David Shuster: "Anger at Joe Lieberman is misplaced. He's said he will vote to let the HCR/PO bill

[jenmito]

go to the floor. Ben Nelson + Landrieu won't commit."

He posted this on Twitter about an hour ago.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

1. Anger at Joe Liberman is never misplaced.

He's always a douche, and there's always a reason to be pissed off at him.

[BootinUp]

3. lol nt

[proud2BlibKansan]

15. +1

[denem]

16. +2

[Phx_Dem]

40. So true.

[librechik]

2. what? Politico misquoted him? Or did Joe feel the heat of our searing anger?

hmm

[Peacetrain]

4. Bingo!

[Parker CA]

23. I'm guessing since it was a direct quote, the latter portion of your post is correct. ;)

[struggle4progress]

31. Well, first POLITICO misquoted him, five minutes before a Reid press conference,

where Reid set the record straight. Then Joe felt our searing anger (which he has often deserved, but not for this time) -- so maybe we should have saved it for the next time he's a jerk instead of just pre-emptively flying off the handle cuz we expect him to be a jerk

[quiller4]

32. Politico misquoted him. Didn't you hear that reported by Big Ed? n/t

[Beetwasher]

5. Either The Walk Back Has Already Begun Or The Failmeisters Were Pnkd Again

By the liberal media.

[Xipe Totec]

6. Oh well, if David Shuster says it...

The same Shuster that accused Hillary Clinton of pimping out her daughter?

That Shuster?

:eyes:

[jenmito]

11. Shuster is a liberal. n/t

[Xipe Totec]

13. Could have fooled me n/t

[jenmito]

17. I guess you don't read what he writes or watch his show. He gets on Obama for being too slow

on DADT, DOMA, and other things.

[drm604]

7. If that's true, there's a lot of misplaced anger around here (myself included).

Who posted that on Twitter, Shuster or Lieberman?

Ed Schultz still seems to think that Leiberman is filibustering.

[Spazito]

8. There seems to me to be a lack of clarity on this, especially from the media...

The question I have is this:

Are there, in reality, three votes needed (excluding any amendments that might come up)to have the bill get to Conference: The first vote being to get the bill to the floor for debate at all, which the repubs can filibuster ergo the possibility of needing 60 votes; the second the vote on cloture which the repubs can filibuster unless there are 60 votes for cloture, ending debate and then the final vote on the bill itself which needs a simple majority.

If three main votes are, indeed, needed then from what I have read, including this tweet from Schuster, is that Lieberman will not join a repub filibuster to stop the bill from getting to the floor BUT he is NOT saying he won't join the repubs in a filibuster on cloture.

Can anyone clarify or do I have it essentially correct?

[jenmito]

14. It looks like you're partially right...

I just read this article ALSO posted by Shuster which says Lieberman may filibuster the FINAL vote AFTER discussion of the bill, but the article also says this: "This is only trouble for the health care bill if you believe Lieberman will carry out his threat, and if you believe that 60 votes are actually necessary for deficit-reducing elements of the bill like the public option that could go through reconciliation."

http://news.firedoglake.com/2009/10/27/lieberman-a-no-on-cloture-for-health-care-bill/

[Spazito]

19. There are, indeed, three votes needed from what I found on the Senate website...

"1. At the conclusion of the morning business at the beginning of a new legislative day, unless upon motion the Senate shall at any time otherwise order, the Senate shall proceed to the consideration of the Calendar of Bills and Resolutions, and shall continue such consideration until 2 hours after the Senate convenes on such day (the end of the morning hour); and bills and resolutions that are not objected to shall be taken up in their order, and each Senator shall be entitled to speak once and for five minutes only upon any question; and an objection may be interposed at any stage of the proceedings, but upon motion the Senate may continue such consideration; and this order shall commence immediately after the call for "other resolutions", or after disposition of resolutions coming "over under the rule", and shall take precedence of the unfinished business and other special orders. But if the Senate shall proceed on motion with the consideration of any matter notwithstanding an objection, the foregoing provisions touching debate shall not apply."

If the repubs object to the introduction of the health care bill, it would take 60 votes to overcome that objection from what I read in this section. This is the first vote Lieberman has committed he will NOT join the repubs if they attempt to stop it from coming to the floor.

I am doubtful Lieberman will carry through with his threat UNLESS there is already a default plan in place that ensures the 60 votes are there without Lieberman. The use of reconciliation is, indeed, an action of 'last result' I believe the Dems will use if forced to do so in order to get the bill to conference.

