I cannot understand why the USA wouldn't want single payer HEALTHCARE!

[Rosa Luxemburg]

I was brought up on the NHS in the UK. NO probs. I had a wonderful GP (PCP). Access to the right medicine. Had a midwife team to attend to the birth. One midwife did the prenatal, one did the birth and one visited me at home EVERY day, weighed the baby, did checks on me and baby. The GP visited us at home after a week. Then, I had 6 months maternity leave full pay. I also had consultation with the ob/gyn specialist who was one of the country's top guys. My father had wonderful cardiac care and lived another 20 years before he died in his 80s.
If you are an emergency in the UK you will be seen right away. Ingrown toenails are not considered an emergency. Frankly, when I compare our system here - my husband had to wait 8 weeks for radiation after the HMO wouldn't cover him. We had to fight and fight for him to be covered. With all this admin. crap his tumor grew and he would have been in a better position if he had treatment right away. He is still alive, just. The radiation treatment has caused a neuropathy of his accessory nerve so his shoulder is deteriorating.....if Republicans are considering stopping our quest for healthcare for all free at the point of use, they have no business representing the American people.

[napi21]

1. Too many people make too much money off of health care here.

Drs, hosps, ins. cos' drug co's, pharmacies, & of course investors! How many times have you heard someone say "That's 6% of our whole economy!"

[Rosa Luxemburg]

13. It has to stop!

[BrklynLiberal]

2. There is no rational answer to that question.

I guess the only response would have to be what above poster said...too many people have ve$ted intere$t in the $tatu$ quo.

and they make enough money to be able to manipulate the media into convincing even those that would benefit from single-payer, that it would not be a good idea.

Anyone who gives single payer health care one moment's rational consideration would be for it...

[ipaint]

3. The settle for less crowd decided this was the best we could do. n/t

After they realized the healthcare investments in their porfolios would take a major hit if real reform was passed. Plus the health insurance companies, they who must be obeyed, said no.

[Laelth]

4. Many (if not most) Americans DO want single-payer.

It's the insurance industry, the pharmaceutical industry, and the hospital industry that doesn't. They have bought enough of our Congress to make single-payer impossible at the moment.

Or so it would seem.

:dem:

-Laelth

[flyarm]

5. because some think that is what they are getting , with a steady dose of bullshit , and others

aren't understanding what is going on, and the media and our government like it that fuking way! We have been sold out for my lifetime and i don't see it changing any time soon! I lived in Canada and saw the change there, and it was real..yes it was a bit painful at first, but I don't know of a Canadian who would change places with us with our so called bogus pile of crap called health care reform!

The difference is, is their parlimentary government..they can call a vote of no confidence on their prime minister and basically do a recall of their prime minister.. if he lies to them like we have been lied to over and over again!..Oh and they still have a real media!

[Oregone]

7. "they can call a vote of no confidence on their prime minister"

Oh, thats been working wonders lately, eh? :)

The opposition parties are almost too concerned about their own self interests to do anything about it. And while everyone tries to position themselves the best politically, the Cons ratings are doing quite well. Almost majority territory, right?

[flyarm]

16. in recent history..these PM's have been called on a vote of no confidence!

Pierre Elliott Trudeau (1974)
Joe Clark (1979)
Paul Martin (2005)

[Rosa Luxemburg]

12. I can't understand why people haven't protested?

they have laid down like lambs for slaughter

[rockymountaindem]

15. Because most Americans don't realize there is a better alternative

They think that people in Canada, the UK, France and Sweden all die every day waiting in line for penicillin.

[Oregone]

6. If it isn't what Mr Smiley Nobel suggests, they don't want a damn thing to do with it

I hate to say it so crassly, but the reality is that people will defend any policy decision in an effort to defend their chosen charismatic leaders. Unfortunately, people simply cannot separate the two and think about the policies in a rational manner. I see people, without any solid argument based in logic, rabidly defend something merely because of their devotion to those involved in creating it. Its national group-think, and a recipe for disaster.

[Hutzpa]

8. The same insurance companies

that tried to infiltrate NHS are the once stopping the public from getting it, if
you recollect during the reign of the Conservative party of Margaret Thatcher and
John Major there was talk of breaking up the NHS to copy the American system.

The wanted to break up the NHS.

Thanks to Tony Blair et al it never occurred.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

10. Thatcher like her conservative friends in the USA wanted to get rid of the NHS

basically conservatives want to privatize everything.

[mkultra]

9. because of american culture

its more individualistic than collectivist. This means that choice is necessary even if there is only one good choice in an ocean of junk.

Look at the way its handled today. Your employer provides you with a couple of choice with only one really being viable. Somehow, people want to hold on to that.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

11. the one thing that scares people

Is that they are concerned if they go for a NHS they will not get a better service.

I think it is correct to take a proportion out of the salary for healthcare. The VERY rich pay a lot more. It is only fair. The elderly don't pay or the unemployed don't pay.

