I like Bill.

[ccharles000]

Just want to put in my two cents. I like Bill and I don't understand why people like to attack him. I guess we all have different perceptions of him. I think he did well in the interviews. Can't we all just move on and start attacking repubs.

[FrenchieCat]

1. I want to like Bill again.....

but I don't understand his hesitancy in doing what is right by America, and doing it with zeal.

[dkf]

2. People attack him because he is such a profound disappointment.

He could be immensely helpful, but he chooses not to.

[ccharles000]

3. He has not disappointed me.

[dkf]

6. You don't expect much.

[ccharles000]

8. No I don't.

Do I think he could have done more? sure. do I think he did any wrong? nope.

[dkf]

11. Well I think his appearances have been hurtful, not helpful to Obama

and I wish he would just stay away.

Look at what happens when he comes out with his half-assed support...he makes more people upset than not.

He isn't good for the party any more. Now he is a source of disagreement and anger.

He needs to disappear for a few months. That is all I want from him since he can't do anything constructive.

[ccharles000]

14. We are just going to have to agree to disagree.

:hug:

[dkf]

19. You have a good heart ccharles.

I've always thought so...

[Skittles]

52. HE is not the source of disagreement and anger

people like YOU who keep rehashing garbage are the source - LET IT GO

[quickesst]

60. What happened....

to the "fuck the Clintons, we don't need her" bunch. Oh, never mind, they're right here, but singing a different tune since the election is closer than anyone expected at this point. What a joke. Thanks.
quickesst

[curious one]

4. I don't want touch this!

[Secret_Society]

5. Ditto

[trashcanistanista]

7. I don't always like him but tonight on Letterman he was

right on the money. I absolutely agree that people (on the other side) will go into the voting booth with a respect for McCain, but will secretly vote Obama because they know he is the better candidate. I agree with Bill that this election will not be a close win for Obama but a large win and I hope to God he is right in his confidence that American's will do the right thing. There is no reason for him to trash McCain, he knows and I know that McCain doesn't have a chance. I hope he was able to convince tonight's audience. He spoke logically and pushed hard but quietly for Obama and I thought he did well tonight.

[madmusic]

24. Exactly, seems many here want only a repug-like campaign

No holds barred even when it's not necessary.

[Heather MC]

67. No a repug like Campaign, but he could spend his time lifting up Obama More

That interview last night, he seem to say McCain and Hillary's name over and over, and only mentioned Obama's name a few times. I was disappointed in him last night. It was once again another Half-Hearted endorsement for Obama, and a nice Start of a Campaign Stomp Speech for Hillary in 2012.

There's a better way to handle things, and let's face it. Bill has a History of half hearted endorsements of democratic Presidental Candidates

[LiberalHeart]

54. I give him a thumbs up, too. Seeing him reminded me....

...how great it is to have a president with genuine intelligence and the ability to express himself with class. I don't think he should go on shows and trash the GOP. He's an ex-president of the American people, and that includes everyone. It would be unseemly for him to demean Republicans. This is not time to start pissing off anyone; it's the time to win them over. Bill offers a very fair look at the situation we're in and he voices his preference in this election, but he does it in a way that an ex-president should.

[TheDonkey]

9. people dislike him because he acts like a arrogant douche-bag

we have a tightly contested presidential election going on and he is dancing around praising McCain and pushing his own tiny agenda (rubbing his ego).

[trashcanistanista]

12. I have to say that tonight, he tried to appeal to

our country's better nature - "when there's too much emotion, there's too much heat, when there's too much heat there isn't enough light". He emphasized that our problems are of such a complexity and require thinking and left no doubt who is the better candidate. Clinton is subtle and masterful. He is campaigning in PA in three weeks, we shall see. I think he will bring PA home for Obama.

[Balderdash]

66. Your nick suits you but

Calling the only Democratic President that we had that was reelected and left the country immanently better off than when he found it a douche-bag is...amazingly weird. The one thing about Republicans that I like is that they treat there former CIC with the utmost respect, Democrats, eh, not so much. Clinton the example of what a President should be, smart, articulate and able to reach more people. And to have members of his own party call him shit like douche-bag, GOD DAMMIT, I'm simple fucking amazed.

Why do some here put more of the burden on the Clintons to win this election than they do the candidate.

