Joe Biden just said McCain is a "good man" and a "genuine war hero"

[Wetzelbill]

Now regardless how any of you feel about that, I want to note something.

He's in Lancaster, Ohio, at a rally, and when he said something nice about John McCain, people were quiet and respectful. Nobody booed or became angry when he said that.

Barack Obama's supporters don't hate John McCain. They aren't trained to revile him down to his soul until he becomes unamerican or inhumane. We aren't exploited and programmed to think like that. The Obama campaign doesn't cater to the lowest common denominator.

We don't like McCain in many ways, and many of us think his proposed ideas are stupid and tragic. I hate McCain's voting record, his policies, ideas, philosophy and politics. Virtually all of us do.

Sure, I don't have any respect for him either. Not anymore. I think he's supported some evil policies and definitely lost his soul somewhere along the way.

But I can see that his kids love him. That maybe he's done some good things in his life. That he has some type of redeeming qualities. And even if I didn't, I don't wish the man harm. Nor do I dehumanize him in my mind. Not the way Republicans do with Obama. A significant group of Republicans feel that way, people working for and representing McCain do those things.

We don't.

And that's a big difference.

We keep our humanity. We do not succumb to hate and fear.

I'm sure we never will.

[Hope And Change]

1. Nominated.K & R!

[BklynChick]

2. yes! great post.

[jhrobbins]

72. Yes, thank you for talking me down (nod to Rachel) cuz I was beginning to

feel twinges of hate and you brought me back to why I am a Democrat in the first place. I don't want to be like the Republicans/conservatives. I am a devout Christian and I believe that we are supposed to love our neighbor as ourselves-even though it is difficult at times.

[crankychatter]

3. I always pop open your threads for a smile

now I feel all googly and proud

ya sneak

[Wetzelbill]

28. Thank you very much

I appreciate that. :)

[ClusterFreak]

4. Very well said. n/t

:thumbsup:

[gateley]

5. Excellent observation --

and I've seen rallies (both Obama's and Biden's) where when they pay tribute to mcCain's service, the audience applauds in respect.. What a difference.

We love our candidate -- yet all they can do is hate ours.

[Alter Ego]

6. We have met the enemy...and he is not us.

[political_Dem]

7. There's something to be said about demeanor and silence.

It says a lot in how both camps deal with dissent from their own adherents.

[terrya]

8. You're absolutely right. Excellent post. Recommended.

Thank you for posting this.

[Thrill]

9. Why call him a good man. when the most praise McCain can give Obama is decent man

Fuck the compliments

[stillcool]

26. I think the Campaign has always been proactive..

rather than reactive. Being respectful is surely killing them with kindness.

[Wetzelbill]

29. respectful but tough

Plus Obama still has so many big guns to pull out and he's got a good lead, he still has all his weapons if he needs them. McCain has blown it all already. He's tried the Ayers stuff a few times, never worked. Last summer when the Wright stuff was a bigger issue it never hurt Obama nationally at all. McCain doesn't have much going for him.

[RichardRay]

10. Bravo. I opened this post thinking I was going to have to

make a point about respect and becoming what we don't want and magnanimity and not abusing dead horses. Then I read what you'd written and realized I didn't need to.

Thanks.

[AndyA]

11. Proof that you just can't buy respect and class.

Republicans have neither.

[nomaco-10]

12. recc'd very nice post. n/t

[VoodooGuru]

13. Boooo! Hisssss! (A joke, and a more serious observation, contained within.)

Just kidding. Well said, and well done by Joe. Take the high road all the way to the White House.

This is one of the ironies of a very negative campaign: no matter HOW HARD one side tries to take the high road, simply having to answer negative ads creates the perception of an overall negative campaign. I hear so-called undecided voters saying "I wish they would just take the high road" or "I wish we could just get through one election without mudslinging" as if both sides were equally culpable.

Now I won't pretend that Obama's never run negative ads against McCain. But there really is no comparison between the tones of each campaign, with McCain being far more negative, often in silly ways. (Ayers being a prime example of the non-issue negative attack.)

Kind of an interesting effect, there. One campaign goes exceedingly negative and manages to create the perception of overall negativity. If I'm not mistaken it has happened on more than one occasion, too.

[OneGrassRoot]

14. K&R. Thank you. I was just saying to my daughter....

that it's pitiful that some of us are actually afraid to put out signs for Obama in a sea of McCain signs, but those who support McCain in Obama territory never talk about being afraid to express their views.

