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Obama picks his Economic team, and the Dow bounds up by 300 points!

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Bicoastal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 01:07 PM
Original message
Obama picks his Economic team, and the Dow bounds up by 300 points!
Suck it, FAUX News!
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Mz Pip Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 01:08 PM
Response to Original message
1. The end of
the Obama Recession is in sight!!!! Take that Rush!
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Thrill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 01:09 PM
Response to Original message
2. Rush just responded
Rush Limbaugh: "He's making these radical proposals, all of this crazy, unaccounted-for spending, but he is doing it with an air of confidence and assuredness...."

http://thepage.time.com/
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anonymous171 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 01:14 PM
Response to Original message
3. Wall Street wants consistency.
Bush's erratic nonsense just wasn't doing it for them.
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Runcible Spoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 01:14 PM
Response to Original message
4. yeah Larry Summers, champion of fair trade and women's rights..
oh wait...
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Bicoastal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 01:18 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. You know, as long as he helps the economy rebound, I could care less...
...I've been out of work for 6 months now, and I want brighter days more than anything.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 01:18 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Breaking News--->Expertise "trumps" ideology on Obama's team.
What part of this sentence do you not understand,
Mr. Almighty-Financial-Wizard-who-knows-who-to-appoint-and-exactly-what-to-do-NOT?
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rockymountaindem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 01:45 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. I don't see that as an excuse for anything
Expertise means that a leader will be able to accomplish whatever their agenda is. Ideology guides the formation of the agenda. Suggesting that we should be fine with a man like Summers, who has shown questionable judgment, just because he has plenty of experience and know-how is not going to sit well with everybody. What good is all his experience if he chooses to lead us in a direction that we don't want to go (like the financial de-regulation he pushed in the 1990's that ended the Glass-Steagall provisions)?

People like Dick Cheney and Donald Rumsfeld had plenty of expertise. They were effective at executing their agenda. The reason that was so bad is because their ideology caused them to follow destructive agendas. Considering, we've got every right to question whether the key tenets that some of these appointments hold.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. I'm yawning......
Truly I am.

For you to equate Dick Cheney and Donal Rumsfeld
who were the architect of what was sold to the American people for the past 8 years,
Considering that Bush was a dumbass know nothing unelected President,
versus President Elect Obama who appears to be truly in charge,
and has already demonstrated more mettle than Bush every dreamed of having,
is not only ridiculous, but it is disingenious, and reeks of someone ready to find fault
as a pastime of fulfillment prior to anything having been proposed.....
and shows that the ideology of those who will be carry out our New President's agenda
trumps everything with you.....and leaves you with nothing good to say,
and plenty to criticize......even as a large stimulus package is being discussed,
something that George Bush never wanted.....and that Obama has been proposing for sometime.

As someone who can barely afford my mortgage presently,
and who has lost 40% of my income in the last 3 months,
I can tell you now, that your critique isn't gonna help me one bit,
and the solutions that I am awaiting will not be forthcoming based on anything you have to say.

But go ahead and tear folks up cause you can, with your brave bad and so informed self..... :eyes:
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rockymountaindem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. I saw this reply coming from a mile away
I am not directly comparing Rumsfeld to anybody in the coming administration to suggest that they are the same people. Let me put this another way:

Surely you can see that there are capable people who have bad ideas. History is replete with them. No, Summers is not Napoleon or Julius Caesar. However, to discount ideology as a grounds for criticism is a big mistake. How many times have we on this board criticized the rampant "free trade" dogma of people like Thomas Friedman? How many times have we extolled the views of Paul Krugman? Both of those men are knowledgeable and worldly. They are good writers who effectively advocate for their views. The difference between them is that Friedman is a big time free trader who in his book "The World is Flat" essentially argued that the so-called race to the bottom is actually a positive feature of the modern system of free trade. Krugman argues against this and stands up for the American worker who doesn't think he or she should have to compete on a "flat earth", as Friedman puts it, with workers in Vietnam making 17 cents an hour.

So, let's say Obama was going to appoint one of those two men to his cabinet. One could say of Friedman that he really knows his stuff, as he certainly does. He knows the major players and has formulated a sold opinion of his own on how the international economic system should work. Friedman is no idiot. The problem with him is that the main beneficiaries of his policy are big multinational corporations and financial gurus who shovel around millions of dollars as if they were playing cards. It's not that he's not good at what he does, it is just that his ideology that wholly unrestricted free trade and capital mobility is good for this country is not what I agree with.

