I'm sorry, are those killed at the Pentagon on 9/11 not as important as those killed at the WTC?!!!

[Clio the Leo]

Let me preface my post saying, I lost a friend in the World Trade Center. Her name was Jakki and she worked in the office of Marsh & McLennan which is where the first plane hit. Every time I see that footage I turn my head away because it's not just a plane hitting building to me. It's the brutal end of the life of someone who was dear to me. The MOST I can hope for is that her death came suddenly and without fear or pain.

That being said ..... I am SO ANGRY about this MSM's latest outrage!!! Now that the President has proven he can handle the health care debate, they are ramping up their questions in today's WH briefing as to why the President is NOT going to Ground Zero tomorrow? They keep insisting on an answer.

Well, he's going to the Pentagon! (Joe is going to Ground Zero.) .... I'm sorry, is the loss of those who died at the Pentagon not as great? Should they be any less grieved for?!!!! Why are they not bothered that he's also not going to PA?

The dogs.

Normally the press doesn't bother me. I know they've got a job to do and they're doing it.

But this BS!!! The lives of those we lost is not something to make sport of!!! It's DISGUSTING. I only wish I'd had enough sense to pay attention to who was asking him those questions so I could write to them and complain.

Disgraceful.

(and thank you for letting me vent)

[Captain Hilts]

1. No, they aren't. By agreeing to work in the military you agree to go in Harm's Way.

I know folks that work there and had friends who lived four blocks from WTC.

The Naval Intelligence office took a huge hit.

There is no inherent danger to working in the WTC. There is the Pentagon.

Hell, my parents met in the Pentagon.

[brendan120678]

2. How many of those killed at the Pentagon...

"worked in the military?" Weren't most of them civilian employees of the DoD?

[Captain Hilts]

19. You hang with DoD, you take that risk. The folks there feel this way. nt

[NikolaC]

29. Two of My Next Door Neighbors Died In The Pentagon

I don't care where they worked, they did NOT deserve to die (none of the 9/11 victims did), risk or no risk.

[beac]

33. You are forgetting about the civilians ON THE PLANE, but your argument

is still ridiculous. Do you think that all the lives Bush lost in his vile wars are less important than those of the WTC victims? Yes, people in the armed services agree to put themselves in harm's way but that does not make them LESS IMPORTANT.


Sheesh.

[treestar]

48. Not at the Pentagon. No one expects that to be a battlefield.

[librechik]

54. yeah? That attitude is what got them hit.

personally, I think they did a lousy job protecting my Pentagon. Especially since they were warned.
But there's no excuse for thinking they aren't a target--not then and not now.

[treestar]

63. Not at all. What got them hit was the random act of 20 fanatical crazed

terrorists! They were as random a hit as the twin towers. They were equally victims as the twin towers, no more was aimed at the Pentagon than was aimed at the towers.

[librechik]

67. hmmm. I don't subscribe to that conspiracy theory

The only evidence they've ever presented for its validity was obtained through torture.

I really have no idea what happened that day. Except that there were no jets in the air to protect us within minutes, as I had always been led to believe was the protocol. And I have seen that protocol followed to the letter both before an after the attacks. Why the big gap in response time that has never been adequately explained?

I want a new investigation. There are too many questions that have either never been answered or are in grave doubt because of the torture issue. Until we address our own complicity, we are never going to know what happened.

[WinkyDink]

55. Isn't the salient point "citizens"?

[supernova]

3. What an ugly thing to say

Not everyone who works or did work at the Pentagon was military. Lots of civilian contractors work there too. (Administrative, IT, clerical staff. I'm not talking about Blackwater hot shots)

You rub salt into the wound of the OPer.

edit: The victims at the Pentagon aren't any less loved or missed by those who knew them.

[Connie_Corleone]

4. "Ignored" doesn't know that civilians work at the Pentagon too?

Sad.

