OMG!!! A doctor weighs in about McCain's facial ticks and confused behavior on camera yesterday

[FourScore]

ON EDIT:
I'D LIKE TO BE VERY CLEAR THAT I AM GENUINELY VERY CONCERNED ABOUT SENATOR MCCAIN'S HEALTH. I FEEL CERTAIN THAT EVERYONE HERE AT DU SHARES MY CONCERN AND NO ONE WANTS ANY HARM TO COME TO HIM. I ALSO WOULD LIKE TO ENCOURAGE ANYONE READING THIS THREAD TO IMMEDIATELY ALERT THE MODS IF ANY RESPONSE SEEMS TO CONTRADICT THIS SENTIMENT OR IN ANY WAY EXPRESSES JOY OVER MCCAIN'S POSSIBLE DEBILITATING HEALTH.

HAVING SAID THAT, JOHN MCCAIN IS APPLYING FOR THE HIGHEST OFFICE IN THE LAND, AND THE CITIZENS OF THIS COUNTRY DESERVE FULL DISCLOSURE OF HIS HEALTH RECORDS SO THAT WE MAY DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT HE IS PHYSICALLY FIT FOR THE JOB.

FROM AMERICABLOG (John Aravosis has been doing some amazing work on the topic of McCain's health.):
http://www.americablog.com/2008/10/doctor-weighs-in-about-mccains-facial.html

I actually viewed the bumbling around the stage episode on TV while I was leaning over a patient today - and was somewhat concerned. In light of the fact that this occurred just seconds after the facial issues that you documented in the other video is very very disturbing. Let me put it like this. If I had seen a 70-75 year old man do that in front of me in the emergency room - that gentleman would be immediately admitted for what is known as a TIA. This is a mini-stroke that often comes before a big huge one. It is likely that if this occurred - Senator McCain may have realized something was wrong - and immediately began looking for an exit. This bumbling lost behavior followed by the initial onset of the symptoms is very commonly described by family members witnessing such events. Regardless, he should be admitted to the hospital for observation - ruled out for strokes with tests - and possibly be immediately begun on certain meds to attempt to abort any other such attacks. I have not been able to find video of his speech patterns around the time of the facial problems today - it would be interesting to note if there were any changes. If it does turn out to be a TIA - the patient would need further evaluation to note if his carotid arteries are blocked.

I showed this video to 3 colleagues today - AND a neurologist - all of us agreed - this is concerning and should be immediately evaluated. It is, however, impossible to make medical diagnosis via a video - unless you are Bill Frist or Tom Coburn. I would caution you to be careful about making any insinuations about his medical condition based on just that alone. However, I am concerned enough about what I saw of Senator McCain today that he should be seeing a doctor immediately.

Just talked to two more buddies - again - they totally agree - one of whom is ardent McCain supporter.

Followed by THIS:
http://www.americablog.com/2008/10/more-doctor-analysis-of-mccains-video.html

Toward the end of the video - when the massive nervous twitching was happening - his voice did seem to soften - and he paused frequently. There was no speech slurring. There did not seem to be any problem with other motor movements - ie he was still able to stand up straight - no leaning to one side or the other.

I still stand by what I said earlier - this twitching toward the end was distinctly different and corresponded to a time when he was confused. He momentarily did not appear as robust as he had been. Given these symptoms - and his obvious confusion - a visit to a physician immediately is in order. I would also add that cognitive dysfuntion like we have witnessed over the last several weeks is also quite concerning. He may be tired - but John believe me - that is what they all say. I see this kind of presentation all the time - concerned family members bringing grandpa in because something just is not right - and then on exam it is clear that grandpa has had a little stroke. He needs to be evaluated now.

In my professional career, I have done countless executive physicals and attestations to corporate boards and personnel offices. It is customary for men and women in leadership positions to get a thorough physical examination and follow up on anything out of the ordinary. In my career, I have seen several people turned down for jobs as CEOs or CFOs for the most trivial of reasons. This, however, is not one of those times. There are enough serious issues going on - pointed out to me today - that I believe he really needs to be evaluated and shoot straight with the American people - his future board of directors (assuming he is elected).

Read the full text at the links provided above. They are quite informative!

THE MEDIA NEEDS TO DEMAND FULL DISCLOSURE OF MCCAINS HEALTH RECORDS!!!

[codjh9]

1. Jee-sus! I hope he gets checked out. As much as I can't stand him, I don't wish him any

ill will personally/health-wise. And as you say, a man has no business running for president if he's in this kind of health.

[helderheid]

3. ditto

[medicswife]

2. The dude is a walking corpse. Plain and simple. nt

[ailsagirl]

11. Or else a walking time bomb. Whatever he is, it ain't good

[medicswife]

21. Especially not because Palin is his running mate!!!!! nt

[cali]

4. I watched my dad have a tia. it was frightening. and we immediately

called an ambulance even though he was insisting that he felt fine.

[renate]

9. good for you! I hope he's okay now n/t

[Princess Turandot]

18. My mother had one when she was 73..

a TIA that is. The reason that we knew something was up was that when my sister called her, she could hear her pressing the number pad on the phone and muttering something to herself, as if she was trying to make a call, not getting one. She did this on 3 successive calls. It was if her brain was telling her to do something but was also telling her to do the wrong action.

[cali]

22. My dad was just about the same age. We were standing around

my folks kitchen having drinks and he just started talking word salad. It only lasted for a few minutes but it was crystal clear in a second that something was very wrong. Also his right arm was clearly affected.

[nebenaube]

5. yes, that is what I saw...

as I've said elsewhere, this man is not going to even make it to the election. The republicans should concede now because America cannot withstand another gullible idiot at the helm.

[CoffeeCat]

6. If McCain had a stroke...

...and could not continue campaigning--what would happen to the Republican ticket?

Would the Republicans find a replacement or would Palin step in and rear her head?

:scared:

[bdamomma]

27. something to think about or would they postpone the election

and call it unprecedented. :tinfoilhat:

[OmahaBlueDog]

36. When this has happened at the state level, the state party meets and picks a substitute

What would happen at a national level, I don't know, but I'd suspect would be parallel.

At a minimum, the party would have to reconvene and pick a veep, assuming they elevated Gov. Palin to the top slot on the ticket.

[Sebastian Doyle]

70. Not always though....

Remember when the DEAD Mel Carnahan beat John Asscrotch in a Senate race?

As far as a national race.... I don't know, since it hasn't happenned. I imagine Mittens would make a claim for the title, since he won a few primaries, and Moosealini obviously didn't. The Huckster and Ron Paul camps might make a bid for the job as well.

[eshfemme]

7. Seriously, although I hate his guts I don't want McCain to die.

It's also scary because it's kinda like not wanting Bush to die because otherwise Cheney would be President. It's the same feelign I get thinking about Palin.... just the horror...

[Egnever]

10. Me either

at least not till after the election. I want the players to stay exactly as they are till Nov 4.

[ailsagirl]

13. Of course not-- I just don't want to see him as prez

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

49. I want Obama to win on the issues, not on the basis of his opponent's health

I think if something happened to McCain and forced him to withdraw, it would be a cloud over Obama's presidency. Obama needs to win because the American people prefer his ideas. In other words, he needs a strong mandate.

[FourScore]

57. That is an excellent point.

Still, McCain is applying for the highest office of the land. We need to know if he is physically capable of doing the job or not.

Especially when one considers his erratic behavior lately.

[Maraya1969]

79. I haven't heard anyone say this yet so I will. My mother is about the same

age as John McCain and I would be so concerned about her health is she took up the STRESS of running for president. It would seem to me that he should not be running around the country giving speeches, (STRESS) meeting and greeting hundreds of people, (STRESS) and getting onto TV to spend 1 1/2 hours debating a man who is 26, (?) years younger than he is.

Add to that his previous health conditions and I think it is a recipe for disaster. And I would be that any doctor would his license would say the same thing.

[NC_Nurse]

8. This part is LOL:

"I showed this video to 3 colleagues today - AND a neurologist - all of us agreed - this is concerning and should be immediately evaluated. It is, however, impossible to make medical diagnosis via a video - unless you are Bill Frist or Tom Coburn."

[global1]

12. Let's Say Something Happens To McCain Before The Election.....

does Sarah Palin automatically become the presidential nominee - or will the Repugs do something else?

[ailsagirl]

15. I can't even go there, it's so scary...

[vaberella]

19. This has been discussed before. No she doesn't. Someone else does.

Who I have no clue. Basically I would say they forfeit.

[lurky]

29. Emergency convention.

They name someone else, although the ballots would still say McCain/Palin. Who they name is anyone's guess, though I would be surprised if they put Palin on top of the ticket.

[bdamomma]

30. geez, let us not even speculate/assume that .

too scary. but didn't she already accept being the VP choice at the Convention unless they change the rules.

[gemlake]

40. Alan Keyes, please report for duty.

[dglow]

88. The neocon's dream come true!

Better before the election than after the election because the fix is in. A Republican whistleblower who helped steal previous elections for Karl Rove is on the record saying November's count has already been programmed for McCain. A Sarah Palin presidency is the neocons' dream come true. Like her predecessor, Palin is a blank slate who will do as she's told.

[dglow]

89. A NEOCON DREAM COME TRUE!

Better that McCain be replaced before the election rather than after the election. Since a Republican whistleblower by the name of Spoonamore is on the record, as one of Rove's computer network operatives, assuring that the election machines have already been programmed for McCain. It would be a neocon's dream to replace McCain with Palin. Like her predecessor, Bush, she is a blank slate who will do as she is told.

[CoffeeCat]

14. I noticed problems with his left eye...

...when he spoke in Cedar Rapids, two weeks ago.

His left eye was half closed, during much of his speech. I actually thought
the sun was in his eyes--because that eye was practically closed. It was
obvious and it wasn't normal.

That's the same eye that is closing and experiencing the "tick" that these
doctors are discussing.

Scary.

[npincus]

16. just sent your OP to Huffpo...

I hope this spreads quickly.

[ericgtr]

17. I am glad to see most in this thread not wish harm to McCain

You wouldn't know it by the REC's but I am glad to see the support in here. IMO for too long we have gotten excited whenever we've seen news of his ill health and it's just not right. Yes the polls were close but I would never wish that on anyone so here's to hoping McCain is either okay or getting any issues addressed. Oh yeah, and getting his ass kicked in this election. :D

[medicswife]

20. Of course nobody wants him to die, it's the fact that he chose Palin

as his running mate that makes me go nuts over the fact that he appears to be in worsening health. If that lady were to somehow end up as Commander in Chief, we'd be in deep and serious shit.

[Teaser]

23. neuroscientist here

this is not enough data for me to work with. Sure, if I was McCain, because of his age, I'd make an appointment with a neurologist.

Is there a longer excerpt of this speech that shows more of these tics?

And the confusion, I need a wider angle on that to see if he was getting conflicting stage direction from offstage...

It's a concern, but not convincing, and not damning.

[FourScore]

35. Follow the links at Americablog.

John (at Americablog) has been following this very closely. It began about 2 weeks ago that McCain started having odd twitches on one side of his face. His left mouth and eyes will suddenly twitch involuntarily. I have seen it happen 3 times in the last 2 weeks and it is quite noticeable. It occured yesterday.

You are right and I agree that the confusion of exiting the stage could hae been caused by any number of things that do not have to be related to any physical problems.

Still, is there any feedback you can give us on the fasial twitches?

I will see if I can find links later, but I have an appt in a few minutes and can't do it right now. Please, follow the links above, just keep following the links within the articles and you'll run across more of the video there.

If the man would just disclose the THOUSANDS of pages of his medical records then we wouldn't have to do this kind of guess-work.

[Teaser]

43. twitches:

could be anything, really. Stroke has been mentioned, that's plausible. Hell, maybe his motorneurons are dying and releasing acetylcholine bursts as they do.

Also, some compounds can cause this kind of thing. One of our techs just exposed himself to some isuflurane by accident and wound up with muscle fasciculations and this kind of confusion. But god knows why McCain would be anaesthetizing himself...

I had thought that the droopy eye might actually be myaesthenia gravis, but you never now.

[FourScore]

56. Exactly. It COULD be a stroke.

No one is saying that it definitely is. The question is, would you disagree witht the doctor's comments at Americablog?

The fact that he has been diagnosed 4x with melanoma, and factoring in his age...

He should first go see a doctor and THEN release his medical records.

[frickaline]

64. Yeah I'd agree with that

I think there are a few people running around saying, 'its a stroke! its a stroke!" which we *clearly* haven't the evidence to prove. And I personally am very skeptical of anyone claiming to be a doctor and coming to any conclusions based on so little evidence. Teaser is making more sense to me than a lot of these others.

However, the point here is we shouldn't have to prove it, it should be checked out and fully disclosed. His failure to properly release his medical records in full is just another way he proves himself unworthy of confidence.

[OnceUponTimeOnTheNet]

83. Nerve damage from Shingles on the face?

I don't know if he has had Shingles. But it can cause an eye to droop.

[sunnystarr]

51. On Morning Joe this am they were saying that McCain

was on some kind of drugs - I thought they said steroids - but I was only half awake. Did anyone see this?

[bdamomma]

24. god forbid, in the middle of the next debate he has one of these.

attacks.

[Alameda]

25. Where is the video? I've tried following the links to find it

crashed my browser and as I'm at work I don't have a lot of time to hunt it down....but I would like to see it.

I feel sorry for McCain, he's really lost himself. Who knows what demons drive him? I do not want him for president, but like others, I don't want to demonize him or wish horrible things to happen to him.

He is 72 and not in good health. I'm 66 and in good health, but I think the stress he is under and his schedule would make me seriously ill.

[Ichingcarpenter]

32. Did you try the DU video forum?

There is about 4 or 5 different ones. The slow motion one is the best

[Alameda]

34. I could do that, but when the post is in reference to a video

it would be more efficient if there was a link to the video....

[Ichingcarpenter]

37. Here are a few

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=385&topic_id=203717&mesg_id=203717

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x203615

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x203263

[Alameda]

46. Thank You!!!!

:yourock:

[crazy_vanilla]

84. +1

my sentiments exactly

[tblue37]

55. Re: your question: Who knows what demons drive him?

I would guess the demon is his overwhelming desire to possess "the precious." The preidency isn't a job or a sacred trust to him, but a prize that he would wear like a crown or a blue ribbon: I'm Number 1! (just as W does, and just the way Palin sees it--no different from winning a beauty contest--or a pie-baking contest.)

[City Lights]

26. The fact that he made such an issue of Obama "phoning it in" earlier, combined

with the fact that he didn't speak last night before voting makes me wonder what is really going on. It's not like him to pass up an opportunity for some free publicity.

To anyone who saw McCain on the morning shows today - how did he look, and how was his speech? Anyone notice anything further on this issue?

[bdamomma]

31. yea, he wasn't in the Senate last nite was he?

the guy is not well.

[City Lights]

33. He was there, but chose not to speak.

Did you read the story about Obama crossing the aisle to greet him? He received an icy response.

[blue sky at night]

28. thanks for an excellent post...

very informative and should be a hugh warning to us all. AND it should be an even bigger warning that electing McSame is really electing Psycho-Sarah; something that we cannot allow to happen.

[goclark]

38. Don't all candidates have to submit medical records?

Did Obama submit his ~?

[City Lights]

41. Obama released his. To my knowledge, Biden has not, but plans to...soon.

McCain opened his up to reporters for 3 hours, so they weren't "released." Palin's will not be released until after the election.

[goclark]

63. That is criminal ~

[ColbertWatcher]

72. I agree. n/t

[central scrutinizer]

39. Paging Sen. Frist - Stat - we need a video diagnosis

[Window]

45. ...

[L0oniX]

42. 45 to 55 yo is a more appropriate age for a president because...

the person should represent the majority population age or be in their prime earning years which in America is 45 to 55 and of course have enough political experience and have a good prospect for 8 years of service with no health issues. 35 or 65 are on the far edge of the spectrum with 65 being a better choice because of life experiences and political experiences. What corporate employer would hire a 72 yo person expecting to get a good 20 years of service from them or in this case even 8 years?

[Roland99]

44. Anyone get Sen. Frist's opinion yet?

[chill_wind]

47. As much as I would find even a healthy McCain presidency completely abhorrant,

this is not just abhorrant-- it is just tragic and-- depraved--that his campaign would just let him go on like this unchecked and not checked in anywhere for the sake of his own very life. A small TIA may not necessarily be life-threatening in itself(my father had them, and that is not what killed him), but it, or even anything vaguely resembling it *means something* medically. The McCain Campaign is SICK not to intervene.

[woo me with science]

48. You mean facial tics.

This is a facial tick:

[ForeignSpectator]

60. Argghh, quick, get it off me, get it off me!!!

[polichick]

50. It's completely obvious he's not well, and has been for months...

That the media hasn't demanded a release of ALL medical records is outrageous.

[Vinca]

52. TIA - that was my guess yesterday. I wonder if this had anything

to do with McBush not speaking on the Senate floor yesterday evening.

[Barack_America]

53. I disagree...to some extent.

McCain clearly sustained damage to his facial nerve, likely as a result of either his melanoma or the treatment of it. His face is consistently more slack on that side, resulting in the drooping eyelid and sagging cheek that so many of you have noticed. The fact that his symptoms from yesterday seemed to mostly involve the muscles of the face, makes me wonder if the problem was more localized to the facial nerve, rather than something more broad such as a TIA (or mini-stroke).

That being said, his symptoms do seem to worsen from time-to-time. And that is a concern. That is a BIG concern. Particularly when the given area was the primary site of one of the most deadly cancers known to man.

Bottom line, this man should be evaluated by a doctor immediately.

[Critters2]

68. My face is more slack on one side, and one eye has always drooped.

At the insistent of my Primary Care Physician some years ago, I got it checked by a neurologist. He found an essential tremor, but said that had nothing to do with my face (yet). Said it was nothing to be concerned about, just some asymmetry, probably genetic. Told me not to worry about it.

So, I'm not gonna worry about McCain's face, either.

[FourScore]

77. The difference is that this is a "sudden onset" for McCain.

It could be something as benign as what you have, but we do't know; AND you are not applying for the job of President of the United States (with Palin as your running mate!)

CEO's and CFO's commonly undergo medical exams before they can be hired for a company. It's unheard of that McCain hasn't fully disclosed his health records.

[Lance_Boyle]

54. watching TV while "leaning over a patient?"

Does the AMA have a penalty for Fristing while simultaneously tending to patients? Someone needs to have his/her license to practice medicine revoked.

[WA98296]

58. I assumed in was visiting a patient in a hospital room where the patient's tv was on.

[Lance_Boyle]

59. even so, this doesn't speak highly of the physician's

OOOOH! SHINY! Sorry - back to the point, turning attention away from a patient to focus on a television broadcast is not good.

[uponit7771]

61. I worked for the American Heart Association and these are some of the EXACT things to look out for!!

I've seen those with over stimulated nerves do the same thing

[Jacobin]

62. Media not saying anything?

[grannylib]

65. If he risks disablement or death, good night, of course he needs to

be evaluated. The possibility of stroke is nothing to ignore.
Senator McCain, please see a doctor!

[Shine]

66. Shit. Talk about "October surprise".

if McCain has (or had) a stroke and the news gets out, he's done.

He's done, anyway....but still.

[MissDeeds]

67. Thanks for posting this, whereismyparty

And thanks too for the very tactful and classy "on edit" comments at the top of your post. It's folks like you who bring civility to the battlefield of politics. Good on you!:toast:

[Sebastian Doyle]

69. While I absolutely do NOT wish harm on McCain I have to say this....

In the event that his destiny IS to have a stroke and die or be permanently incapacitated from it, it's far better for the country that it happens now, before the 'pukes can steal an election and have it happen with him in office, and that crazy Dominionazi lunatic Moosealini waiting in the wings.

McCain is clearly NOT the man he was in 2000, and that's something that should not be ignored. This is the fucking stability of the goddamn planet we're talking about here, not just one old man's life.

[ColbertWatcher]

71. This is despicable.

Every single person around McCain should be sent to prison for what they are doing to this man.

His wife, his "handlers" and any doctor who has seen him since his candidacy has started. They're all criminally culpable in some way.

Damn.

[petgoat]

73. Are they trying to create a monarchy of a child-Queen, ruled by shadowy advisors? nt

[ColbertWatcher]

75. Dr. Colbert did a whole bit on how Shakespearean the McCain campaign is. n/t

[Imagevision]

74. It's absurd a full medical (head to toe) isn't mandatory for presidency - utterly pathetic!

[DeadElephant_ORG]

76. LINK to slow-motion video of facial ticks, and disorientation as he attempts to leave the stage.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=haIAN02tlLM&eurl=http://www.americablog.com/2008/10/slow-motion-video-of-mccains-facial.html

[nutsnberries]

78. I didn't read all posts above or go to the links but in the text of your message...

I didn't see you acknowledge that McCain has had facial nerves damaged by cancer surgery.

The problem with his facial nerves wouldn't (as far as i know) explain confusion leaving the stage, but that wasn't necessarily a sign of anything other than regular "which way do I go?" confusion.

Call one of his campaign offices if you're concerned and think his doctors aren't aware of what you're seeing.

[FloridaJudy]

80. I've seen this myself in McCain in the past

And while I'm no neurologist, I've said to myself "If a patient I was talking to showed this kind of behavior, I'd recommend a complete neuro evaluation - STAT". I've been accused of pulling a Bill Frist (diagnosing at a distance) here on DU when I made such an observation: "You can't say someone's neurologically impaired just because he blinks funny". No you can't, but combined with episodes of what looks like confusion, I can say "Jeez, I hope his doctor is aware of this and has ordered the appropriate tests".

Nice to know that someone who is a neurologist concurs. It could just be fatigue combined with long-time facial tics, but it could be a sign of something really, really scary - particularly since McCain is a melanoma surviver. A good friend of mine died of melanoma metastases to the brain, almost ten years after her primary tumor had successfully been dealt with, and the first clue we had that something was wrong - beyond the normal eccentricity we'd come to expect from her - were brief episodes of confusion and odd facial tics. Again, it could be nothing, but given McCain's medical history I want to see a really qualified neurologist on the case.

[Piewhacket]

81. This needs more play.

[George II]

82. Another "OMG" subject line....is that REALLY necessary????

...the melodrama kills me!!!

OMG!

[Zambero]

86. Only if McCain somehow pulls ahead in the polls

Then, OMG!

[George II]

90. OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG

...it's so freaking corny and overdone. Like NOT saying "OMG" would cause everyone to ignore the post?

OMG

[bobd0]

85. Vote for McCain and welcome President Palin K&R

[madrchsod]

87. no one over 60 should be the president

[KatyaR]

91. My big fear is that, if he loses, he'll have a stroke or worse as a result.

What kind of sympathy would that get the GOP? It would be untouchable.

I don't want anything to happen to him either, and I would hope someone would be looking out for his best interests. But even if there are, we may never know about it--I'm sure they would keep it a deep, dark secret. He may even have a physician traveling with him, who knows?

[tclambert]

92. Listening to Palin makes me feel like I'm having a stroke.

[tclambert]

94. Yay! I made it to 100 posts!

[tclambert]

95. Some are more substantive than others.

[Rose Rosetree]

93. Thanks for the insight

I have put a link to this at my blog, here:
http://www.rose-rosetree.com/blog/2008/09/27/aura-reading-empath-merge-presidential-debate/

Thanks for this analysis.

Rose Rosetree
Also blogging at "Deeper Perception Made Practical."