I doubt anything I can say will make you question any of Obama's moves, but calling me an idiot for using my head and asking of some (not all) of these appointments are the best choice is not the point. Intentionally misreading what I said and putting me down for thinking that I know one or two things about what's going on isn't going to help you either. Here's what I wish you should think about... Yes, the 90's were great times in and of themselves. However, it seems that the prosperity of that period caused some leaders, such as Summers and Rubin, to act as if good times were here to stay - permanently - and that wise leadership would always prevail. Thus, they persuaded the Clinton administration to dismantle a lot of regulations in the financial system which dated to the Great Depression and which people had long pointed to as being one of the enduring legacies of the Roosevelt administration. Removing these regulations allowed financial companies of all stripes to become involved in all kinds of financial business with little or no oversight. Previously, the financial system was compartmentalized into component sectors. Commercial banks could not do investment banking, insurance firms could not sell mortgages, etc. Removing those regulations and not providing for robust oversight allowed the financial industry to work itself into a scenario of mutual interdependence. Now, all of these chain-ganged firms are taking each other down and spreading panic throughout our economy, generating and perpetuating the current crisis.

Summers was one of the biggest players in the 90's who pushed for financial deregulation. The thinking was that we could deregulate and maximize the prosperity of the 90's. But, as usual, the policymakers did not see the long-term consequences of their actions. They did not have the foresight of the Roosevelt administration which recognized that regulations are to prevent wholesale damage during times of excessive greed and bad leadership (the current decade, for instance). Thus, although removing the regulations did not hurt us during times of prosperity and good leadership (the Clinton administration), their absence is really hurting us now. So you have to ask yourself, "are the people who laid the groundwork for this mess the same people I want to clean it up?" Well, are they? Of course Obama had nothing to do with the 90's, and he will bring a fresh perspective. It is possible that he wants people like Summers around to help him enact his own agenda. On the other hand, I think we are right to wonder how much influence people like Summers will have on shaping the views of their boss.

So yes, having experience obviously counts for a lot with Obama and his transition team. But I don't think we are remiss to consider just what kind of experience and viewpoints these appointments are bringing to the table, and it doesn't make us idiots for wondering.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. While you are at it, please blame Clinton for 9/11.......
My point?

You can make your assessments in a vaccuum if you so choose,
But I'm gonna be more positive than that, because big picture is what I'm looking at.

Please know that I'm not calling you an idiot, cause that's not something that helps either one of us or anyone else reading these posts....for that matter.

What I will say is that Obama nominated 5 people today,
yet you seem to fixate on one.
In addition, Summer is not the Secretary of the Treasury,
but he was obviously smart enough, to act as President of Harvard for 8 years,
no small feat....so I consider him a smart guy.

I have met him, as he was still President during my daughter's first year at Harvard,
and he spoke to us, new parents, and my husband and I spoke to him after his talk.
I will be the first to certainly say that Summer is not perfect in everyway, as none of us are....

But perhaps in choosing to believe that Summers has learned quite a bit from his past experiences,
I will give him the benefit of the doubt as it appears that our President Elect has.....

that is preferable to judging him as static on his learning curve,
which appears you are obviously more than willing to do.
Perhaps Summer will learn much more working with the 3 women named as well today;
all considered as progressives by quite a few.

So my question is have you discussed the other 4 people who are part of this economic team, or does one bad apple spoil all things?
....and is your intent to focus like a laser beam on 1/5 of the economic team, not counting our President Elect, Barack Obama?

Personally,
I'm seeing a decent mix in ideology, backgrounds, and outlook in this team thus far formed,
and in the end, I recognized, as you should, that it is Barack Obama who will make the ultimate decisions.

As an accountant who is seeing first hand Mom and Pop small businesses suffering at this time,
I'm feeling quite comfortable in Prez Elect Obama's choices on this
....and I freely choose to look at the 18 day old glass as filling up rather nicely,
as opposed to looking for shit to bitch about. But that's just me. And of course, you are you
.....and you should go ahead and bitch on, since that appears to be the way that you believe big problems will be solved.



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Oregone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 01:45 PM
Response to Original message
8. But the USD dropped
The market activity is more likely due to an inflationary market cash injection (like a bailout).
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Frustratedlady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 01:49 PM
Response to Original message
9. It was at 309+/- when he started his speech.
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Frustratedlady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 01:49 PM
Response to Original message
10. Delete - Duplicate
Edited on Mon Nov-24-08 01:49 PM by Frustratedlady
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LittleClarkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 02:45 PM
Response to Original message
14. Make you proud, doesn't it.
Over the weekend a friend of mine blamed the downturn of the last few weeks on Obama being elected. She said the stock market was on an upswing, then he got elected and voiced his liberal leaning economic plans and that's when the market swung down again.

Nevermind that the market turned up when Obama announced his pick for the Treasury, and again today after his team announcement.

She said she was sorry but she was going to have trouble with Obama. Yeah, right. It's all his fault and he hasn't even taken office yet.
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-24-08 03:36 PM
Response to Original message
15. Show 'em your "O" face!!
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