I don't understand why women aren't upset at the paternal, patronizing treatment of Palin by McCain.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

How dare he put her in a box and refuse to let her out! How dare they limit her appearances and pressers! Why are they so insulting to their own female running mate? What does it say about McCain and his entire campaign?

He picked someone he thought was "hot" looking and they dressed her up like a remake of "Pretty Woman" and then they won't let her discuss anything of any weight and have kept her off all the shows that matter to most people. THEY have labeled her as an intellectual lightweight whose only value is as eye candy and a talking points robot.

Why aren't all women, and Sarah herself in particular, calling McCain on his biased treatent of his own running mate? Would they have "handled" a male counterpart the same way? Hardly!

[tekisui]

1. The ones that support them, are very familiar with that treatment.

It reminds them of their fathers and their husbands and their churches that tell them "the woman is subservient to the man". The man is the "head of the household". Their idea of a strong woman is one who knows her "role".

[ShortnFiery]

2. Because Palin is much more identifiable as "a grifter" than "a woman."

IMNSHO Palin would throw her entire family under the proverbial bus if it could glean her more power and influence.

Being a woman is nothing more than "an aside" or something that can be used (attractiveness and sexuality) to push to the head of the GOP pecking order.

[leftofcool]

3. The real question is why does this matter and why do we care

about what Mccain does or does not do?

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

5. It's a different way to look at the whole "Palin issue".

I think McCain's treatment of her is a disgrace, both to her and to all women by extrapolation. It also says something very telling about both McCain and Palin. He is willing to oppress and she is willing to be oppressed.

If Hillary Clinton had been selected as VP, would she have acquiesced if Obama gave her the same marching orders? Do you think Obama would have given the same marching orders in the first place? Of course not.

The whole way the McCain campaign has treated Palin is bizarre. If they didn't think she was up to it, they shouldn't have picked her in the first place. I think somehow McCain has successfully gotten away with HIS weird and questionable treatment of his own candidate by somehow trying to blame it on the media and deflecting questions about his own campaign's behavior and choices.

[supernova]

4. Because it's all about shoring up McSame's ego

It was never about finding a viable running mate, even a woman running mate. If he truely wanted a woman running mate, there are several conservative to moderate women whom he could have chosen, but he did not.

Kay Baily Hutchenson (I hate her, but she has a following in their party)

Olympia Snow

Christy Todd Whitman


But see, it was all about propping up dear old Dad's ego. What better way than with a pretty young (relatively speaking) thing?

[remember2000forever]

8. What a quick and bad decision Palin was. McCain picked her right after Obama didn't pick Hillary.

McCain would never have picked a woman running mate who would have to be stacked against Hillary. Instead, IMO, this was a rushed decision and not well thought out.

[saltpoint]

6. Palin is a prop and not a candidate.

In one take, she's a "novelty pick," chosen by McCain to flash his "maverick" credentials.

In another, a cabal of far-right fundie nutbags chose Palin FOR McCain, threatening to withhold support if he chose a pro-choicer like Ridge or Lieberman.

Either way, Palin is not a candidate so much as a prop.

She isn't uh, astute enough to be a candidate. She appears to be dumber than a bag of deep-sea sinkers and has a mean streak a mile long.

[Native]

7. You just don't understand . . . she's his soul mate, remember?

[Vinca]

9. Because in Repubworld, even a strong woman like Palin

must be subservient. Dim as she is, I hopes she shakes them up a bit in the next couple of years.

[No Elephants]

10. Do you get upset because someone screws the prostitute who

was absolutely thrilled to get the trick? (Before anyone starts yelling sexist, check your own self. My post is genderless.) Besides, I don't think McCain put her in a box bc she has a vagina. He put her in a box because she has a big mouth and a small brain. There are plenty of sexist things McCain has said--about Hillary, Reno, Chelsea and his own wife that I am very outraged about, though.

[Window]

27. There you go.

[Alcibiades]

11. And remember, this was a bid for Hillary's supporters!

All the Clinton folks should be deeply insulted by this, and many have expressed their displeasure.

[PA Democrat]

12. It seems that McCain has always placed looks over substance when women are concerned.

He also keeps a tight rein on Cindy and his own mother when it comes to speaking to the media, so his attitude toward Palin shouldn't be a surprise.

IMHO, McCain's discomfort in answering questions about birth control and other women's issues speaks volumes about his attitude in general toward women.