[wicket]

9. YUP

[endarkenment]

15. +1

[Number23]

62. A very worthy candidate for the Ignore crown.

:thumbsup:

[soleft]

6. and the passengers on the plane

[supernova]

7. Yes that's true

Thanks for the reminder

[Captain Hilts]

21. Their deaths are as great a tragedy. But they're different.

Working in the Pentagon isn't like working at the WTC. The risks and rewards are very different.

It was terrible for everyone.

[supernova]

26. Sorry, I disagree with you

on this issue.

Dying on the battlefield is one thing. That's to be expected.

Most people don't expect to die at the office, regardless of what that office does.

Now, if it were that monstrosity of an embassy in Baghdad, then I'd agree with you.

[Captain Hilts]

30. If you knew that packages have been searched upon entering the Pentagon since WWII

and that buses no longer go under the building because someone tried to blow one up under the building about 30 years ago. And that the shopping center under the building has been closed to the outside for about 20 years. Metal detectors were in use long ago.

Security has been ramped up through the years because it IS a recognized target.

[supernova]

34. Actually I did know that

I lived in DC for a while and had friends who worked in t]he Pentagon as well as in the intelligence community.

It's common knowledge in DC that the P has high security. It ain't no big secret.

But, please do assume the hell out of me.

In deference to Miss Cleo I will drop this little tet and just say that we think differently.

[Captain Hilts]

28. The Pentagon is a target. WTC is not. Pentagon security has been

seriously ramped up over the past 30 years for this reason. Someone set off a bomb on a bus under the building about 30 years ago, so the buses no longer go under the building. The shopping center below used to be open to anyone. It hasn't been for about 20 years.

The Pentagon had metal detectors, etc. long before most buildings. Packages were searched for all folks coming in as far back as WWII.

It's a natural target. That's why they have the 'Ground Zero' cafe there.

The deaths that day were all tragedies. Folks from my university were killed. The office of Naval Intelligence took a huge hit. It was awful. All the deaths that day were awful.

But folks that go to work in offices at the WTC had no reason to see themselves as targets as Pentagon employees do.

[CJCRANE]

38. delete

[IDFbunny]

42. The WTC was a target for destruction in 1993

If the tower had collapsed from that bomb blast it could have be 20,000 victims. So they DID know it was a target.

[hileeopnyn8d]

44. So why don't you just say what you really want to say

Which is that you agree with MSM that the President should be going to Ground Zero, because that's what all this dancing around you're doing really comes down to.

[DevonRex]

49. Bingo. Just a bandwagon jumper. nt

[Clio the Leo]

5. Bernard Curtis Brown II

Bernard Curtis Brown II
Age: 11

Hometown: Washington, D.C., USA

Occupation: Student, Leckie Elementary School (Washington)

Location: Passenger, American Flight 77, Pentagon

"He just loved basketball. He's been playing since he was 7, in Texas. He tried football, but he couldn't, because of his asthma. He played soccer at 5. As he got older, he would just go out and shoot baskets. He usually got up Saturday morning, about 8 in the morning, and he'd just go outside and dribble, shoot. The goal was right outside our neighbors' bedroom window. He would play by himself in the mornings, or his dad would go out and play with him. Sometimes I would, or his sister. The neighborhood kids would come and play once they got up. He always said he was going to be a star, that he was going to play basketball some day." -- Sinita Brown, Mother

Profile:

Eleven-year-old Bernard Brown was clever, a quick wit, the kind of boy who kept his teachers on their toes. Estella Cleveland, who taught his fifth-grade class last year at Leckie Elementary School in Southeast Washington, loved him.



He would have turned 20 this year.

[supernova]

8. What a lovely little boy

So sorry for your loss of your dear friend.

[Clio the Leo]

12. thank you ;-) NT

[liberalpragmatist]

35. Lies! There was no plane! It was a missile!

:sarcasm:

[msallied]

10. Wow. That's exactly what I would expect a soulless jerk to say.

[Dappleganger]

11. So you think they were asking for it?

Because they were in the military?