[Ian David]

9. Since when do we ever believe anything LIEberman says? n/t

[denem]

10. Landrieu has committed - No filibuster

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x8709307

Nelson has spoken more than approvingly of "opt out".

Joe stands (stinks) alone.

[NRaleighLiberal]

12. I'm not sure what to do with all of my misplaced anger at all things Republican.

And I include Lie berman in that category.

[bluestateguy]

18. if we were dealing with somebody who could be trusted I would agree

but that is not who we are dealing with.

[rucky]

20. Alrighty then

but can we still be angry at him?

[Dr Robert]

21. so the FAIL Brigade was wrong again!

somehow I don't think this will stop them from continuing to make asses of themselves

[rvablue]

22. I don't really care if he's going to vote to get it to the floor, as he is also publicly

stating that he's going to vote against it.

Traitor to the very core. Kick him from the Committee. I hope KO and Rachel rip into him tonight!

[jenmito]

25. If they pass it through reconciliation, they won't need his vote. n/t

[IndianaGreen]

26. It will never get to reconciliation if Lieberman joins the GOP filibuster

as he explicitly has said.

[jenmito]

27. Wyden thinks he won't join the filibuster in the end. n/t

[IndianaGreen]

28. Lieberman has voted with GOP in Senate more often than not

[jenmito]

30. I trust Wyden way more than I trust you. n/t

[IndianaGreen]

24. Turn the channel to MSNBC and watch Keith Olbermann

Holy Joe will allow debate and amendments, but he will join GOP in filibuster on final passage if there is a public option in bill.

[IndianaGreen]

29. CNN: would oppose a motion to end debate if the public option remains in the legislation

Washington (CNN) -- Independent Sen. Joseph Lieberman said Tuesday he would join a Republican filibuster to block the final vote on any health care bill that has a government-run public health insurance option.

Lieberman's vote is crucial to Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid's hopes of passing a health care bill that includes the controversial public option. Reid announced Monday he would send to the full Senate a health care bill that has a public option but also allows states to opt out of that provision.

Lieberman said he would support a vote to launch debate on the health care bill but would oppose a motion to end debate if the public option remains in the legislation. Democrats would need 60 votes in the 100-member Senate to close debate on the bill, and the Democratic caucus has 60 members, including Lieberman.

"I can't see a way in which I can vote for cloture on any bill that contained a creation of a government-operated and run insurance company," the Connecticut senator said. "It's just asking for trouble."

Also Tuesday, two other conservative-leaning Democratic senators, Ben Nelson of Nebraska and Mary Landrieu of Louisiana, said they would decide how to vote once they see the final bill.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/10/27/health.care/index.html

[BrklynLiberal]

33. Sorry.. I am still angry at LIEberman..and still despise him.

[havocmom]

34. Yeah, might be as simple as Joe helping anyone who bought stocks in insurance companies

in the past 24 hours. Thinking it's something to consider. Yeah, I AM that angry at Traitor Joe and I am that cynical about his motivations anymore.

[Clio the Leo]

35. He's saying he will let the bill move to a floor debate....

.... so that it would hopefully (as far as he's concerned) lose the PO. His point is that AFTER floor debate has occured, he wont vote for cloture on a motion to stop debate which could kill the bill.

He either ....

1. really wants a bill passed but doesn't want the PO and is making an effort to get rid of it

or

2. is putting on a grand show to save face with the Insurance companies who help fund his campaign. He will then later capitulate and let the bill pass with a PO.

I'm HOPING for number 2, but I think the more likely scenario is #1.

..... I think. lol

[IndianaGreen]

36. Well, jenmito, are you still defending that Lieberman POS?

Did you watch that video this morning on CNN where Lieberman says he will join a Republican filibuster if the Public Option is still on the bill when it comes time for a vote? What other excuse can you invent for that POS, and his whore of a wife that works for the health industry?

[Honeycombe8]

37. That is not what Lieberman said publicly yesterday. Why can't we get a straight answer

anymore about health care reform? What's going on here?

[IndianaGreen]

38. The OP is among a handful of DUers that put Holy Joe in the best light possible

I suspect that there are several motivations behind that, some honorable and some not.

[jenmito]

39. Looks like he was talking about filibustering the bill AFTER it's debated...

Harry Reid and others (including me, despite what some posters think) are hoping by the end of the debating period, he'll change his mind.