Think you haven't showered with a gay person?

[dsc]

Say you have showered with 100 different people in your life (not unreasonable if you took PE in school, lived in a dorm, etc). Now say 6 percent of people are gay. Then 94% aren't. The probability of all 100 of the people with whom you showered not being gay would be .94^100 which is .00205 or 2/10's of 1 percent, or 2 out of a thousand. If gays make up 10% of the population then the probablity falls to .000026 which is 26 out of 1,000,000. Not being struck by lightening land but not a usual occurance by any means. So let's stop the crapola about showering with gay people being a problem.

[davidinalameda]

1. I haven't showered with one for a while

damn it

[MadBadger]

2. Oooook??

[traxster]

3. I'm sure I have...not that it should matter. n/t

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Starry Messenger]

6. Whiskey Tango Foxtrot.

Gay people have been serving in the military since the dawn of civilization. And if anyone has been at all paying attention most sexual harassment in the military comes from straight soldiers.

[dgibby]

48. Sure as hell wasn't a gay guy that attacked me in my BOQ room

(he broke the door down in the process). Fortunately, he was drunk and I wasn't, so I had the advantage and was able to get away from him.

[cboy4]

7. I'll say it again, it's always the unattractive people who go apeshit

over this issue.

[ruggerson]

19. true that

in my experience, good looking straight guys are almost never homophobic in the least.

The virulent phobes I have encountered are ugly, out of shape straight guys that seem to live in their own bizarre, little fantasy land where gay guys are trying to jump their bones.

[cboy4]

22. You said it all!

:thumbsup:

[QC]

58. Yes, the ones who could stroll naked from one end of Provincetown to the other

and attract no interest are always the ones convinced that every gay man is plotting to ravish them.

It never fails.

[hulklogan]

8. What, exactly, is a stereotypical in-your-face-gay?

Just curious. I'd like to be able to ID that person in case I happen to find myself in a shower with him.

[Honeycombe8]

26. I was trying to verbalize what THEY are thinking about gay people.

So I'm just saying they have some idea of an in-your-face gay guy showering with them. I'm not sure exactly what they would have in their minds about a stereotype.

[Starry Messenger]

29. And who are THEY?

And what pray tell is an "in your face gay guy"? Like this guy?

[Honeycombe8]

34. I refer you back to the post that you responded to. Duh. nt

[Starry Messenger]

65. Who are "They"?

That is what I am responding to. Duh. :eyes:

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

80. Perez Hilton?

He almost seems like he wants to be a stereotype.

:hi:

[Lex]

9. None of what you allege is born out in countries that DO allow gays to serve.

So, again, you are just plain wrong.

[Creideiki]

11. There you go again,

trying to apply logic to the situation.

[Honeycombe8]

27. I am not making a case for or against. I'm just saying what I've heard

being said on TV, on the political shows. As a political junkie, I've heard all sorts of discussions on all sorts of issues.

What I stated (maybe not so well), was the gist of at least one argument I've heard by military people and others against it.

I don't know if it's a good argument or not, having no experience with the military. But when I heard it, it sounded at the minimum to be a reasonable thing to look into and be considered. Maybe it wouldn't turn out to be valid.

[Creideiki]

10. Don't worry, Princess

You're not Chris Evans--nobody will be wanting to look at you.

Well, maybe with the Aegis handy for protection.

[Honeycombe8]

28. Placed on ignore. Name calling inappropriate. nt

[Hello_Kitty]

49. I served with OPENLY STRAIGHT people when I was in the Navy!

I mean, they really threw it up in your face and everything, what with pictures of their opposite-marriage spouses all over their lockers and desks.

[Skittles]

54. LOL....Kitty

I think a LOT of people have no realization that being "openly gay" really means....not hiding it. Yup. :D

[Jakes Progress]

5. Think I care? nt

[hulklogan]

12. Why don't women seem to have these same showering issues?

I rarely hear a woman freaking out that she might be sharing a shower room with a lesbian. :shrug:

[PBS Poll-435]

13. PE

nt

[hulklogan]

14. What?

:shrug: :shrug:

[PBS Poll-435]

41. Penis Envy

Tale as old as time.

[Skittles]

43. I never understood the concept of penis envy

why would we gals be jealous of something that looks like a dead chicken's neck and can be out-performed by a couple of AA batteries?

[PBS Poll-435]

45. Whoa

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

[Skittles]

46. alright, I cribbed it from a lesbian comic

but yeah, :rofl: :D

[cboy4]

51. You're asking for an AA battery ass kicking

Yes INDEED.

[Skittles]

53. I'll take you and AA batteries on any DAY, cboy4

yes INDEED :hi:

[Arugula Latte]

72. Yeah -- I never wanted one.

As Elaine said, "I don't know how you guys walk around with those things."

