UH OH: Obama team debating UN convention on torture

[EraOfResponsibility]

http://crooksandliars.com/susie-madrak/ap-obama-team-debating-violating-un-c

Via Talk Left, this disconcerting news:

President-elect Barack Obama is preparing to prohibit the use of waterboarding and other harsh interrogation techniques by ordering the CIA to follow military rules for questioning prisoners, according to two U.S. officials familiar with drafts of the plans. Still under debate is whether to allow exceptions in extraordinary cases.
<...> Obama's changes may not be absolute. His advisers are considering adding a classified loophole to the rules that could allow the CIA to use some interrogation methods not specifically authorized by the Pentagon, the officials said. They said the intent is not to use that as an opening for possible use of waterboarding, an interrogation technique that simulates drowning.

As Glenn Greenwald points out, such a "loophole" would constitute a violation of the UN Convention on Torture, codified as a crime under US law.

(Nooooooooooooooooooooo!)

[rwheeler31]

1. This i s 24 crap.

[annabanana]

2. The "louder" we make this loophole, the less likely it will be

stuck in there...

[EraOfResponsibility]

3. What should we do?

[rug]

4. This is serious.

And yet, while I know all of this, I'm still disappointed. Because what we're doing here today - a debate over the fundamental human rights of the accused - should be bigger than politics. This is serious.

If this was a debate with obvious ideological differences - heartfelt convictions that couldn't be settled by compromise - I would understand. But it's not.

* * * *

Instead of allowing this President - or any President - to decide what does and does not constitute torture, we could have left the definition up to our own laws and to the Geneva Conventions, as we would have if we passed the bill that the Armed Services committee originally offered.


http://usliberals.about.com/od/extraordinaryspeeches/a/ObamaTorture.htm

[lostnotforgotten]

5. Yep - Obama Cheerleaders - We Told You So!

The new boss is the same as the old boss.

[EraOfResponsibility]

7. You've been rehearsing that, haven't you?

[lostnotforgotten]

8. I Am 52 Years Old - I Remember 8 Presidents Worth Of Broken Promises!

eom

[PM Martin]

9. Then it's time to fire up the grass/netroots movement again.

[EraOfResponsibility]

10. You must be SO tired of being right.

:eyes:

[lostnotforgotten]

11. I Am Tired Of Being Able To Predict Some Outcomes Based On Past History

It would be nice to be surprised for once.

[EraOfResponsibility]

20. I'm sure nothing would make you happier than for the rest of us

to become as jaded as you are. Well sorry to burst your bubble but I remain a "cheerleader" sorry if that bothers you, and I'm also sorry you've been dissapointed. But that's not my problem. It's your problem.

[lostnotforgotten]

21. I Am A Realist - That You Choose To Embrace Irrational Exuberance Is Your Problem Not Mine

eom

[salguine]

17. If he's right, he's right.

[HughMoran]

18. Added

.

[mmonk]

6. We shall see.

As we look "forward", we all have to follow our conscience. As I and other patriots look back, we will have decisions to make depending on these decisions.

[EraOfResponsibility]

12. sigh, cmon, isn't anybody REASONABLE going to come into this thread and talk me down?

I'm sick of the doom and gloom brigade in here.

[pot luck]

13. I'm waiting for another news source other than the AP to confirm this.

I'm not saying it's not true, but I don't trust the AP since they've been caught fabricating stories in the past.

[EraOfResponsibility]

15. good point AP isn't exactly reliable n/t

[mmonk]

14. Our elected officials could make it easier on us.

It would be quite easy just to declare the Constitution as written and the Bill of Rights stand as do the treatries we are bound to by law. Quite easy, really.

[Thrill]

16. "according to two U.S. officials familiar with drafts of the plans" Sounds like bullshit to me

[nodramamama]

19. I agree. Obama has shown openness to criticism and is unpredictable

Let's not forget that he announced the closing of Gitmo when no one was expecting it. This came as a response from human rights group.

That's a good quality in a President, and I am not too pessimistic. I think he might give these criminals what they deserve..

[jaxx]

22. Probably just another pub rumor after Mukasey yesterday.

The pubs are scared of being called to hearings so they'll use all they can make up to get the heat off them.

[TheWraith]

23. This is blogger speculation and bullshit being attributed to the AP.

Yet another case where somebody's making shit up about Obama, rebranding it as fact, and propagating it. In this case, TalkLeft started with an AP article about the rule changes and then starts speculating and making random assumptions in order to create this "scenario."