[sandnsea]

10. Bill should start attacking repubs first n/t

[Cosmic Charlie]

13. if Bill knew he was going to be a half-hearted surrogate, he should have stayed home.

[Skittles]

15. I know who I wish would stay the fuck home

REPUKES - remember?

[Cosmic Charlie]

21. Bill doesn't, he thinks the Repukes are 'intuitive'

[Skittles]

22. CONTEXT

[Cosmic Charlie]

28. in what context did Hillary win the Popular Vote?

because that is the crap Bill was spreading earlier

he is the one who started the Primary rehash that you see playing out on this board,
and he did it on purpose.

[Skittles]

46. WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT

GET SOME MEDICATION FOR YOUR FUCKING SICKNESS

[bridgit]

16. It would appear that cannot be the case, we cannot just move on, still...

Clinton's global initiative remains a fine example of 3-D/4-D engagement & worldwide problem solving. He's able to talk on a range of issues in a similar fashion; his rap on the economic situation was thoughtful for coming straight off the top of his head (I always like his ability to do stuff like that). With respect to his Letterman spot; he was there to speak on just those matters and did so eloquently. I did hear Clinton prop Barack when Letterman tagged that LOQ (in the end it is Letterman's show and he could have been just as easily seen as even less accommodating for not playing Obama's card for him/on his behalf but its easier to poke at Clinton, so...:shrug:) For some people Clinton was clearly never enough, even here at DU go figure

[trashcanistanista]

18. I think he tried to raise the bar regarding campaigning

tonight, take it to a higher level and appeal to people's intelligence rather than their emotions. That seems to be his forte. I agree, he did well tonight. He did say he was for Obama, but phrased his discussion around Obama's strengths. In the end, the race is about who can take us out of the mess we are in which he admitted was far worse than when he was running. He is trying to bring people down from the American Idolish aspect of the race and try and get them to focus on real issues and make them think. It's the economy, now more than ever. He also informed the audience that Obama will not only win, but he will win big.

[bridgit]

27. Yep, heard him say that...

There's a thread out front where a poster swears he didn't even hear Clinton mention Obama's name. It's getting too silly when some can't even see or hear what's right in front of their eyes and ears...

Oh and peace on'ya :toast: we were out on the delta today, very lovely :bounce:

[TooRaLoo]

17. I don't understand why he's acting so uncommited to the Dem ticket.

This isn't an attack on Bill. It's called being let down. I liked Bill, too, but now I have to wonder what his motives are.

[bridgit]

23. Mmm, no I hear you; but I don't see Gore out there beating the bush for Obama every day either...

or Carter, or even most of Dem leadership top to bottom; I'm not talking a congressperson here a senator there but all Dems. You'd think it would look like a saloon fight in the wild, wild west with whiskey bottles shattering, guys thrown off balconies and tables being tipped over but it doesn't. I don't even see Bush 41 haranguing and button holing people every day in public for McCain. Any of them may be...but they aren't doing so in public. Only Bill Clinton seems required to do so in public.

The pattern I see is that this is the GE, and I knew these days would come. It is incumbent upon the candidates to flesh their own positions out, make their own cases, expand enhance and secure their own demographics. For even Clinton to engage heavily, riding in like Lancelot or some such, I would think the right would simply say that Obama is too weak a candidate and required the services of Bill Clinton to make his case for him.

[TooRaLoo]

25. Not really the point - if Bill IS going to speak publicly,

then why not do it with enthusiasm for our nominee?

[bridgit]

34. I'm sorry but that's ridiculous. Every time Bill Clinton speaks in public...

...he *has* to 'enthusiastically' do so on behalf of Barack Obama...to your satisfaction? In a manner that you agree with, or understand? I remain unconvinced you know just how often Clinton speaks in public where the subject isn't even the presidential election process. This stuff is just getting too silly. Time Is Of The Essence; There's much work to do. The heavy lifting remains in great measure Barack's and his campaign staff to perform. And that is the point.

[TooRaLoo]

36. No,

not to my specific satisfaction. Just enthusiastic, period. It would be nice. And frankly I'm not all that concerned with his other obligations right now; it's no excuse for him to drag his feet when talking about THIS election where so much is at stake. It just looks bad, and that is not helping us. Yes, there's work to be done, and if he can't at least make his campaign work more convincing, he needs to just stop.

[bridgit]

38. fair enough...