On the other hand, many of us in red territory have been threatened and verbally assaulted, signs stolen repeatedly, etc.

Lovely Christian, patriotic types they are. :sarcasm:

Fed by the hatred of right-wing radio for the last 15 years, now whipped into a racist frenzy by McPalin.

[StopTheNeoCons]

15. Big thumbs up

[On the Road]

16. Seems Like Not That Long Ago,

lots of people couldn't stop complaining about the respectful treatment of McCain, and wanted to attack, attack, attack.

The campaigns went in different directions. Obama knew best.

[msallied]

18. I agree.

If Obama had inserted even a FRACTION of the anger that some of Obama's supporters wanted him to, Obama would likely not be winning right now. Anger doesn't win hearts, and Obama has won ours.

[On the Road]

19. I Thought Jerry Brown Had a Real Shot at the Nomination in 92

after winning the Connecticut primary. All he had to do was act presidential.

The campaign went to New York and he turned into a vicous attack dog screaming (of all things) about a flat tax. Clinton breezed.

[flygal]

54. so true, I wanted him to get midevil on his ass last night

but he came across so much more presidential being calm and not being flustered like McCain did. mcCain just looked like he needed a nap.

[msallied]

17. You would never hear me shout "Kill Him!!" at a rally either...

And I said awhile back that I think it would be incredibly tragic if he does, in fact, have Alzheimer's.

I see McCain ultimately as the Anakin Skywalker type. Probably a fundamentally good person (if heavily flawed), but corrupted by the business to the point of no return.

[Disturbed]

20. McLame is now a pathetic figure who threw away his honor.

I don't hate him. I feel a bit of sadness that his obsession to be Pres. gave way to his weakness to
lower himself the way that he has. He is unfit to be the Pres. of the USA.

[rvablue]

21. K&R

[polmaven]

22. We also don't need to

be reviling Democrats who say good things ABOUT him. The meme that says you either tear down our opponent or you are our enemy is not helpful nor democratic.

[Wetzelbill]

27. right I think so too

[SeaLyons]

23. K&R

[Heather MC]

24. Biden, Obama Audience's have always been respectful

I remember when Obama came to Bristol VA just after winning the DEM NOM
and when he praised Hillary, the crowd roared with applauses and cheers

[Wetzelbill]

25. yes, thanks for bringing that up again

[sampsonblk]

30. Kick & Rec

[H2O Man]

31. Thank you.

Really well said.

Nominated.

[Wetzelbill]

33. you're welcome

I appreciate it.

[jhain]

32. Mike Huckabee Jokes About Someone Shooting at Barack Obama

http://thesop.org/index.php?article=11221

Mike Huckabee Jokes About Someone Shooting at Barack Obama

May 17th, 2008 05:22 EST

Robert Paul Reyes
"Republican
Mike Huckabee responded to a sharp offstage sound during his speech to the National Rifle Assn. by suggesting that it was Barack Obama diving to the floor because someone had aimed a gun at him.

Hearing a loud noise, Huckabee interrupted his speech to say: "That was Barack Obama. He just tripped off a chair. He's getting ready to speak and somebody aimed a gun at him and he -- he dove for the floor."

*plenty more here:
http://thesop.org/index.php?article=11221

[ecstatic]

34. If I were at the rally, I'd be respectful too... but since I'm not

From what I have heard about his violence and contempt for human beings, I can't agree with that statement at all.

[Wetzelbill]

36. I can't say I agree totally myself

But I wouldn't wish him dead or yell it out or boo Biden or Obama for praising him either.

His temper, his flip-flop on torture, his almost insane thirst for war, his awful joke about Janet Reno and Chelsea Clinton, his indefensible voting record on veteran's issues, his lie about the cross in the sand story, I have definite reservations about the guy as a person.

[galaxy21]

35. 'John Mccain -and this is a man I would take a bullet for- is mentally unstable and bad at his job!

And, again this is a man I love- but he's crazy!'

[Wetzelbill]

37. that's hilarious

I like how it cracked Biden up too lol.

[Eric Condon]

38. When I saw Biden in Jeffersonville, IN a few weeks ago...

...he mentioned McCain's name several times in the speech and the crowd didn't react at all. Then, at the first mention of Palin's name, the crowd ERUPTED in boos. As well it should have.

But the OP's point is correct. Even though the place was uniformly expressing disdain for Palin, no one was trying to incite violence.

It probably has something to do with Democrats not being knuckle-dragging simpletons who only understand brutality. Unlike some people we know.