Conservatives think that everyone is an entrepreneur and somehow can take a rabbit out of a hat to pay for healthcare.

Conservatives should be called the Privatization Party.

[mkultra]

23. mostly i think people just fear the "no recourse error"

meaning that if a private company does something wrong or intentional evil that results in horror, it makes the news and the results could be a ground swell of anger that causes the loss of business. If the organization is government though, you can go up the ladder and eventually be told to screw off and take it.

I had that happen to me recently. I have some rent houses that i lease to section 8 tenants. The housing authority requires an inspection yearly. I had one inspector ping me for cracking paint and force me to get it tested for lead. I looked around for a lead tester and couldn't find one. I called the inspector and told him this and his response was "Of course you didn't. Billy is the only one in town who does it." So i had to pay $250 to his friend billy. When i reported this to the head of housing, i got a response back from the very inspector who screwed me. His response was a forward of my email all the way back down the chain from the head of housing to him and then finally to me with his response attached. Needless to say, i look forward to working with him in the future and there is nothing i can do about it.

[andym]

14. Because many people have been taught to believe that private business is far more efficient than gov

then they don't want single payer, because they think that it will be inefficient, etc Of course, just eliminating the most of the 15-30% overhead of the insurers contradicts the efficiency argument.

Also, there has been a steady diet of tax cuts since Reagan, and few people will accept tax increases, even if raising taxes will actually save them money overall (by eliminating the cost of insurance).

[valerief]

17. USA citizens want it. USA puppetmasters want to get richer by not providing it.

USA puppetmasters control the guys with the guns.

[vaberella]

18. Insurance is a multimillion dollar racket here. The Senators & Reps get wealthy from it too. n/t

[Kablooie]

19. Because we'd fight over who that single payer will be. I'm certainly not going to take the job.

[slipslidingaway]

20. Many people do want SP, instead they marketed the idea of choice...

with the public option. Polls consistently showed that there was support among the people, but our politicians took it off the table.


Another poll says a majority support single-payer
January 27th, 2008

http://www.mnhealthreformcaucus.org/?p=8

"Yet another poll demonstrates that a majority of Americans support universal coverage under a single-payer system. A poll conducted during the week of December 14-20, 2007 by the Associated Press and Yahoo found that 65 percent of Americans support extending Medicare to everyone, and that 54 percent are willing to identify themselves as single-payer supporters..."


Best wishes to you and your husband as you go through this fight.

:)

[Rosa Luxemburg]

21. Thanks, it is simpler to have a small % be collected from your salary every month

in the UK they used to take a small 'fee' out every month to pay for health and SS. You didn't have to worry whether your employer gave insurance. Then you didn't have to worry at the front desk of the hospital whether you were covered.

[slipslidingaway]

24. Yes and every citizen is then engaged to improve the system, in the US...

we're all just little groups fighting to keep our piece of the pie.

[Brigid]

22. Contact the Department of Insurance,

or its equivalent in your state, right away; your insurance carrier may be in for some serious trouble over this. I am so sorry about your husband. :hug:

[Joe the Liberal]

25. Because of the huge taxaphobia that plagues the US.....

There is very solid case to have a single payer system but it doesn't matter. No amount of cold hard facts and evidence is enough to change the minds of Americans who have bought into the idea that taxes are evil.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

26. but large insurance premiums aren't evil

[Joe the Liberal]

28. In their minds they are not......

you see it's ok to get scammed out of your money and end up paying more for something that is essential so long as taxes don't go up.

These people would happily live out the rest of their days in misery so long as they don't have to pay higher taxes, the GOP's fear mongering has worked well.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

30. I think it is time to enlighten these people!

[GoCubsGo]

32. They aren't capable of being enlightened

Even now, they still don't get that their premiums would go away in a single-payer plan. If they don't understand that now, they never will. You can try all you want to educate them, but they don't want to be educated. People like that don't want change, no matter how uncomfortable things are for them. Change is way too scary for them to handle. Point out the facts, and they'll just come back with some ill-informed talking point lie. The only way to deal with these people is to move on without them.

[DailyGrind51]

27. Insurance companies don't want to lose busine$$!

[earth mom]

29. People buy into lies all the time here. Hope & Change was one of the biggest. nt

[Flying Dream Blues]

38. Wow. nt

[kenny blankenship]

39. Yep. They got me too.

Won't happen again though.

[saracat]

31. Because the president and Congress care more about reelection and the midterms

and the lobbyists deals than the people.

[joeycola]

33. Congressman Wiener needs your help on his single payer Medicare For All amendment............

fyi. hope all send a fax.

Forum Name General Discussion: Presidential
Topic subject Congressman Wiener needs your help on his single payer Medicare For All amendment.
Topic URL http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x8715792#8715792
8715792, Congressman Wiener needs your help on his single payer Medicare For All amendment.
Posted by joeycola on Mon Oct-26-09 04:27 AM


Do it. Thanks.

