Sen. Jay Rockefeller (D-WV) just made an excellent point on Hardball.

[DemoTex]

He basically said that never in his lifetime has he seen the magnitude of blunders as the Bu$h regime has made in Iraq. His most excellent point was that Iraq is much worse than Vietnam in that Vietnam was "just" a regional war, while the Iraq war has worldwide terrorism consequences. Right on, Jay!

Bu$h has stirred a murderous hornets' nest. We are fucked for years to come. Kerry is fucked if he wins, because Bu$h has fucked it up so badly.

[movonne]

1. Well I would rather be fucked by Kerry!!!

[Cha]

17. Prescisely, movonne!

:toast:

[LittleClarkie]

21. Ohhh dear

I just got the vapors (fans little Southern self).

[stepnw1f]

2. It Wasn't A Blunder

I think this shit was on purpose.

[Atman]

3. It wasn't a blunder, it was calculated

The only way to pay back his massive defense contractor contributors (and VP) is to assure them never-ending wars to supply.

[grasswire]

13. no blunder

It was the intent from the beginning.

1. A smooth, clean, timely win and transition and reconstruction would have brought demands for us to leave Iraq a year ago.

2. Chaos=$$ for Bushco. More chaos=more $$.

3. At some point, Americans must realize that what has happened WAS and IS their plan. Extended chaos, while 14 military bases are built. A war with no end. Profit, profit, profit!

[snippy]

4. True. The only snag in the PNAC plan has been the amount of time

ours troops have been tied down in Iraq, thereby delaying the Next Bush War. The list of countries to be invaded is long and growing longer.

[DemoTex]

7. It was a blunder vis-a-vis stated purpose. Cover story.

You are absolutely correct, Stepnw1f, that this shit was on purpose. This is the reason 2000 Bu$h campaign VP-veter, Cheney, made himself the Prime Minister, de facto Minister of War, and VP, all in one swoop. That said, we are even more fucked since that shit can - obviously - be done.

[stepnw1f]

9. I Have Hope

Bush is going down with or without this election.

[The Doctor.]

5. It's a sad truth that Americans will buy the crap to come...

Kerry will be so bogged down trying to clean up after * that there will be plenty of opportunity to call him 'ineffective'.

And too many ignorant Americans will fall for and parrot this Bullshit.

I'm becoming more embarrassed of Americans every day.

[amber dog democrat]

6. The blunder was getting hoodwinked in to signing off on this war

and going further, letting him be appponted to the presidency.

I honestly think he is delusional, just this side of insane. We should never have given this chimp so much power.

[nofanofbush]

10. This side???

Hate to sound like a tinfoil hat dude, but after the last few years plus a hard look at his record as governor, I think this guy is very possibly a sociopath. No conscience at all.

[amber dog democrat]

12. I was being kind.

You know. benefit of the doubt. But I agree with sociopath; also narcissistic, meglomaniac serial killer. You are no tinfoil hat dude. We are looking at a manifestation of evil in practice. Considering how the family fortune got its start collaborating with the Third Reich, why am I surprised ?

On a different tack, i am reading A Great and Shining Lie - it has some amazing parallels to the war in Iraq. Only this war is worse. Peace.

[Justice]

8. That is an excellent point

I believe it will be part of the talking points by Democrats.

People should make this comment when calling into C-span.

[pretzel4gore]

11. think about it: they stole the election!

and under normal circumstances this fact could become known to enough people that the grim arm of law is loosed upon them....but circumstances haven't been allowed normality....
911 was a part of, not even the main part, of the overthrow of the US legal government....
The only serious threat to bush gangsters is the american people; they could, conceivably, kick the busheviks from office, but that still wouldn't neutralize them.; the bushies are desperate men despite all the phony business suits and ties they wear, and as long as the racists, faux christians, dingbats and so called patriots support them.....the mediawhore carries on.

[DemoTex]

15. Discount all of that, for the moment.

Focus on Jay Rockefeller's comparison of the Vietnam fiasco to Iraq. That is the germane issue. Talking points: Vietnam was a mistake, but it was regional and did not incite world terrorism. Iraq is regional but brings the entire Islamic world, along with many former allies, to the boiling point. Michael Moore had his great F-911. George Bu$h now has his Celsius-100 (F-212). Boiling point reached.

[pretzel4gore]

19. good idea

hell (i mean heck) even i can hardly bear thinking about bushinc! workable techniques to remove them from power is the only issue on the table

[roseBudd]

14. use this flyer to get that point across

I gave the flyer below to a campus area landlord Bush supporter and he read every word. Quite simply most don't know the Iraq War has made them less safe because they have not read Army War College Report "Bounding The Global War On Terror" of Dec. 03. The flyer below summarizes.

Go to http://somnamblst.tripod.com to download high resolution TIF or PDF file to print.

[tishaLA]

16. Holbrook said this a couple weeks ago

on one of the Sunday shows. I hope this becomes a talking point because it is correct.

[hippiegranny]

18. I do not agree that Kerry is f*cked

if he wins and here is why: I think the international community is withholding all support because of Bush. As soon as the American electorate gives them someone with credibility to work with, they'll be back on board with us. That is going to make getting this unholy mess cleaned up a whole lot more possible.

[JetCityLiberal]

20. West coast here

Thank you for this thread.

I will check in and watch for this segment.

Many thanks!

JetCityLiberal