[Stargazer09]

75. I happened to be eating when I read that!

Almost choked on my food!!!! :spray:

Thanks for making my day! :rofl:

[Withywindle]

15. Projection.

Straight men who get all twitchy about the very possibility of being checked out by a gay man (horrors!) are mostly just remembering how creepy and obnoxious and overbearing they've been when coming on to women in the past and get creeped out imagining someone they're not interested in doing it to THEM. They're terrified little babies at the mere thought of getting some of their own medicine.

Also considerably overrating their own irresistibility.

[SeattleGirl]

20. Well said, Withy

That's absolutely it. If these baby men would engage their brains a bit more, they might realize that. But, I won't be holding my breath for that.

[Withywindle]

31. Thanks. HomoPHOBIA is so apt in these cases.

I can't believe all we inferiorly sexual beings (women of all orientations, GBT men) are supposed to bow down to the mighty power of the straight male phallus - when everytime this "argument" comes up, homophobic straight men proudly show themselves off for the whiny fragile delicate little hothouse flowers that they are.

Message to lurking homophobes: You've shared the world with queers your whole life and always will. If this still makes you wet the bed (with pee, I mean - not the other stuff) and possibly incapable of doing your job if your every single idiot prejudice isn't catered to: GET HELP.

[Starry Messenger]

24. Oh so true.

+1

[Withywindle]

33. Thanks, but it's so frakkin' obvious, isn't it?

[surrealAmerican]

76. That's it.

They certainly wouldn't want anyone treating them the way they treat women.

[pnwmom]

32. At my schools, we didn't have group showers. We had individual

showers with curtains.

This was true in the public middle school, in a private high school, and at college.

[Hello_Kitty]

50. I shared a barracks room with a lesbian for 2 years when I was in Japan.

Amazingly, she was able to keep her hands off me. ;)

[AngryAmish]

62. Fear of rape

[Dappleganger]

66. I've showered with them plenty of times

Not just in PE but I played softball, basketball and volleyball so I played sports with them.

We ALL hung out together because we were friends and that's what friends do.
I didn't care they looked at me--wth is the big deal?

[Behind the Aegis]

16. Some people are so stupid.

And because I know how uncomfortable some are being looked at in the shower, trust me, most of you have nothing we are interested in unless you look like this (and this only to a subset of gay/bi men):

[ruggerson]

21. and if you look like that

chances are that you're gay.

[Behind the Aegis]

25. And if not, there is, according to the Religious Reich, a conversion program....

....I am on the committee. Want a toaster? :evilgrin:

[ZombieHorde]

35. How did you get a picture of me in the shower? nt

[DarkTirade]

42. ... and my first thought at seeing that picture was...

"Damn. I need to get off my ass and start working out." :P

[Creideiki]

79. He needs to work on his legs

Too many guys concentrate way too much on the upper body without realizing the lower body is just as important.

[Fridays Child]

17. There's a bumper sticker in this, somewhere.

I'll be damned if I know what it should say but I know it's there.

[tkmorris]

18. Pretty certain I have

I was in the Navy. For the first 4 months or so I showered with an awful lot of other men, at least one had to be gay. Funny thing though, we all knew at the time that it was likely, but it doesn't really matter. I mean really, why would it matter? It's not as if it presents some sort of threat or something, it's just some dude taking a shower. No one is going to even think of checking anyone else out in there anyway.

[CTyankee]

57. Well, I showered with a nun regularly for a couple of years. Seriously.

She's a professor of Classics at the school I was attending to get my Master's. I belonged to the school gym at a reduced student rate and would hit the pool usually about the time Sister X would. There were communal showers and nobody had a choice unless they went home to shower off the chlorine.

This lady was in her 70s and was completely nonchalant about her naked body. But it sure surprised my husband when I told him about it.

[Jennicut]

23. Are these straight men and women afraid they will be sexually harassed by gay people?

I'm sorry, but straight people can sexually harass too, sometimes in the military. What a stupid stereotype. I say that as a straight woman.

[Withywindle]

38. There is currently a horrifying rate of rape and sexual harrassment in the US military.

Way higher than in the civilian population. It's not GLBT people doing any of it.

[Jennicut]

84. Exactly. I have seen some horrible stories of women harrassed by men in the military.

[flvegan]

30. I'm sure I have, and probably will again.

And you know what, I just don't care. I'll go one further. I could be at the gym, getting in the shower and KNOW that there were a couple gay fellas in there, and I just wouldn't care. Where does this fear or insecurity come from? Jesus.

[JI7]

36. notice it's usually unattractive hetero men who think gay guys will want them

John Kennedy Jr said gay men came on to him all the time and he had no problem with it.

it's always some unattractive type that is complaining about how some gay will look at them.

[Lucky Luciano]

40. When I was young (20ish), I thought I would be very irritated if

a gay guy hit on me, but then when such things happened, I couldn't care less. :shrug: If anything, it means the women were thinking the same thing :-)

[jberryhill]

60. On behalf of unattractive hetero men....

...we can always dream that someone might be interested, can't we?