[Wetzelbill]

40. it's traditional to boo at a name

But when a candidate is praising their opponent, that's a different thing. And definitely, as you point out, nobody incited violence.

[dkofos]

39. Too bad the rabid RW will not see or hear him say that, or read your words.

[Wetzelbill]

41. well you can't change that

They are who they are. And it looks like the Independents aren't falling for the McCain camps craziness. We can just keep trying our best and fighting for what we believe in.

[BrklynLiberal]

42. Wonderful post. Thank you..

:thumbsup:
:dem: Proud to be A Democrat...

[ikojo]

43. I don't like John McCain, never did and never will

I've never understood the manufactured love for this one man. It's not like he has done anything extraordinary. I mean there were other men who were held POW with him, why is he singled out as a hero? He was a crappy pilot.

I wish the Dems would quit saying how nice McCain is because it simply is not true.

[crazylpn]

62. Agreed, ikojo!

This is a great post. It shows that Obama/Biden have total class! But I don't have anything good to say about McPrick. :shrug:
He is just too mean and evil...

[Tigress DEM]

44. Well, you are better than me. "I said, 'Stand up and die,' hoping he might - of natural causes tho."

I mean he IS old and in bad health. IF he were to die on his own, it wouldn't bother me much.

[Enrique]

45. meanwhile, McCain's supporters boo him for saying he respects Obama

:crazy:

[Eagle_Eye]

46. When you are winning, it pays to be gracious. n/t

[lamp_shade]

47. Bravo!! and kick

[Thrill]

48. Will he continue to compliment McCain. After McCain ate his lunch last night

He got away with some big shots at Biden

[rosesaylavee]

49. Well said.

K & R

[shadowknows69]

50. K+R

[MessiahRp]

51. Another observation about what you hear at Democratic Rallies vs. GOP Rallies

Most of the things I have heard at Democratic Rallies in the past 4+ years were directed at Bush for his actions.

They're painting Obama as a terrorist because of his skin color and his name.

Those of us who have angrily accused Bush of terrorism did so based on his actions, ie invading a sovereign country, killing innocent men, women and children for nothing more than either a personal vendetta or a corporate power grab.

We aren't saying Bush is a terrorist because he's white. Bush earned the disrespect he gets based on policy stances. Obama did not earn them just because he has a different skin color.

Rp

[redqueen]

52. We aren't encouraged to succumb to hate and fear.

I don't understand why Schieffer phrased the issue of negative ads as if both sides had aired equally noxious ads or said equally nasty things.

[Kajsa]

53. Wetzelbill, you have defined who we are

and what we stand for.

We are humanitarians and do not stoop to the level the Repubs have.

We have taken a lot of flak for being " the nice guys",
but imho, Barack Obama has demonstrated time and
again how advantageous this strategy is.

By no measure does this mean he doesn't fight back!
He does, and he does so armed with facts, not smears.

It is much harder to take the high road.
The "fears and smears" campaign garner a lot of attention
and sway the uninformed.

Educating the voters with the FACTS, well documented FACTS is the key
to fighting this.

Thanks so much for posting this well written OP.

It's a great reminder to all of us of where we stand.

:)

[GainesT1958]

55. You'll never hear the things...

Said at Palin's rallies at ours--against EITHER of their candidates.

And there's a good reason for that. We don't thrive on hate.

And that, "my friends", is the difference.

B-)

[grantcart]

56. no hate no fear yeah what about when DU crashes !! nothing but fear and loathing

[all.of.me]

57. Thanks. This is well-said,

full of compassion and understanding.

A few years ago, a girl in my daughter's class was run over by her drunk boyfriend in his car and killed. It was horrifying and tragic. My daughter said, 'She was in my English class. She sat behind me. She was a b****. I didn't like her.' Whoa! I put a stop to that right away and said pretty much what you said here. She had parents, siblings, aunts and uncles, friends and others who loved her. Maybe you didn't like her, but other people did. That quieted my daughter down, and she has been respectful ever since of people she does not like.

It is highly respectful and spiritual to see the good in everyone, no matter how far apart you may be on issues or how different your personalities and paths are. It is also a good idea to say at least three good things about someone before you criticize them. That alone will change your perspective on human relationships, diminishing negative feelings.

The McCain camp, and probably Republicans in general, says nothing positive about the opposition, ever, except for things like the fake and uninformed tribute to Ted Kennedy at the beginning of the last debate. Last night, McCain said Obama is eloquent, and I was shocked! But that was followed by a passive aggressive comment about 'looking into' off-shore drilling. I thought McCain had come around. I should have known better.