Dear xxxxx

Congressman Wiener needs your help on his single payer Medicare For All amendment. I just got back from a conference in Boston where Rep. Wiener asked for help on two things:

First, and urgently, he wants people to contact Speaker Pelosi and ask her to keep her promise to allow a floor amendment and floor debate on a single payer amendment to the House bill. Although the Speaker promised such a floor amendment in July , there is a strong likelihood that she will back down on that promise in the very near future unless she gets a flood of emails, faxes or calls. So let's flood Nancy Pelosi's office with faxes like we did once before.

http://www.1payer.net/faxapp/senders/add/cid:40

Remarkably, Speaker Pelosi said in Democratic Caucus "If it were up to me, we would have single payer." Let's remind Nancy Pelosi with a flood of faxes: it IS up to her because she is the Speaker.

Second, Rep. Wiener asked that we flood our Congresspersons with calls and push them to support the single payer Medicare For All amendment. About 100 other Congressmen are solidly behind it now and even blue dogs are wavering, so Wiener thinks a push on Congress will help a great deal. You can send a fax supporting the Wiener single payer Medicare For All amendment right now. Just click here.

You can send a FREE fax to Pelosi very simply and easily.

Here is the link to the fax.

It simply asks Pelosi to keep her promise for a floor debate in the House. The Pelosi fax linked above is very important. You can also call her office at

202-225-4965.

Don't let her back down on her promise of a single payer floor debate in the House.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

35. Good idea!

[and-justice-for-all]

34. It is not that the people do not want it...

it is the people vs the corporations.

Getting our reps to listen to us and to tell the corporations and other special interest to fuck off is a daunting task.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

36. On MSNBC today

why is the pre existing condition thing still there?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33441437/ns/health-health_care/

[harun]

37. It's a great argument for implementing Democracy in America

as that would translate to people getting what people want.

Unfortunately we live in a Corporate Representative Republic, and those masters pick what services the people get.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

40. How can people vote against themselves?

The American people who need this most argue and vote against healthcare reform. It doesn't make sense. When I tell people in the UK about this they can't understand it either.

[harun]

46. Propaganda, really good propaganda, and racism. Lot of people in the U.S. freak

out at anything that promotes equality. They think it is a hand out to minorities and are brainwashed to think this.

The American Civil War is still being fought (politically now, instead of on the battle field) and the super rich exploit it to keep expanding their slice of the pie.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

47. The GOP have no problem with fat cats creaming off the profits

they worship fraudsters, crooks anything that is privatized.

[depakid]

41. Irrational fear of government trumps reason

Code words like "taxes" short circuit peoples' reason process.

They'd rather pay twice the amount- and then some, risking bankruptcy rather than evil taxes.

It's to the point where balance sheets seemingly don't matter.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

44. but you don't need to call them taxes it is a 'gratuity'

we all pay a gratuity out of our salary to pay for healthcare. Soften the blow change the word.

[Thrill]

42. They do want it. But The Election System is setup so elected officials

have to depend on campaign donations.

You can't get to Single Payer unless you have strong campaign finance reform first.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

43. you don't HAve to take the healthcare industry's money for campaigns

perhaps Obama would consider reforming campaign financing?

[Thrill]

45. You HAVE to, You know why? Because if you don't

they'll give it to your opponent. And we all know elections are about money in this country. Sad but true. If you aren't from a solid liberal state or district. You're going to take it.

Bernie Sanders says this all the time. Until their is strong campaign finance reform. You aren't going to get single payer.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

48. all campaign donations should be put in one great pot

and then they would be distributed fairly to each candidate. Get rid of special interests.

[dionysus]

49. several reasons

ignorance
apathy
they haven't needed expensive care yet.
work pays for their insurance and they've never ran across an expensive hospital stay.

i even know some liberals who are scared of universal health care because they've bought the lies about the canadian system.

if everyone was aware and educated the whole nation would be screaming from the rooftops for it.

i think the root of most all of our problems as a nation, be it war, health care, anything, is that for for every person politically aware and educated on the issues, there are 10 dumbasses sitting on their couches who just don't give a shit.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

51. it's amazing how these people suddenly become interested they become when there' a huge bill to pay

[timzi]

50. Good Post

I often wonder whether our brand of "uber-capitalism" carries the seeds of its own destruction.

At least there are still those out there fighting the good fight. What we could really use
is some help from those who profess a love for rightousness and their fellow man....yes, I'm
talking about organized religion. How sad is it that the majority of them are either silent
or are parsing words?

[Rosa Luxemburg]

52. religions should be pushing for healthcare reform for their flock

again it's probably down to church donations from the 'capitalists'

[Rosa Luxemburg]

53. did you all see this?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/33487061#33487061

[Orsino]

54. Because the TV tells them not to.

Reason and ethics bow to televised FUD.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

55. It would be nice to have balanced TV here