[Skittles]

51. they want Bill to WORSHIP Obama

you know - like THEY do

[Name removed]

55. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bridgit]

69. Bill said it on Daily Show tonight: Most people already know who loves Barack, its now up to Barack

to nurture whole other blocks of voters that have an interest in knowing that Barack loves them. Love having a reciprocal component :) He also suggested this election more than others is not a Rorschach where 'what is love/what does love look like/who loves who enough' tests are well suited. This one is more serious! Some people aren't looking for a prersident they can love; they're looking for someone they feel can answer some Q's, make things right again.

[Skittles]

48. because he is NOT ENTHUSIASTIC about him

GET THE FUCK OVER IT

[iamthebandfanman]

31. Al has said time and again

he doesnt really want to be involved in politics...
after 2004 i dont blame him.

al gore is a bad example.


as for carter, he actually has... but the media and the right wingers stomp that out quickly as theyve labled him a nut-job/whacko who sees flying saucers...

[bridgit]

37. Gore is the perfect example...of the ascended master politican...

Yes Gore has, Yes Carter has; but not only has Gore, Carter and Clinton spoke eloquently on behalf of the ticket; they've already *been there*. They've paid their various prices, some of them most dearly so. They are in the end Americans they've earned the moment, and are able to do what they see fit for themselves to do. And that's the end of it. Again, and I think it is the obsession with the Clinton's; but Clinton is in the minds of many simply not allowed to conduct his matters as he would have them conducted.

[iamthebandfanman]

39. missing my point

gore wants nothing to do with politics anymore, therefor he isnt out daily...
carter would LOVE to be out there daily stumping, but since hes been made fun of and marginalized by the media and the right... thats not very possible or effective...


im sorry, but those were bad examples.

if you are going to out into the public, with the intentions of speaking on politics.. you should be weary of what you are saying(assuming you actually have a dog in the race, so to speak)..

bill is still loved by the majority of americans, and in their eyes he can do no wrong....

therefor, if he were to say anything negative(not saying he has or did) whether small or large about our ticket ... well.. its not good.

i personally didnt watch letterman tonight, so i wouldnt know what he said tonight...
but i do know comments refering to the primary and obama not actually winning are definitely counter-productive to our party in this general election. if you dont see that, then i dont know what to tell ya.

i personally dont have anything against the guy.. he handled the tech expansion and economic growth of the 90s excellently... and his moderate style of governing served us all well...

but people on DU need to wake up and stop letting either their love or hatred for all that is clinton blind them to anything and everything dealing with their family.

its silly.

[bridgit]

43. Well no, its referred to as 'talking past one another', but that's fine...

I did watch the show, I do track the media left & right; and you may find it of interest to discover that coming here to DU can be rife with RW talking points that play against the Clintons..and by extension the Dem ticket. I would think if we want the ticket portrayed favorably, we'd refrain from activities that pull the Dem ticket down in sum total, as a summary judgment.

But I hear you big time right here, assuming you're referring to that net effect: "its silly" :silly:

[trashcanistanista]

30. I think, and this is from my own experience, that there is a

prime opportunity right now to flip "moderate rethugs" and those who are disgusted and yes, sickened by their party. He knows there are lots of them. I am seeing it too when I am out registering voters in my red district. Everyone who is out sees it. You get them by quietly winning them over not trash talking them. They already know their party is a joke, there is no need to beat a dead horse so to speak. He knows we need a big win to beat attempts at stealing votes. There are already more registered Dems in the country right now for Obama to win. He knows how important a big win is. It is out of our comfort zone, but trust me, it has to be done to get the votes. Obama is doing it too. I think that's Bill's approach right now and like I said, we shall see with PA. He even gave a nice push for Biden tonight. I also think he would be appealing in FLA and may help flip it to O. He's been to 300 cities and he feels the vibe. Despite what we may think of him here, he still garners a lot of respect throughout the country. We need to quell the emotions and bring this damn thing home, calmly, strategically and quietly eviscerate what's left of the rethug party. Nothing does this better than a landslide victory.

[FrenchieCat]

35. Well, OK....

Like I said, I'm just waiting to like Bill again...so I'll be patient. Afterall, it is really all that I can do. I already wrote my letter to him and made it public. So the ball is now in his court. I think he can get this done.

