Please comment on vote fraud piece in Latest Breaking News

[Dancing_Dave]

It's called "Mass ballot rigging takes hold in Britain" and was just published by The Independent newspaper over there.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1332635

I know some of you here can make intelligent comments about it! :pals:

[Bill Bored]

1. A friend of mine over there has confirmed this.

The voting by mail was royal cock-up!
Sorry, I don't have the details, but they must be in the article.
I think they are getting rid of this, right?

[papau]

2. The GOP massive voting by mail fraud was repeated in Britain

Only solution is to end voting by mail - end absentee voting not certified by a notary, embassy, General, etc.

[BanzaiBonnie]

3. And vote by mail

in Washington state is what The powers that be have planned for us.

[Peace Patriot]

4. You're confusing me. In the last election, one of the few checks we had..

...on election fraud, given the unauditable paperless electronic voting machines that had been spread throughout the U.S., was any remaining pockets of paper ballots including absentee ballots. Here at DU, ignatzmouse analysed the No. Carolina election and found a huge discrepancy between the electronic results, 2/3 of the vote (which gave Bush an unbelievable margin of 15%), and the absentee ballots, 1/3 of the vote, in which he had a margin of only 6% (rather startling evidence of vote stealing in the electronic voting systems). Without this paper component of the vote, we would not have known what was going on. Similary, the UC Berkeley statistics team found 130,000 to 330,000 phantom votes for Bush in Florida's three largest Democratic counties, in electronic results vs. other methods of voting.

I was glad to have the absentee ballot option myself, given what I knew about electronic voting machines in 2004.

I've also heard generally positive comments about Oregon's vote by mail system. Am I missing something?

Why throw out one of our few paper components? Shouldn't it be monitored and fixed instead?

[BeFree]

5. Correction ...NC

The 1/3 absentee was actually early voting and absentee, in NC, and were cast on machine and paper. The 1/3 early/absentee part of the total matched the 6% exit poll and pre-election polling margins.

But at the polls on election day the b**sh margin went up to 15%, in NC.

Anyway, Oregon had mail in paper and was one of the few states the exit polls were dead on.

[JBear]

10. More NC

And don't forget that the 3 counties that did MANUAL counting of all votes (no electronics involved) showed exit polls matching the final tallies within 1%....Things that make you go Hhhmmmmm.

:bounce:

[KaliTracy]

7. right after the Election, Ohio lawmakers were talking about using Absentee

ballots to "make it easier" -- I didn't know anything about the election except a gut feeling that something was wrong, and that there was disparity in machine allocation and disenfranchisement in Ohio (I had NO wait in my upper/middle-class/mostlycaucasion neighborhood -- it was completely *wrong* for people wait more than an hour to vote when our area happened to have so many machines....etc., etc.)

I have to say, though, that as soon as they said that on the radio, and that they were thinking about passing a law on it, I started yelling back at it -- With Absentee ballots never getting delivered in Florida (something like 50,000 "lost"???) and to college students throughout the nation never receiving their absentee ballots (bernie1 has a lot of that information) I just do NOT trust that my vote -- which is usually on paper that has a political marking -- would actually make it to the ballot box. Call me paranoid, but I don't think that's the direction we want to be headed if we cannot guarantee that a person from each party is present for ALL mail deliveries.... After all that happened in Ohio, I just don't see that as a viable solution. The better solution was NOT to cut machine allocation, NOT to merge precincts, and NOT to fully train poll workers. Absentee voting was brought out as a quick fix too fast for my liking -- I would expect a little more in-depth analysis of what happened, and why. (something which still hasn't really happened.... even though they had a hearing yesterday...)

[KaliTracy]

8. um... that should have been....

NOT to Not fully train poll workers .... *blush*

[Bill Bored]

6. Well the UK are going back to paper at the polling place.

Only those who really need ballots by nail will get them from now on, I've been told.

[tommcintyre]

9. Disappointing, but not surprising. The new trend in "Manufacturing Consent

<As I have been fighting the "Greatest Theft EVER" with the rest of you in this forum, I have become increasingly suspicious that this is part of a trend to maintain the "illusion of Democracy", while the ruling elites accelerate their control. The LBN article certainly adds to my suspicions.>

<My post in LBN thread>
Apparently, manipulating the media is not enough for them any more to assure their hold on power. This appears to be a developing trend in established "Democracies". First the U.S. - now Britain? Can Europe, Australia, etc. be far behind (If it's not already happening there)?

True Democracy is "problematic" for the established capitalistic and cultural (religions) elites. As they continue to pursue increasingly selfish (not in the majority's best interest) agendas; it becomes increasingly difficult to maintain a "consensus" with media control/brainwashing alone.

The increasing growth of minority populations in these countries only compound their risks of losing power, since minorities are generally the most "left out" in these societies - and consequently most likely to "revolt" in the voting booths. So it is not surprising to see the greatest electoral disenfranchisement efforts in these areas first.

It seems that the increasingly blatant self-serving agendas of the power elites is making it harder and harder for them to maintain "the illusion of Democracy".

Personally, I think this acceleration will lead to their "undoing" - sooner than later. This cycle has been played out in history repeatedly by despots, and ALWAYS with the same results - their fall.

"When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love has always won. There have been tyrants and murderers and for a time they seem invincible but in the end, they always fall -- think of it, ALWAYS." Gandhi