(and, yes, I am the official spokesmodel for unattractive hetero men)

[pnwmom]

37. I actually know I haven't.

None of my schools had group showers for women.

[surrealAmerican]

78. Same here.

Group showers are not universal.

[Withywindle]

39. I know for a fact I have.

Know what? No biggie. I'll go one better: I went to a hippie college that had co-ed showers. So I, a woman, got used to showering with men I wasn't otherwise intimate with. (Some of whom, I imagine, were gay, most of whom were probably straight.) I'm sure there was checking-out going on. (I'm bi, I operate on a presumption that everyone checks everyone else out discreetly out of the corner of the eye - although, when your face is covered in shampoo, not so much). So what? It's only if you make it someone else's problem, through harassment, that it comes to the surface--and frankly, straight men have no leg to stand on when it comes to criticizing others for THAT.

Humans can get used to anything. I loved the co-ed bathrooms on the new Battlestar Galactica, because they kinda felt like home. :)

[kwenu]

44. What's the point of this? What guy thinks he hasn't been in a locker room with a gay person?

Personally,I've never cared. It's not like we're going to be having sex anytime soon so what does it matter?

[Dangerously Amused]

47. Most homophobes are projecting their own repressed homosexuality.

They spend a lot of time "worrying" (fantasizing) over what it would be like to be hit on -- or sexually assaulted -- by a gay person; issues that don't even warrant a second thought for a normal straight person.

[Dappleganger]

67. Good point...

I bet their daddies implanted those nasty thoughts into their little formative brains, too.

[depakid]

52. Hey dsc -you taught me about a couple of things over the years

helped me gain perspective, but I gotta say in return- this isn't one of those moments.

[bigwillq]

55. Never showered after PE class

in all my years of school. None of us did. We didn't have showers in middle school, and in high school, we only had one or two showers (it would've took too long).

In college, my dorm had separate stalls for each shower.

But I get your point. :)

[jberryhill]

59. Same Here

I always get the feeling I missed out on some great formative experience because we just didn't shower at school.

Of course, I did have a shower at the YMCA a few times, but the odds of running into a gay person at a YMCA must be... gosh... infinitesimally small.

[bigwillq]

64. I've never showered

in a public place with other people in the same stall as I. It's always been separate stalls, and when I did, I would dress in the stall.

[slackmaster]

56. I am quite sure that I did so every day in junior high school and high school

:hi:

[QC]

61. Oh Mama, that gay homosexual man saw my peenyus! n/t

[Arkansas Granny]

63. Frankly, I don't know for sure one way or another and it's no big deal.

It's really something that never entered my mind.

[CrownPrinceBandar]

68. I know I've showered w/ a gay person.........

Running HS cross-country w/ a very out best friend would have covered that base (and in the 80's, no less!).

[Peacetrain]

69. I probably have, never knew it, and didn't give a damn

[bunnies]

70. lmao. I definitely have.

But those times were intentional. :rofl:

[snooper2]

71. And the reason this is in GDP is?

:rofl:

Obama mention something about it:?

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[dbmk]

73. Wheres the crapola?

I would probably set the percentage higher (afaik its more around 10%) - but as scientific excercise goes it is probably a relatively simplified model? :)

As far as showering with gay people, I am 100% sure I have. And I could care less.
I think the main issue most straight men have with it - if they have one, that is - is the idea of being assessed on attractiveness while being naked - in a situation where you should be relatively relaxed about your nakedness.
"He likes men - so he must check me out", kinda deal.
To play the devils advocate a little:
If that wasn't an issue for anyone, why have separate showers for men and women (most places)?

[dkf]

74. Is it common to do a mass shower?

I only had to suffer through that for 2 years in intermediate school and I'm not sure if people even know they are gay by that age.

I don't understand why we have to have mass showers anyway with straight or gay people. Ugh.

[pnwmom]

82. I never had that in a school at any level. And I agree,

it would be uncomfortable no matter who was in there with you.

[madmom]

77. My SO worked for one of the Big 3, they had communal showers, don't know about

the women's side. He was always complaining about the water not being hot enough when everyone was showering at the same time.

[montanto]

81. Spent a few minutes searching for the source of this issue,

but can't find it. That said, through HS we boys showered together. In fact, there were three shower heads per location so we had to cluster together. Very cozy. Have showered in many open shower rooms in gyms as well. I've even been propositioned by men while naked/dressing, etc. I'm straight and comfortable with that, and with gay men, clothed or not. Since I don't see the issue I guess I don't see the issue.

Even though I'm in ok shape, showering with women would make me far more self conscious.

[kwenu]

83. I've showered with Black people, Jews, Latinos, White people, Asians, Indians,

a Redheaded dude, fat people, tall people, skinny people, dudes who undoubtedly were on steroids and dudes who, if they weren't gay, certainly had the rest of us convinced. No one was harmed in the aforementioned showerings.

Which brings me back to my last post...What is the point of this thread?