[Imagevision]

20. Bill has his own way of making a comeback, the racist claim was tricky to waltz around without

saying fuckoff...!

[grantcart]

26. I like ccharles000

[Forkboy]

29. Me too.

:)

[trashcanistanista]

33. Me three.

I like that we kept it civil. Only one "douchbag", very civil by DU standards. Thanks and good night.:hi:

[Hell-A Liberal]

32. I like Bill too....

but with all due respect to everyone of my DU brothers and sisters they do not call him a political mastermind for nothing. Here's the thing - as others have said before, primary campaigns are brutal things ... there are many of us here who recall the Dean/Kerry/Wes Clark smackdown that went on over here 4 years ago -- OUCH!!!

in a nutshell, WE ALL want the best DEM to win because we FRIGGIN care. We, unlike freepers, actually give a s@#t.

I think Bill and Hillary are excellent politicians - which means even though it is my fervant hope to see Obama (ergo DEMS) win this year, there is a slim chance he may not. Hillary has a lot of work to do - she has to show support for Obama/Unity, pay off massive amounts of debt, shore up her positives that took a huge beating the last 18 months, AND, frankly, keep her eye on 2012. If barack doesn't make it - and I hope to GOD he does, then, as McCan't would say "my friends, I want Hillary to run again and run hard and take it for us all." AMEN.

It is within her right to look out for 2012 and I'd be mad as hell at her if she wasn't. That's politics, baby.

Bill is looking out for 2012 as well and, again, that is perfectly correct and prudent...HOWEVER..Bill, unlike, Hillary can never ever run for the presidency again- this puts him in the "DEM statesmen class"- a la Ted Kennedy, Carter, etc... It is my belief, that it is his DUTY to guide and look out for his party. He may truly believe Hillary was the better choice- BUT SHE IS NOT ON THE BALLOT. So the question now is - what do we expect from an elder statesman? I know I hope that they would put the good of the party and its platform and principles above all else. I would hope that a statesman would take a look at this current economic/energy/environmental/and confidence crisis we have right now and ponder how best to serve US, the American people. The question is, after 4 more years of Repug rule under McThuselah - what kind of a country would hillary be running anyway? Will we even still be the US of A as you and I both know it? Even if she ran again in 2012, How do we know some other talented DEM won;t come out of the woodwork take the nom in 2012? Does Bill then allow for an additional 4 years at that point of repug rule? HEAVEN FORBID.

He doesn't know what will happen this fall, in 2012, or any other time in the future and neither do we. He won't be on any ballots either - so why not spread the love, at least right now, when we are racing some of the most dire problems we've faced in some time.

What I'm getting at is this - and again, I like Bill, and I like to think I get where he is coming from. But Being a black man by the name of Barack Hussein Obama, Barack needs , frankly, a more robust endorsement - not of his democratic policies which we all agree with, but of his CHARACTER. This is the thing Obama needs THE MOST help with in the battleground states and beyond. When Bill says - he thinks Barack will win, or ...he supports the DEM party - what he is FAILING to do is act as stateman and vouch for the party's choice (however it may have come about). Barack already has lots of surrogates talking about his plans and his platform - BUT only Bubba as a wildly successful ex-president can say - THIS MAN HAS THE CHARACTER AND "TESTICULAR FORTITUDE" to run this country. even if he doesn't really think so - it'd be great if he said it.

It's not what Clinton owes Barack or vice versa - they are all politicians and they are always looking out for themselves- (Barack included - who ain't no angel -he's skinny but he's tough SOB from Chicago politics in the classical sense)

It's what Clinton owes all of US....Do WE really deserve to be used as ping pong balls in this time of crisis? Do we deserve to be in the put deliberately yet again in the midst of primary battle discussions (read- political distractions) when we're sooooooo close? and make no mistake -- that is what this is - and attempt (deliberate or not) to fracture the DEM party at a time when it is most united. We may agree or disacgree on that - but the end result/impact is just that everytime he fails to be OUR stateman and vouch for US.

What have he and Hill been fighting for all these years if not for this moment? Call me crazy- but Bill knows what he is doing. I think, Bill still thinks of himself as a politician and not as the statesman he has since become.