On DU, I see a lot of disrespect. Even calling McCain McGramps or McCranky is really disrespectful and full of hatred. It's also immature. If the entire party, or even the entire country, emulated the role models we have on the ticket this year, there would be less hatred and more respect for each other. If the whole world tried to find the good in everyone, we might even have a shot at world peace.

Get off the hate wagon.

[Lilicat]

63. I know you are right -

I had my own personal "WTF" moment last night when watching the debates...when McCain got all pouty and said, in effect, "Well, there's been stuff yelled about me at YOUR rallies that I didn't like." LIKE WHAT ?? Anyone call him a terrorist? Anyone yell "Kill him?" That stuff makes my blood run cold. The worst I ever heard at an Obama rally were boos and Obama stopped that stuff right away.

Barack Obama is a class act, and inspires me to be one too. So I need to stop calling McCain & Palin names. Calling him McShorty (he's very sensitive about his height - shortest Prez nominee since Jemmy Madison)really is immature...

AUGH!!! ALL RIGHT, SO I'M IMMATURE! But I still don't want anyone to KILL him.

[deaniac21]

58. I know I have never seen a hateful post about McCain on DU.

[Deep13]

59. I don't hate him.

As a person I rather like McC. It's just too bad he is so completely dead wrong.

And if I was giving a speech and heard "kill him" when mentioning the opponent, I think I would demand to know who said it and send the Secret Service to go talk to him.

[MagicKenny]

60. Yep - Big Difference Between Booing and Yelling Racial Slurs...

...and I'm all for passion at these rallies - my God, that's why they're fun to attend. However, booing is one thing, but threatening to kill a candidate, or calling him a terrorist, etc., is far beyond the pale (lin).

Another fundamental difference between the left and right. Great post.

[ZeitGuy]

61. Well, I like the way that you think....

...and it seems we share the same ideas of personal redemption. I invite you to read my post, below, and I'm kicking and recommending your own. Nicely done.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x7464353

[JBShakes]

64. Beautifully put.

GOD, I'm gonna be glad when this election's over and people's postings here and random re-runs of West Wing don't make me tear up...

[OwnedByFerrets]

65. Your post was just read on

Thom Hartmann. :headbang:

[gateley]

67. Wow! That's so cool -- and well deserved! nt

[Wetzelbill]

69. Woa that was awesome!

[OwnedByFerrets]

66. delete, duplicate post

Thom Hartmann. :headbang:

[Captain Hilts]

68. That's how you play to the middle and undecided. THAT's why Bubba keeps doing it.

We're supposed to be the Good Guys.

When we act like it, so many here don't 'get' it.

[Matariki]

70. Hey Wetzelbill - I heard Thom Hartmann read your post on the air this morning

congratulations.

[Wetzelbill]

74. thank you very much

I feel honored, as you would expect. :)

[dccrossman]

71. Kick

:kick:

[tomg]

73. Thanks. Great post. nt

[DUlover2909]

75. I'm afraid of McCain because he's a Muslim.

:P

[krkaufman]

76. Precisely. Any ill feelings I have towards McCain & Palin don't originate ...

... from ANYTHING the Obama campaign has said, but from what I've heard and seen come from the McCain campaign, itself. Obama's campaign has been too deferential to McCain and Palin, in my opinion, but I understand why Obama is running his campaign in this fashion -- because he cares about the state of the country and public opinion should he win in November, and doesn't wish to have alienated half of the population. McCain has chosen another path.

[GAtomboy]

77. Personally I'm sick of the McCain praise

You got one thing right that is for sure - "He lost his soul somewhere along the way". I'm not saying I want any harm to come to the man, but I'm growing tired of Obama and Biden praising McCain - "He's a good man, he's a hero, he's right, I respect him, he's a great man" ... Everything that comes out of McCain's mouth is rude, disrespectful and hateful towards Obama and Biden. I mean last night he said Biden had some "cockamamie" idea. McCain is a hot headed jerk-off plain and simple.

I am proud that Obama supporters have not slunk to the lowly depths of what Palin and McCain draw, but for crying out loud, quit singing McCain's praises already!!!

[ProudDad]

78. What's so special about a "war hero"?

What's so special about a "war hero"?

Doesn't the promotion of participation and glorification of the participants in one of the basest of human endeavors demean and diminish us all?

Isn't the glorification of someone who excels in the disgusting work of killing people in cold blood fundamentally sick?

Isn't it a terrible, disgusting and deadly message to be sending young people; be a good killer for the state and you'll be applauded?