[NC_Nurse]

13. Her fans are fundie women - they believe the man is the boss. Period.

[hamsterjill]

32. Exactly

And rather than to only expect McCain to treat her like an "equal", shouldn't we also expect Palin to act like an equal rather than a submissive female?

When I see interviews with her sitting next to Grampy and she is constantly tapping his thigh, somehow I don't see this woman as the feminist she says she is.

[Jennicut]

14. McLame treats women like objects.

No fan of Sarah but that is how he looks at women. He was a a major womanizer when younger and we all know about his first wife Carol and how she was treated.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

15. Because liberal women are appalled at Palin herself

Her anti-feminist ways, her utter lack of knowledge over basics, and her grating, annoying "folksy" manner.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

22. But liberal women could USE McCains treatment of her as a club on him and his campaign. nt.

[lunatica]

24. Would you say the same if she were a felon?

It would be very stupid of liberal women to defend her when she's the next Phyllis Schlafly.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

25. I'm NOT trying to defend her. McCain's treatment of her speaks to his own sexism.

And is an excellent point to make. He is repressing and oppressing his own running mate. How weird is that?

I have no idea what being a felon has to do with any point I ma trying to make.

[lunatica]

29. Because defending someone just on the basis of being a woman

Is like defending a felon on the same basis. If Sarah Palin were a felon instead of the anti-feminist she is would you be appalled at the treatment McCain is giving her? You want to argue that we have to defend her because she's a woman, no matter how much she hurts our cause.

That would make us look stupid. And actually we would be stupid to defend her when she doesn't lift a finger to defend us. She actually works against us.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

31. Defending Palin herself is not my goal

An analogy:

If I saw someone kicking a dog, even a dog I did not like, I would still protest because the behavior is just wrong towards ALL animals - it doesn't matter how I feel about that particular animal.

If women put up with the denigration that McCain is displaying towards Palin, they are accepting McCain's behavior on the basis that they don't like Palin herself, so that makes it ok. I disagree.

(I still think your felon comparison is off the mark, but that's ok. If I thought someone was abusing felons, I probably would take exception to that as well.)

[lunatica]

35. Let me put it another way

Do you think we should scream 'sexism' because people are saying nasty things about Ashley Todd? You want to stand up for women's causes which I also want to do, but I'll stand up against women who work against those causes as much as I'll stand up to any man. Having ovaries doesn't automatically make a woman a banner for feminism because some old man who still lives in the pre-civil rights mentality puts her in a box.

Now if her were to do that to someone like Hillary, I would definitely be up in arms.

And you're analogy of kicking the dog isn't apt here either. If McCain were to hit Palin I would be up in arms and in his face in a hot second. Even if she were a felon.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

36. I never call sexism unless I see it in a very clear, well defined circumstance

such as the way the McCain campaign is treating their female VP candidate in manners that I am confident would not be repeated if his running mate were another male governor such as Ridge or Pawlenty or anyone else one could name

(Your Ashley Todd comment is from left field and has no bearing on anything I've said - quite a stretch and for nothing.)

My whole OP is about John McCain's paternalistic, patronizing, belittling, denigrating, insulting treatment of his running mate who happens to be female. I guess one could easily consider that sexism.

I could care less about Sarah Palin herself, but she is allowing the cause of women in politics to be set back years by his behavior and her tacit acceptance of it. She's just the little lady who knows her place. Palin is the Poster girl for Submissive Women. Do you understand now why I think this should be more of an issue than it is?

All women (and everyone for that matter) should be angry about McCains actions and Palin's acquiescence.

I think that while we're both on the same side, we have a communications impasse. Too bad about that, but I can't think of another thing to say to get you to see the point I am trying to make. We'll just each have to trudge forward on separate paths in the same direction.

Cheers!

[mscuedawg]

16. IMO....the only reason women should be upset about Sarah Palin....is thinking we'd fall for the

"token va ja ja"....

[sampsonblk]

17. She is not a sympathetic figure

She is hammering Obama at every turn. Who can have sympathy for a woman who behaves the way she has? She is playing the pit bull here.

In addition, the folks who attend her rallies treat her the same. The is a novelty. Something to marvel at. That right there is about as sexist as it gets. Liz Hasselbeck introduced her the other day, and half her intro was about Palin's appearance and how nice she looks in those clothes. And the crowd went wild.

So she gets what she gets. No sympathy from me.

