Atheists for Obama! Religion in Politics - I would love to hear all your opinions........

[JohnMcCant2008]

According to different sources, there are varying positions on the exact number of atheists, agnostics and those unaffiliated with any religion in the US. Estimates range from 3% - 12% of the US population (approx. 10–35 million people). No point in listing sources – there are tons out there if you use “the Google” – and it is a moving target and probably WAY underestimated anyhow since MANY people are still unwilling to admit their disbelief and doubts publically for fear of alienation from family, friends or the community in general. Yes this is true – and yes I have personally experienced it. The point is that it is a large and meaningful portion of our population with many opinions and many votes.

Now onto the politics. I don’t expect in my lifetime to ever see an atheist president. This makes me sad, but not for the reason you may think. I am not personally offended, because beliefs (and disbeliefs) are a personal thing. The reason I am disheartened is because our Constitution VERY specifically outlines the role of religion in our government. NONE.

We are guaranteed our freedom of religion (and conversely our freedom FROM religion) by the Constitution, but our founding fathers were wise enough to know that it should never influence policy. You only have to take a look at the world around you to understand why.

Over the last 300 years we have fallen away from this original founding principle of our country. Our modern day politicians are not only influenced by religious beliefs, in many cases they are CONTROLLED by large groups with EXTREME beliefs. And don’t even get me started on Palin.

Do I ever expect our future President Obama, to acknowledge “atheists” as a very real group the way he might Catholics, Jews or any other organized religion? No, nor would I want him to at this stage in our history. In this day and age it would be be political suicide and we NEED him as President more than "I" need to be acknowledged. This country has swung SO far to the right, largely due to religious beliefs, that it will take many years and baby-steps to get back to a point where atheists are even accepted in general, much less politically.

THIS is what I do believe though:

I believe that Barack Obama already realizes or would agree with most of what I have already written.

I believe that Barack Obama forms his opinions on others based on their character, their morality and their intelligence – NOT on their beliefs.

I believe Barack Obama is a Christian whose life and family is enriched by his beliefs, who in return understands that I also live a very full and enriched life without those beliefs.

I believe Barack Obama would never USE religion to bring harm to an individual or a country.

Most importantly, I believe a progressive, freethinking President like Barack Obama will, at the very least, lay the groundwork for a nation of individuals who respect all beliefs (and disbeliefs) and will leave this country better than he found it for the sake of my children.

I believe in this country (again - and it's about time), I believe in Obama and I believe we are headed for a LANDSLIDE election!

Thanks for letting me clutter the forum with this, and I’d love to hear all other opinions on atheism or just the role religion pays in US politics in general.

(I am the Flying Spaghetti Monster, and I approve of this message)

[MarthaMyDear]

1. Well thought out post! :~)

I too am an atheist, and feel Senator Obama represents everyone's best interests. His deeply felt religious faith doesn't interfere with other's beliefs. I can hardly wait for him to be my President!

Thanks for posting!

[JohnMcCant2008]

3. It's been on my mind this election season - I hesitated to post for fear of offending

even the moderate Christians on this board. But you all seem to be an accepting bunch here!

[mscuedawg]

7. I didnt forget about you!!!

I work from home doing transcription for a hospital in Maine and cant get to my post yet...BUT I am working on it as we speak!!!!

Stay Tuned!!! ;)

[Claire Beth]

2. I call myself a "realist" but Xian's would

say I am an atheist. Obama is better for everyone all the way around. The thoughts of palin being a half-heartbeat away from the Presidency scares the hell out of me (and I don't believe in hell)!

[KathieG]

4. I am an atheist

and I am very comfortable with Obama. With his track record, and background in constitutional law, I am confident that he would never use religion to bring harm to the country (unlike the other ticket). He has a good head on his shoulders...I trust him.

[stopbush]

5. I think we had a pretty much atheist president in Jefferson.

The conventions of his time led him to assume the stance of a deist, but reading his letters etc, one doubts he believed strongly in the supernatural.

[JohnMcCant2008]

6. Our founding fathers were mostly a mixture of theists, deists and agnostics, but I don't think the

actual term 'agnostic' was used and I am certain that full-on atheism wasn't considered at the time.

Except by those pesky witches.

[RaleighNCDUer]

8. They probably would have readily adopted the term 'agnostic'

because one of the tenets of deism is that god is unknowable to the human intellect, and an agnostic is defined as someone who does not claim to know.

As for the 'witches' most of them were christian like everyone else, though there might have been a few pagans. 'Witch' and 'atheist' are diametrically opposed viewpoints. For the witch, nature is the starting point and moves on to super-natural - for the atheist, nature is the end point.

[JohnMcCant2008]

13. I truly didn't understand the basis of Wicca until your clear explanation - thank you!

[DavidDvorkin]

10. The word "agnostic" was coined in the 19th century by Huxley.

[BklynChick]

9. When Obama talks abt different religions,he often says, "Christians, Jews, Muslims, & Nonbelievers"

[JohnMcCant2008]

12. I hadn't heard him say that before - but I'm glad to know now that he has! n/t

[RaleighNCDUer]

21. I've heard it, and other variants such as

"people of all faiths and of no faith" as well.