2012 will answer itself...but right now, we have a LOT of shit to deal with and I want Bubba's help in getting the rat bastards out of there. I wAnt them O-U-T! and I want Bill to give at least as much effort, as the current times and their problems require -- the situation IS DIRE PEOPLE. Bill needs to get mad AT THE REPUBS. They fucked up his legacy for crying out loud....He doesn't even have to say Obama's name if he doesn't want to, but he does, in my humble opinion, need to give more a robust endorsement of, at the very least, the DEM party and what it stands for going into Nov. A tepid "oh he's ok" and bringing up his wife's plans for 2008 election WITHOUT HER ON THE BALLOT simply will not do the trick...and I think on some level we all know that THAT is the truth....

my 2 (i guess 4) cents.....

[No Elephants]

40. I like Obama.

[Hell-A Liberal]

41. me too :)

[No Elephants]

58. High Five! Fist Bump, too!

[ecstatic]

42. Huh? I used to really admire him too, still do, that's what makes his

behavior during and after the primaries so disturbing. If I never liked him then I wouldn't give a f*ck.

[Awsi Dooger]

44. He's fantastic

I have no idea what these threads are all about. No doubt typical DU obsession with recent nothingness.

[wyldwolf]

45. It's simple, ccharles000

The left/right, us/them, either/or mentality in politics is so deep that one side cannot possibly consider that an an idea from the other side can be a good one.

Bill Clinton is a centrist. He won as a centrist. He governed as a centrist. He took the best ideas from both sides. And he was a huge success. The left resents him for it. The right resents him for it. Clinton is hated because he and his policies were loved by the American people.

[ShortnFiery]

50. I agree with old adage: the only things in "the center of the road" are road kill & yellow lines.

;)

p.s. I did not ever like Bill's persona and my beloved husband talked me into voting for him the second time. I wish that I had not - he's disingenuous ... IMO a true megalomaniac who can't even swallow his pride to support HIS OWN WIFE. That's just plain sad. :(

[wyldwolf]

53. The game is played in the middle of the stadium.. spectators sit on the left and right

;)

p.s. - I don't care how you felt about him. :shrug:

[ShortnFiery]

57. That's the point - it's our FUTURE, not a game for Corporatists = Centrist DLC Democrats.

Bill, et. al., (other politically powerful democrats) can return to their mansions and pensions without a SECOND THOUGHT to "us peasants" of the non-investor classes (not having over $300,000 chump change to invest). However, it's MAIN STREET Democrats (regulated capitalism) who will rise up, if not NOW, then very soon.

IMNSHO, "centrism" is for chicken-shits who are always "triangulating" in order to be re-elected.

If you don't STAND for something (how about The Working American making under $250,000/year), you'll "sell your soul" for any damn thing.

Bill Clinton and far too many DLC democrats have already sold their souls (and votes) to Corporatism (Fascism) and it's NOT democratic nor representative of the Average American Worker. :(

[wyldwolf]

59. LOL! I'm always amazed how far you can stretch to attack Clinton.. but I have a challenge for you

.. and I'll bet you won't accept it.

Demonstrate how the DLC is more in bed with "corporations" than non-DLC Democrats.

FDR was a master triangulator. So was JFK, and Obama is learning fast (the quote in my sig is his)

[ShortnFiery]

63. I think that we define "triangulation" differently in troubled times. The Country's moving LEFT.

http://www.democrats.com/node/7789

[wyldwolf]

65. you still won't accept the challenge

so how do we define it in trouble times?

[mamalone]

47. I like him too.

But I admit that I am disappointed in him right now.


For what its worth though, the Clintons are very blessed to have an advocate and supporter like yourself:hug:

[cboy4]

49. YUP!

:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[BklynChick]

56. You're certainly entitled to that opinion. Many people here think he's done damage to our side.

[Skidmore]

61. Well, I don't like Bill.

I believe he has done just as much damage to the Democratic Party and the nation as he had done good. I grew tired of being expected to his boorish behavior years ago and have grown even more weary of those who insist that we must forever defer to him even when it is not in our interests to do so. We have railed against Republicans for years for genuflecting at the altar of Bush & Reagan, have we not?

My personal opinion is it is time for him to let someone else lead and to get out of the way.

[seaglass]

62. I like him too. Better than Obama. Luckily I am also ABM. n/t

[salguine]

64. Maybe Bill could start attacking Repubs too, instead of heaping praise on them.

[vssmith]

68. I like Bill too--Bill Maher