Your comments disgust me.

[Captain Hilts]

22. No one said that. Working in the Pentagon has risks and rewards working in an office at WTC

does not have.

They're just different.

Both are tragedies.

[ScreamingMeemie]

13. There is inherent danger in getting up each morning...

Sorry.

[Captain Hilts]

23. Yes, there is. But there is a difference between a fighter jet that crashes

and a commercial airline that crashes.

Both are terrible, but different.

[DevonRex]

25. And it was a commercial airliner that crashed into the Pentagon.

With actual, um, PEOPLE on it. :eyes:

[Captain Hilts]

31. Those folks are innocents whose deaths relate to those at the WTC. nt

[ScreamingMeemie]

37. They do? How? They were not in NYC. They were in D.C.

Clarify how that should relate.

[Captain Hilts]

43. It's not the city that makes the difference. Working at the headquarters for the Defense Dept. does

[ScreamingMeemie]

45. Sorry. That is a pretty flimsy argument.

As the niece of a former Pentagon employee I guess I can say that. There is no difference. My uncle would tell you the same.

[Dappleganger]

59. That's BS

There's thousands of civilians who work there and nobody expected anything like that to happen nor any other kind of danger. No more so than those in the WTC.

[ScreamingMeemie]

27. In your mind.

Justify it any way you wish I guess.

[Clio the Leo]

14. PLEASE DO ME A FAVOR!!!!!

Please dont pile on to Captain Hilts ..... I'm sure he/she is simply not remembering all of those who were killed at the Pentagon. ..... This is a subject matter I'd REALLY rather us not fight with one another about. Thanks in advance.

YELL AT THE PRESS!!!!! lol

[endarkenment]

16. the human mind is adept at pattern perception

apropos of nothing

[ScreamingMeemie]

17. Oh Clio... I'm not piling on, just pointing out the obvious.

I am so sorry for your loss.

[Captain Hilts]

24. I have friends that worked there that day. The deaths there were terrible.

But, as someone who has had parents and friends that worked there and who still do, they - in the Pentagon - see their Sept. 11th deaths as contextually different from those at the WTC.

All the deaths that day were terrible.

[dionysus]

32. a life is a life, how can you be so cold? just knowing the risks does not make

one's life less valuable!

[ScreamingMeemie]

36. Apparently he has friends and family that work in the Pentagon and they

feel the same way. That makes him an expert, as it always does.

[Uzybone]

53. Most foolish post ever.....wow

[LanternWaste]

64. You can of course point us towards...

You can of course point us towards the relevant contractual passage a civilian signs to work in the Pentagon cafeteria which stipulates and defines a higher degree of working risk?

[Seen the light]

66. Of course there were inherent risks in working at the WTC

It had been the target of terrorism once in the past, had it not?

[DevonRex]

18. We love you Clio and we're so very sorry about your friend. It must be hell

to see that image over and over. :hug:

I agree with you completely. We lost wonderful people at the Pentagon, too, and they deserve to be respected.

[Cha]

20. So sad about your friend, Clio, who

was killed at the WTC.:(

It's none of the corporatemediawhores' freakin' business where the President goes on 9/11/09..they don't investigate anything viable and are just in the gossip rag business so they lose their authority to rage.

CNN-
(404) 827 – 1500
Comment line: (404) 827 - 0234
(From grasswire
fax: [phone].
CNN NEWS DIRECTOR Kim Bondy. 404 827 1500. fax. [phone]
CNN NEWSROOM 404.827.1500 . 404.827.1500. [e-mail]
Call Anderson Cooper at 1-866-NY-AC360

Everyone at CNN is listed individually on this page: http://www.cnn.com/feedback/cnntv /


MSNBC
- Phone: [phone] EMAIL: [e-mail]

The "press' job" is to manipulate and manufacture propaganda.