Screw that!!!

I applaud the folks who went to Canada or went underground rather than kill for Lyndon Johnson and Tricky Dick Nixon!

I applaud the young Mr. Ayers who tried to change the course being forced by the USAmerikan war criminals...Nixon and Kissinger!

I applaud the hundred of thousands of us who refused, resigned, resisted and marched in the streets against that awful "war" and every disgusting, unnecessary, bloody war since then!

Piss on all Flags and to HELL with all war and those who wage them!

[Poseidan]

84. McCain... a war hero

He joined the Air Force because he thought nothing would happen, and he could use his military 'service' for political gain. Kind of like Bush, except he wanted to make it stick. The rest of his war story was accidental.

"He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would fully suffice. This disgrace to civilization should be done away with at once. Heroism at command, senseless brutality, and all the loathsome nonsense that goes by the name of patriotism, how violently I hate all this, how despicable and ignoble war is; I would rather be torn to shreds than be part of so base an action! It is my conviction that killing under the cloak of war is nothing but an act of murder." - Albert Einstein

[Bernardo de La Paz]

79. Polarization is a Republican / Rovian technique. . . . nt

[Joe Chi Minh]

80. .... but a raging maniac,,,, and a dear, dear friend...." Sorry for the

frivolity, now hackeyed as well....!

[Infinite Hope]

81. Excellent Post. n/t

[sagetea]

82. An Elder Native American once told me

that there is more honor in counting coup on your enemies, than to kill them.
We definitely have more honor.

[dothemath]

83. Hero?

When McCain was bombing civilians, no one was shooting back.
Soon after he was ordered to bomb infrastructure, he was shot
down.

What heroic act, or acts, did McCain perform?

The Navy didn't think so, either. Maybe Petraeus could lend
him some of
the stuff pinned to his uniform. Just the stuff on the back.
Petraeus is
more heavily weighed down than Patton was, but Patton earned
his.

I think this is another reason McCain won't release his
military record.
There is nothing to see regarding his 'heroism' during his
tenure in the
Navy.

Anybody have anything? 

[bjobotts]

85. You can be respectful without lying.McCain is not honorable.Nor a war hero...he was a POW

[bjobotts]

86. I refuse to drink that kool-aid and frankly wish Biden would stop praising McCain..He has no integ

integrity. Biden is referring to a make believe media driven image of McCain. His children love him???Hitler had a mistress that loved him too. Being phony to some while screwing others is not honorable...it's just fake...and that"s John McCain...fake.

[bjobotts]

87. He deserves no respect but we are mannerly, even to the Palin fake.

[savistocate]

88. Easiest when ahead..seem to be. Wouldn't choose honor though

over thrown under a bus flattened by tanks.

Sounds good, still.

Hearing described robocalls at this moment..."this call paid for by RNC and John McCain". after ''did you know Obama responsible for bombing the Pentagon, part of a terrorist group and responsible for numerous American deaths''!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
And earlier Obama spoke of McC.. .. served w/ honor and distinction. The same.

Bangin head against the wall. Maybe better not to know so much.

[Joe Chi Minh]

89. It's the position of strength. In every way. It's not a talk board, where

you're constantly fighting the lies of trolls and countering propaganda. It's a personal competition, part on policies and part on likeability.

On the score of likeability. Joe could not reasonably feel threatened by McCain;
On the score of policies, if anything, still less.

If you reefed the first person you saw off the street, the public would trust his policies more than Bush's policies. Or those of the maverick Mr 90%.

Joe may even feel a little sorry for the old geezer, God love him(!), you know. When you see an old guy from close up, racing from pillar to post, incessantly under the cosh, as presidential candidates are, I should think it would be difficult not to; difficult to feel hostile in those circumstances, particularly when you know that he'd have to be delusional to be doing it.

By keeping his humanity, Joe's preserving a state of mind that radiates happiness - a special charisma of his. If he felt rancour towards his old opponent, he'd still be an effective polemecist, no doubt, but he'd have needlessly brought a damper on a happy occasion.

Spiritual writers talk about preserving one's interior economy, meaning not allowing your emotions to disturb your peace of mind and heart in any deep way. That way, Joe even looks a winner. And he could be pug ugly, physically challenged in many ways, and he'd still look, not just THE winner, but A winner. McCain is also one of Biden's colleagues in the Senate (where they have to butter each other up all the time), in addition to moonlighting as Joe the Plumber's amanuensis. So, he has a busy schedule for an old guy.