16% of the population is a pretty sizeable chunk to ignore.

At least 16% is the number given by Maher in Religulous - and if people were honest with themselves it would probably be more. My father never called himself an atheist, but when I went to him at 8 years old saying I was arguing religion with a friend he offered up the old conumdrum "if god is all powerful, can he create a stone that he cannot lift?" (I was actually arguing FOR the existance of god - so that REALLY got me thinking). He was a church choir director, but only for the music. Never went to church unless dragged by my mother if not working with the choir. Sent us kids to sunday school, and didn't say a word about it when we quit going. I don't know that he ever believed in god, and certainly didn't believe in religion. And I'd bet there are millions out there like him who wouldn't call themselves atheists but only for lack of interest.

[jenmito]

11. I'm an atheist with agnostic tendencies. I have NO problem with Obama since he doesn't use

religion to divide people.

[mscuedawg]

14. Thank you for the link!

I struggle with my response…hoping to broadening my mind, and not wanting to offend….the brain works faster than the fingers…and you expressed yourself quite eloquently. :)

You invoke great thought for me today. I cannot tell anyone that I understand what ordeals African Americans experience, because I’m Caucasian… I can’t say that I understand the trials that my gay friends face, because I’m not gay… and until I read your post, I didn’t appreciate what “nonbelievers” experience and I thank you for shedding some light on that.

I enjoy being a liberal Christian. I've been told that is an oxymoron...you have to be one or the other. My faith has taught me tolerance. And that fear and ignorance are dangerous.

I can’t imagine this life without tolerance! (And I'm human, I struggle greatly!!) I really think that if you live a good life…you will be rewarded. Personally, I hope to be rewarded with a place in Heaven. If you can tolerate me believing (for lack of a better term) the “fairy tales” of Christianity (because honestly, I can’t PROVE it…I just BELIEVE it), and if you are a true and good person, then where is the difference?

Does that make any lick of sense?!?!?! I really hope so! :hug:

[JohnMcCant2008]

15. YOU my friend, made me smile today! If only the rest of the country showed just

a bit of the open-mindedness and understanding that you did in your post, we would ALL benefit.

"I enjoy being a liberal Christian. I've been told that is an oxymoron...you have to be one or the other" -------- I think whoever told you that is wrong. IMHO you only HAVE to be what you choose to be without the fear of punishment or the dangling carrot of a reward. The only reward I want or need is my family and the world around me.

"If you can tolerate me believing (for lack of a better term) the “fairy tales” of Christianity (because honestly, I can’t PROVE it…I just BELIEVE it), and if you are a true and good person, then where is the difference?"---------- Exactly!

I am not an evangelical atheist, I don't feel the need to "convert" the religious - and that's all I would expect from anyone in return.

I don't even have issues with my tax dollars being spent on effective faith-based programs. If a belief can get someone off a crack pipe, or help turn their life around in a positive way - well GOOD for them!

Here's the thing though - I DO think we have reached the tipping point in this country where religion is causing as much divisiveness and harm as it is good, and this election is bringing all that ugliness to the forefront.

[mscuedawg]

16. One of my favorites: I'm straight...but not NARROW!!!! : )

The oxymoron part I referred to is the far gone religious people!!! Reminds me of the movie Footloose…the Preacher going to the book burning and realizing what a monster he created!!! Or the people who bomb abortion clinics because they “kill babies”… I mean, WTH? Do they REALLY think that their work is God’s work? Its not MY God’s work!!!

You are so right…”I DO think we have reached the tipping point in this country where religion is causing as much divisiveness and harm as it is good, and this election is bringing all that ugliness to the forefront.”

I swear, some people are so worried about saving the world that I think they have forgotten about their own soul…or just “assume” that they are exempt from living like a Christian. Those are the people that have given “us” a bad name. Yes, I am my brother’s keeper, BUT at the end of the day, I am responsible for ME!

Hell, we’ve seen that with the BIGOTS in the McCain/Palin rallies (and I’m just now watching the news and I wanna HURL at him back-peddling…that now all of a sudden, Obama is a good Christian man…well, he was BEFORE when you were accusing him of terrorism).

Here’s what I wish people could get through their thick skulls … our world is not black or white … there are sooo many shades of gray! Abortion, AIDS, civil rights, gay rights... And I think its time we start considering those shades and start engaging their narrow minded brains before opening their mouths!

:loveya:

[JohnMcCant2008]

17. on that note - Everybody cut, everybody cut, everybody cut Footloose!

I really enjoy your posts!

[mscuedawg]

18. Awww...the feeling is so mutual!

You have blessed my life!!! :hug:

Can I say "keep the faith" to an atheist? LMAO :bounce:

Take care!!!

[JohnMcCant2008]

19. Atheists can have faith - just not in a higher power. For instance, my faith in DEMOCRACY has been

restored tonight with all that has happened in the news today!

[mscuedawg]

20. Let me say, Amen to that!!!

Think its too early to sing...Ding dong the witch is dead???!!!!!!

:applause: :woohoo:

:woohoo: :applause: