One way or another, Palin is a Rove trick.

[King Coal]

He used her to get the fundie vote. Now the fundies will accept Romney. I just can’t believe they are stupid enough to run with Palin. Even though I hear many wing nuts say they like her, she may leave the ticket soon after Thursday.

Unless………

They plan on stealing the damn thing again and having Gramps kick the bucket early on, and then be in place to manage the most malleable puppet leader of a country the world has ever seen.

[VolcanoJen]

1. I'll say it again.

The GOP is in shambles, McCain's campaign is a massive clusterfuck, and I don't even think anyone's working in the Bush Administration anymore.

Karl Rove had "the math" in 2006, and he got his ASS KICKED.

They are utterly and totally discredited and incompetent. They couldn't pull off an October Surprise or a Stolen Election even if Nixon rose from the dead. Rove is so 2004.

[blondeatlast]

4. Agreed. there is no way in hell fundies would vote for a Mormon--especially knowing

how fragile McCain is.

Mccain was the best they could do from a very weak field. Obama is the best we got from a very, very strong one.

It ain't over yet--but there are no "game changers" left.

[King Coal]

8. I hope your right, VJ.

[VolcanoJen]

19. I'm feelin' pretty good about stuff, King Coal!

:-) :thumbsup:

[Thrill]

2. They will run Palin. She is the only reason McCain still has a chance

[King Coal]

6. She is dumber than a box of hammers. How can that be anykind of a chance at all?

[tosh]

3. I must admit,

puppet leader is a thought that's been dangling by a spider-thread in my mind since her acceptance speech.

[lamp_shade]

5. If true, I'll bet he's reeeeaaally sorry.

[gravity]

7. Can't you just accept the fact that the GOP fucked up

[King Coal]

11. Nope. I wish I could.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

29. NOOOOOOOOOOOO WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY!!!!!!!

Although, hmmm, it is a possibility. :*

[timber84]

9. It's a trap !!!111111

:rofl:

[King Coal]

12. Your finger slipped off the shift key, Timber.

[timber84]

13. on purpose

:hi:

[AllentownJake]

10. The wingnuts are like pigs

once they taste blood they go bad. They got their dream candidate. McCain will leave the ticket before her.

[Stop Cornyn]

14. There are basically two competing Repub strategies: (1) win the moderate independents or (2) excite

the base.

McCain is fundamentally a "win the moderate independents" candidate because his own base can barely stand him. This is the theme at the heart of the "McCain's a maverick and Obama's the most liberal Muslim on the planet" Repub attack plan.

Notwithstanding McCain's hope to McCain win the moderate independents, Obama is (and even before the Palin selection, was) winning among independents.

The RNC (and Karl Rove) prefer an "excite the base" strategy because it helps the whole ticket. This strategy yields results in races from school boards to state legislatures to Congress to the top the ticket.

Before selecting Palin, McCain was running (and losing) a "win the moderate independents" campaign. McCain wanted to pick Lieberman or Ridge as his running-mate to further this campaign.

The RNC stepped in and told McCain "you can't lose the independents -- which you are losing -- and also lose the base because that will result in a hardcore political meltdown for the party at every level and in every state." Palin was offered as a way for McCain to keep his "maverick" theme alive while also exciting the base. She is perhaps the ONLY potential Repub VP candidate who offered this balance.

From McCain's perspective, Palin was a "Hail Mary" long-shot option to try and keep his campaign alive.

From the RNC's perspective, Palin was a "throw McCain under the bus to save our asses down-ballot" strategy.



I also thought that she was a Harriet-Myers-style bait and switch (when faced with pressure to select a female, pick a grossly unqualified female and let the media tear her down and then replace her with a male and blame the media for tearing your efforts to pick a female). If this had been the tactic, the switch would have been deployed by now. It is now too late to replace Palin (voting has already begun in some places).

In summary: Palin is a product of the RNC's decision that McCain couldn't win anyway so they might as well pick a VP candidate who will help "restore the Repub brand" and excite the base so as to mitigate the down-ballot shipwreck that was developing.

[King Coal]

21. Yeah, I can see how it is too late to switch now. So, I guess Gramps' time is short, eh?

[cameozalaznick]

35. Good analysis -- this could be a thread. eom

[EstimatedProphet]

15. Of course she is.

Enough already with the trick stuff. They fucked up, period. Enjoy it.

[Marsala]

16. ENOUGH ABOUT ROVE!

People obsess over him in the same way as the wingnuts do over Soros, and for as little reason. Rove is not running the McCain campaign. If he was, it would be doing much better, since Rove is not a total incompetent. Rove has actually criticized(!) the McCain campaign. He's probably banging his head against a wall at their stupidity. Plus, I'm sure he must hate McCain. Steve Schmidt is just his incompetent former henchman.

[ronnykmarshall]

22. IT'S A TRAP!!

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

31. NO!

[Sheets of Easter]

17. I planned on walking today. It rained. It's a Rovian plot.

edit-

Sometimes, a poor choice of running mate is just a poor choice of running mate. McCain and his advisors made a calculated, cynical choice that backfired miserably for them. They thought they could cinch up several bases at once (like the religious right, naive undecided non-Dems who voted for Hillary, terminally horny frat-boy types), and they managed to fail at almost all of them.

She's proven time and again that she could barely navigate her way through the subtle nuances of a Wendy's drive-through menu, yet alone foreign policy.


There is nothing "Rovian" about her, unless Rove planned on throwing the election for the GOP.

[King Coal]

20. You don't think Rove would love to have her for a puppet? You don't

realize how obsessed he is with getting rid of the New Deal. Underestimating him has caused a lot of problems for this country, don't repeat the mistake.

[blondeatlast]

23. Rove is working for Fox. Even HE knows he's irrelevant. Take the tinfoil off and enjoy

the autumn sun.

While you are at it, talk up an undecided voter about Obama's tax and health plans. It'll do you a world of good.

You can find details at mybrackobama.com

[King Coal]

27. McCain has hired Rove to advise his campaign, in case you didn't know.

I really don't need a fucking lecture from you about talking to undecided voters. I probably run circles around you in that regard.

[vaberella]

18. At this point I figured she was a Plouffe/Axelrod/Gibbs trick.

Seriously, I do figure they plan on stealing the election, but I'm unsure if Palin was it. I say this because McCain has been apologizing for her over and over and over again wherever he can get air time. If she was atrick you wouldn't want your future President looking stupid.

McCain looks like a fool because of those things and when she was asked what newspapers she reads and not being able to name one...I can't wrap my head around her being a Rovian trick unless it's a trick that lost it's sparkle.

So what if he takes on the Fundies, check out your post. If he removes her they'll accept Romney...sure but look how bad that action would be. It would be the biggest mistake ever.

McCain would appear to be two things. First off he would appear to be weak and doing it because of the polls. He would lose a lot of the Republican base that didn't like him in the first place. Then if you have the Fundies who would accept Romney---check out how many Conservative Independents that would flip at his move.

You don't switch up Veep. He needs to win over the Indpendents and they'll either vote for Barr or go to Obama. Any way you look at it, he would fail.

[RepublicanElephant]

24. palin is dick cheney's neo-con fembot...

...putting a pretty face on facism.

[Forkboy]

25. Rove is an idiot. Stop buying the myth.

[Starry Messenger]

26. No. I disagree.

Karl Rove wouldn't want this on his resume'. The fundie vote was all sewn up years ago. The mc* camp is just really this arrogant. I mean what is left to steal for Rove and his boys. I think they've sucked just as much as they could out of America until we noticed and started squaking. Now they are going to sit back and enjoy retirement. My .02.

[cemaphonic]

28. If Palin is replaced at this point, expect a Dukakis-like drubbing.

Which he might get anyway. That would infuriate the fundie base, and convince moderates once and for all that he is just too damn reckless.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

30. IT'S A TARP!

[A-Schwarzenegger]

32. Some Dems are to Rove as Vizzini is to the Man in Black in the Princess Bride poison drink scene.

Man in Black: All right. Where is the poison? The battle of wits has begun. It ends when you decide and we both drink, and find out who is right... and who is dead.

Vizzini: But it's so simple. All I have to do is divine from what I know of you: are you the sort of man who would put the poison into his own goblet or his enemy's? Now, a clever man would put the poison into his own goblet, because he would know that only a great fool would reach for what he was given. I am not a great fool, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool, you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me.

Man in Black: You've made your decision then?

Vizzini: Not remotely. Because iocane comes from Australia, as everyone knows, and Australia is entirely peopled with criminals, and criminals are used to having people not trust them, as you are not trusted by me, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you.

Man in Black: Truly, you have a dizzying intellect.

Vizzini: Wait til I get going! Now, where was I?

Man in Black: Australia.

Vizzini: Yes, Australia. And you must have suspected I would have known the powder's origin, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me.

Man in Black: You're just stalling now.

Vizzini: You'd like to think that, wouldn't you? You've beaten my giant, which means you're exceptionally strong, so you could've put the poison in your own goblet, trusting on your strength to save you, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of you. But, you've also bested my Spaniard, which means you must have studied, and in studying you must have learned that man is mortal, so you would have put the poison as far from yourself as possible, so I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me.

Man in Black: You're trying to trick me into giving away something. It won't work.

Vizzini: IT HAS WORKED! YOU'VE GIVEN EVERYTHING AWAY! I KNOW WHERE THE POISON IS!

Man in Black: Then make your choice.

Vizzini: I will, and I choose - What in the world can that be?

Vizzini: (Vizzini gestures up and away from the table. Roberts looks. Vizzini swaps the goblets)

Man in Black: What? Where? I don't see anything.

Vizzini: Well, I- I could have sworn I saw something. No matter.First, let's drink. Me from my glass, and you from yours.

Man in Black, Vizzini: (they drink)

Man in Black: You guessed wrong.

Vizzini: You only think I guessed wrong! That's what's so funny! I switched glasses when your back was turned! Ha ha! You fool! You fell victim to one of the classic blunders! The most famous is never get involved in a land war in Asia, but only slightly less well-known is this: never go in against a Sicilian when death is on the line! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! Ha ha ha...

(Vizzini stops suddenly, and falls dead to the right)

Buttercup: And to think, all that time it was your cup that was poisoned.

Man in Black: They were both poisoned. I spent the last few years building up an immunity to iocane powder.

[phleshdef]

33. If so, then Karl Rove is a has been.

Its October. Changing out VPs at this point would be political suicide. I mean at this point, maybe McCain has nothing to lose, but I really don't see it happening.

[David__77]

34. If so, an ineffective one.

It ruined McCain's "positive" media narrative. He's now a captive of opportunism and ideological rigidity in the GOP. Furthermore, he ruined his "experience" narrative that was a real potential danger for Obama.