[saltpoint]

18. If Sarah Palin is not a lightweight, why won't she hold a press conference?

She is vacuously stupid and religiously unstable.

She intimidates public librarians and she shoots wolves from helicopters.

I'm not getting the dignity-of-women thing in her candidacy at all.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

19. I think my point is being missed. This is something McCain himself needs to be called on

By anyone, male or female. It is a reflection of HIM and his campaign. Paternal. Patronizing. Insulting. (This is not my call for people to support Palin. If she were a strong, capable woman, she would have done that on her own behalf already).

Insulting to Palin, insulting to all voters to imply that his female running mate needs to be "protected" both from the big bad media AND from her own fluffy little head (my impression of his impression of her head), because who knows what will come out of her mouth.

McCain somewhat successfully turned the Palin quarantine into a commentary on the MEDIA, not a commentary to his own biases.

[saltpoint]

21. McCain's from an antiquated time and really could not follow your

argument. He treats his own wife contemptibly in public. There are likely 6th graders who treat females better than John McCain does.

The people who like Palin generally aren't feminists. IMO feminists and pro-feminist males are not going to be drawn to McCain no matter who his running mate is.

Feminists would fare far better under Obama/Biden than under McCain/Palin, so McCain's public treatment of Palin and other females is secondary to the demographic that supports them in the first place.

[lunatica]

20. Just because she has ovaries is no reason to make her some symbol for women's issues

And genitalia is no reason to demand some sort of special treatment. Men have been traditionally doing that crap forever, but you want women to get special treatment on that basis? What ever happened to being held accountable in equal measure as men too?

Maybe because she's so stupid that she actually thinks she deserves to be treated like the Diva she thinks she is.

Sorry, I have no sympathy for a woman who doesn't give a rats ass about women's issues. I will not defend anyone of any sex if they are fundamentally flawed as she is in her thinking. Just on women's issues, she's against scientific research that benefits the autistic children she professes to care about. She makes women pay for their own rape kits. She's so 'pro-life' that a 13 year old raped by her own father must have the baby.

I just wish someone would stuff her in a box forever so she couldn't do any more damage to womens' causes.

[lunatica]

23. Palin uses feminine issues (her vote against them) to curry favor with the men in power

She uses her sex and her motherhood to destroy feminine issues. She promotes the men's views, especially the most oppressive ones.

The perfect example is when she dissed fruit fly research. She waves her kid around like it makes HER special and an expert of autism, which is something commonly done by narcissists, by the way, in her speech about how to help autistic children and in the same breath she criticizes one of the scientific research areas that has brought more understanding of autism.

Feminists don't do that. Period. But anti-feminists do.

[seabeyond]

30. "i am a feminist". she wanted to use it to get our "hillary" vote. now asked, she is not feminist

the most offensive part of her was declaring she was a feminist when all about her absolutely was opposite of a feminist. and using it in the beginning. now that she has turned women off she has to stay away from the word cause the repug male are scared shitless of the word feminist and have attacked it for three decades. their greatest insult to a woman is to call her a feminist.... and liberal.

she is now huntin joe the six pack and feminist doesnt fly

[always_saturday]

26. You answered the question yourself.

"He picked someone he thought was "hot" looking and they dressed her up like a remake of "Pretty Woman" and then they won't let her discuss anything of any weight and have kept her off all the shows that matter to most people. THEY have labeled her as an intellectual lightweight whose only value is as eye candy and a talking points robot."

She trades on her looks (which I don't think are all that) and her femininity and motherhood. That's why I don't give a rip how they treat her - and I'm a woman and a feminist.

She is completely unqualified, not to mention vile and vicious and anti-woman herself.

[youthere]

28. She knew when she got the nod that she would be there only to dress up the stage.

[pipi_k]

33. Patronizing and misogynistic, yes, but...

there are women out there who love that sort of thing.

And if we tried to take away their safety nets...because that's what it is...they would probably fight tooth and nail to have them back.

I have a sister (early 50s) who is the same way.

Never had a driver's license. Never had a job outside the home. Married a guy old enough to be her father.


Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what HER issues are...


She's looking for a Daddy, and I believe most of the women who like the McCain/Palin dynamics are also. And it's going to take more than just a little talking to them to straighten them out. Years of therapy, likely, and some of them would be highly resistant.

Sometimes there's just nothing anyone can do to change things...

:(

[mtnsnake]

34. All the smart women I talk to ARE upset over it. n/t