Should the unemployed be made to work for their benefits?

[Morris Onions]

A Conservative government would make the long-term unemployed work for their benefits. What do you think of this idea?

People who claim Jobseekers' Allowance for more than two years would have to take part in a 12-month community work scheme, under plans being announced by Conservative leader David Cameron.

The party says those who refuse to participate in their "welfare to work" programme would lose their benefits.

But Work and Pensions Minister Peter Hain said it would be very costly and would not encourage people into work.

Should the long-term unemployed be made to work for their benefits? Are you claiming Jobseekers' Allowance? What do you think of these plans? What should be done to encourage people to go back to work?


http://newsforums.bbc.co.uk/nol/thread.jspa?forumID=4019&edition=1&ttl=20080108105049

[BooScout]

1. I have no problem with that idea.......

In principal it's a sound idea. However it does need to be reformed with care. I certainly don't want to see homelessness on the rise in Britain and that was a direct side effect with some Welfare Reform in the States when it began to be implemented there.

I know that in our area full time employment is hard to come by. A lot of people on benefits don't want to work part time (which seems to have plenty of job openings) because they will lose their benefits. Now my solution to that dilemma begs the question of why don't they get two jobs? ....especially here in the UK where you don't have to worry about working 40 hours a week at one employer in order to have Health Insurance.

I know there is considerable benefit fraud in the UK. People are well aware of how to play the system. Women will have several children, never marry, live with their partner on the sly while he works a full time job and the Benefits Agency is never the wiser that he is living with the family while benefits are collected.

And don't even get me started on the Benefits Agency.......never have I seen a more worthless, incompetent, lazy group of people. They will so totally screw someone's situation up that it amazes me that people on benefits don't jump put windows when trying to deal with them.

[LeftishBrit]

2. On the one hand, I think there may be a role for pushing some re-training programmes ...

especially those that involve updating knowledge of information technology.

On the other hand, I fear that the sort of thing that the Tories are proposing will just create compulsory cheap-labour schemes, just like the YOP, etc. under Thatcher.

[fedsron2us]

3. It all rather assumes that there will be jobs available

which may not be the case if we are about to dive into a severe recession such as happened in 1981-82. Should that happen the number of unemployed will simply overwhelm any proper training courses and you will just wind up with the useless 'make job' type of schemes that used to be YOP's raison d'etre. By there very nature training schemes tend to be of most use to people who would probably find jobs anyway. The real benefit bandits will normally find ways to play the system or will turn to that other favoured alternative to work, crime. Since the number of people who have claimed jobs seekers allowance for more than two years apparently numbers less than 200,000 the saving are not going to be that huge. From my reading of the Tory proposals one of the impacts would be to punish people who cycle between short term and seasonal work and the dole. This would not exactly create the labour market flexibility which governments are always droning on about being so important. As ususual the media give a totally misleading impression about the generosity of UK unemployment benefit. Anyone who thinks it is some sort of monetary bonanza obviously has not spent much time on the dole.

[Nihil]

4. Agree with your main points but not this ...

> As ususual the media give a totally misleading impression about the
> generosity of UK unemployment benefit. Anyone who thinks it is some
> sort of monetary bonanza obviously has not spent much time on the dole.

If you've been working for years and keeping your NI up to date then you
are exactly right: they keep you waiting (no money) for months and then,
grudgingly, give you a payment that might cover the weekly food bill for
the family (if you've pulled your belts in) but nothing left over for
mortgage payments or any of the other stuff.

If, on the other hand, you have dossed around, not worked (officially)
or any other excuse for not paying ANYTHING into the NI, you get your
f*cking bonanza all right: almost instant payment, housing allowance,
poll-tax rebate, this payment & that bloody payment.

I was made redundant just before Christmas a few years ago and saw this
first-hand. I've been paying NI for decades but got buggerall back while
watching "professional dole-collectors" playing the system. No, it wasn't
the majority of people attending (quite a few were in the same boat as me
and were appalled at the difference in treatment) but neither was it just
one or two individuals.

I'm for any measure that will cut back on that behaviour - the kind that
penalises people for being honest, for doing the right thing, for having
been working for a living and the temerity to be actually looking for a
job rather than just another handout.

OK ... :rant: ... it is just a hot button for me - sorry!

[fedsron2us]

5. Poll Tax rebate ???

Surely that went out under John Major.

[Nihil]

6. Sorry ... "council tax rebate" if you're picky ...

A rose by any other name ... :shrug:

[FunkyLeprechaun]

7. I applied for disability benefits (and got rejected (b/c I'm too "able"))

As I'm having a great difficulty getting a job. I'm going to apply for an MA (better get going on that) and hopefully increase my chances of getting into the field I want to get started in (Museum Studies, apparently very very competitive and those who have MA's are more likely to get jobs in this sector than people (like me) with lowly BAs).

I have a BA in history from a prominent American university, a 3.6 GPA (out of 4.0) from one of my state's top High Schools and I'm pulling pints at a pub :-(.

Best get going on my MA!

Really... I've applied to a load of jobs... jobs that fit my criteria obviously and jobs I DID NOT WANT TO APPLY TO! ARRGH! The jobs I didn't really want to apply to was customer service jobs such as Morrisons, Clinton Cards, Subway, etc etc. I got rejected from all those!

I really would like a side earner while I do a masters and applying to the kinds of jobs I want. I wonder if it's because I'm overqualified or I'm deaf? I heard that each place has to have a certain percentage of disabled people in its workplace... hmmph... I haven't really seen that in ANY of the places I tried to apply to.

I also made sure my app forms were ok and had several people look at them before I dropped them off. So I'm pretty certain it's not the application forms.

It's a real downer. It does make me not want to apply to these places anymore. I applied for a job at a local store that donates to BDF Newlife. The wages were pretty good. And especially my deafness was in-utero related I could relate to the causes they supported. And I gave in my app form.

Nothing since.

My friend who suggested the job to me saw the same job still posted on the wall a month after I sent in my application form (and I handed it in person as well). They never sent a letter or anything like that telling me that they rejected me... just probably put my app form in the bin as soon as I handed it in. I really find it insulting.. I worked at least 1 hour of my time filling in the application form and they never took the time to reject me.

Hmm... I don't know what to say about all this but all I wanted is a side earner... nothing much... and I don't know why I keep getting rejected from these kinds of jobs.

If David Cameron wants the long-term unemployed (I wouldn't say I'm unemployed, but I'm semi-unemployed.. working at a pub part-time (only get texted if my boss wants me to work certain hours). I've lived here for 2 years and I am TRYING my best to get a job!

:cry: