlos Cardinal Amigo Vallejo, O.F.M. (Franciscan)
Archbishop of Sevilla {Seville}, Spain

Tarcisio Cardinal Bertone, S.D.B. (Salesians of Saint John Bosco)
Archbishop of Genova, Italy

Julius Riyadi Cardinal Darmaatmadja, S.J. (Jesuit)
Archbishop of Jakarta, Indonesia

Julio Cardinal Terrazas Sandoval, C.SS.R. (Congregation of the Most Holy Redeemer)
Archbishop of Santa Cruz de la Sierra, Bolivia

Jorge Mario Cardinal Bergoglio, S.J. (Jesuit)
Archbishop of Buenos Aires, Argentina

Francis Eugene Cardinal George, O.M.I. (Oblates of Mary Immaculate)
Archbishop of Chicago, Illinois, USA

Wilfrid Fox Cardinal Napier, O.F.M. (Franciscan)
Archbishop of Durban, South Africa

Oscar Andrés Cardinal Rodríguez Maradiaga, S.D.B. (Salesians of Saint John Bosco)
Archbishop of Tegucigalpa, Honduras

Marc Cardinal Ouellet, P.S.S. (Society of Priests of St. Sulpice)
Archbishop of Québec, Québec, Canada

Christoph Cardinal Schönborn, O.P. (Dominican)
Archbishop of Wien {Vienna}, Austria

[imenja]

9. the Jesuits have long been the most independent of the orders

They were in fact dissolved in the late 1700s, after first being expelled from the Portuguese, Spanish, and even French empires. The only place they could find refuge was the Vatican itself. In those days they were controversial primarily because they refused to accept the new Erastian notion of Church as subordinate to Crown (state). They were also controversial in Brazil because of their work with the Guarani, sheltering them from enslavement. Portugal's Minister of Empire accused them of arming and assisting the Guarani in war against the Portuguese.

I imagine they've caused trouble throughout their tenure. They are also a fairly recent order--formed in the 1500s, so they haven't been along as many of the others.

[dryan]

14. Hildebrand...

was a Dominican.