[Love Bug]

39. I'm sorry for your loss, Clio. Vent away!

I'm sure the families and friends who grieve do grieve the same no matter if their loved one was in the WTC, the Pentagon, or on the planes. It's a dreadful loss from an evil act that remains unpunished.

I get annoyed at the whole "We lost 3,000 Americans on 9/11!" meme that continues to this day. No, we lost 3,000 people of many nationalities, including Americans, on American soil on 9/11. I'm sure the families of victims from the UK and other countries affected are long past tired of hearing that one.

Reporters can be real asshats sometimes.

[supernova]

41. Single biggest hit to UKers

in the modern era is what Tony Blair said on David Letterman last night.

Anyone lost that day was valuable, regardless of how they came to be in harm's way.

[CJCRANE]

40. Obama is the CiC so it's appropriate for him to go to the Pentagon.

And I think Joe Biden is a good fit to go to NYC.

[LiberalFighter]

46. It's been 8 years now. Why should the President continue to attend each year?

How many times has a President shown up at Oklahoma City?

Once every 10 or 25 years should be enough. Anything more is political. And if/when the media hounds people to attend more often then they are not acting as the Fourth Estate should act.

[WinkyDink]

56. Then there is Pearl Harbor.

[treestar]

47. Gawds, they complain about everything!

[Retrograde]

57. Just noticed that?

If Obama planned to visit Manhattan tomorrow they'd be accusing him of trying to politicize the event for personal reasons. He can't win with some people.

[RamboLiberal]

50. I'm sorry for you loss Clio

And I agree with you. While I think it will be appropriate every 9-11 for observances to be held at each site, WTC, Pentagon, and Shanksville, I don't think the President needs to be at each site each year.

I would imagine that he might well do that on the 10th anniversary in 2011.

None of us who were alive that day will ever forget it, and of course it holds special sorrow for family and those like you who lost loved ones.

Something about this present generation and news media unlike those of the WWII generation (I'm thinking of Pearl Harbor) seems to want to wallow in the day and not just observe with dignity.

Maybe George W. Bush should be the one attending, after all it happened on his watch and he was the one who told the CIA briefer with the August 6th PDB "Ok, you've covered your ass". And imagine if Obama had been the one who sat with a "deer in the headlights" look in a class room for 7+ minutes as the country was being attacked. They'd have hounded him out of office.

[AspenRose]

51. Obama went to Ground Zero last year (with McCain).

If he were to go again now, he'd probably be accused of "politicizing 9/11" a la Bush.

Damned if he does; damned if he doesn't.

[maryellen99]

65. The only site that President Obama hasn't visited is Shanksville

Last year McCain was invited by the families, I'm not sure if Obama was invited though.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

52. Per capita yes, in total no.

Which is not to say it isn't absurd to criticise Obama for going to the Pentagon.

[firedupdem]

58. So sorry for your loss Clio and you vent anytime you need to....

you are loved here! :hug:

[rustydog]

60. Sorry, but 9-11 will always be NYC and the towers coming down

The image is too graphic, too powerful to be shared with the pentagon and the open field where the "heroes" ccrashed and died...

Their death is no less important or meaningful, they are not as profitable in political capitalas the iconic images of 9-11.

[Jennicut]

61. Clio, a good friend I worked with at the time nearly lost her sister at the Pentagon. I feel the

same exact way as you.
Thankfully her sister came out of her coma a few months later.

For me, watching the Pentagon footage is painful and reminds me of holding my crying friend in my arms while we watched the footage on tv. My friend Jocie was devastated and had no idea if her sister was dead or alive. It has just as much importance to me at the Twin Towers. I have a 2nd cousin who worked in the Twin Towers as well but she never went to work that day. Thankfully.

[freddie mertz]

68. Who are the MSM types making this claim?

Without a link, it is hard to know what to make of this....

[ecstatic]

69. Just today Morning Joe was saying he was overexposing himself

They can't make up their minds! He's either doing too much or too little. Exposing himself too much or too little. Which is it?