Kerry's numbers down, Rove not brilliant?

[malatesta1137]

A few days ago, I wrote here that Rove is disgusting, dishonest and.....brilliant. He's making a war hero look like a fraud and a fraud look like a war hero. People here dismissed me, basically saying that Rove is just playing old Nazi tricks that will only backfire. Now Kerry numbers are down. We are 2 months away from the election and Bush will get, on top of it, a bounce from this convention.

I've been saying for months that Kerry has to get more F*CKING aggressive before it's too late. Now I'm afraid it's getting very close to that 'too late' and WHAT THE HELL IS KERRY DOING TO RESPOND TO BUSH'S CORRUPT PROPAGANDA???? HE'S DOING F*CKING NOTHING!!!

Sorry for the rant.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/Electoral%20College%20Projection.htm

[ixion]

1. Do not underestimate the power of the dark side

Bush still has a job, so the propaganda is working. These guys might be a bit ham fisted about the way they do things, and obvious to be sure, but the propaganda is working, otherwise Bush would be in jail, rather than having a near 50% approval rating. :crazy:

[vi5]

2. It's not Kerry...It's the media...

Kerry and Edwards are making speeches...they are travelling the country...they are drawing amazing crowds....and they are criticizing Bush. The problem is that the media isn't covering any of this. They are covering the swift boat vet smears by a 100 to 1 ratio of what they are covering Kerry's responses to it.

If a candidate gets aggressive and does and says good things, what use is it if the media isn't going to cover it? It's very easy to get the repub message out when the news stations are booking them at a record rate, with nary a liberal or a dem in sight, except the straw man fox type dems.

[Dudley_DUright]

8. Exactly correct vi5

The media is the real problem here, not Kerry.

[asjr]

20. True. And they don't cover anyone but Bush. Kerry, etal

are on the road where they should be. And barring any dirty tricks concerning voting machines, I know Kerry will win. The media underestimate the public.

[devinsgram]

30. Also the media

underestimates the power of the internet. Buzzflash is getting unblievable hits.

[malatesta1137]

27. let's not blame someone else

for our mistakes. I don't buy this media excuse. They are indeed corporate whores and pro-Bush but if Kerry starts to expose Bush AND the media for what they are, liars and anti-American, with stronger language and tactics, the media WILL TAKE NOTICE.

[MercutioATC]

3. You're right. Rove is brilliant.

He's working for the opposition, but most people like things presented in small, easy to digest chunks and they believe what they're told over and over again. Rove's very good at that. Expectings to "backfire" on him is just foolish.

[JI7]

4. the Republicans are holding their convention

[meegbear]

6. Exactly ...

I've got a feeling that MAY have something to do with it. I could be wrong, of course.

[papau]

14. Kerry continues to lead or tie in last week polls except for LAT & Gallup

BUSH vs. KERRY: Among likely voters; with leaners, where available. (See registered voters.)


Survey ...................End Date Bush% Kerry% Margin Includes RunningMates?

ABC/Washington Post...... 8/29....49..49.......0......n/a

Time(without leaners).... 8/26... 46..46.......0.......Y

FOX/Opinion Dynamics..... 8/25....44..45.......1...... N

Gallup....................... 8/25....50..47.......3.......Y

NPR........................ 8/24....45..50.......5.......N


BUSH vs. KERRY: Among registered voters; with leaners, where available. (See likely voters.)

Survey ...................End Date Bush% Kerry% Margin Includes RunningMates?

ABC/Washington Post...... 8/29....48..49.......1......n/a

Gallup....................... 8/25....47..48.......1.......Y

Los Angeles Times........ 8/24....49..46.......3.......Y

IBD/CSM/TIPP............. 8/23....44..44.......0.......N

[Massacure]

5. Bush had a free month on Kerry

It is too be expected.

Besides, Gore overcame a 18 point deficit. Kerry should definately get two or three more points by election day.

[JohnKleeb]

11. and Kerry is a great closer, imagine that

So we still have a shot even if Bush is making some minor comeback, I didnt know Gore was behind by 18 though.

[Bush_Eats_Beef]

7. Go to PollingReport.com and look at the numbers.

http://www.pollingreport.com/

That Purple Heart bandaid thing WILL backfire.

Junior has to walk out onto the stage tomorrow night and explain...IN DETAIL...how he will accomplish all of the things he promised in 2000 and FAILED...TO...DELIVER.

Rove's "brilliance" can be accomplished by any man or woman willing to operate without the shortcoming of having conscience. He has destroyed lives, ruined careers, and enjoyed EVERY MOMENT of crushing his opponents, in "fair" fights or not...he got Rudy Giuliani to stand on the RNC stage and proclaim "Thank GOD we have George W. Bush for our president."

He's a petty thug who will do whatever is necessary to win.

[Dob Bole]

9. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGHHHHH!!! NOOOOOO!!!!

I'm tired of all this paranoia on the boards. Bush is up maybe 2 or 3 points, and the convention is sucking. The only reason everyone is freaking out is that people's expectations were running too high. We still have two months in this campaign, and 3 debates.

[AmerDem]

10. I told you Nazi Rove WASN'T brilliant

He is a one trick pony, nothing more. The reason it's working this time is that corporate media is in true lockstep with this administration. I suggest you start reading more info on Fascism.

[LondonAmerican]

25. Besides the _reductio ad Hitlerum_

do you have any concrete advice on how Kerry can or should respond to this so-called 'one-trick pony'? Because so far, he hasn't in any effective way.

[AmerDem]

35. No shit Sherlock!

I have no idea what so ever where your post is coming from. I have said over and over again that Kerry and his handlers have to take shrub right by the throat. Shrub is a failure and for Kerry's campaign not to capitalize on this is plain stupidity ( can you say, Donna Brazil and Gore 2000 all over again. ).

You asked me if I have concrete advice on how Kerry should respond.I have no idea why you chose my post seeking this information but i'll give you the answer you are looking for. Try thinking back to Clinton and how the man ran his campaigns...This is your answer, spread the word.

p.s. references to fascism and this administration are given for an obvious reason. If you can't figure out why I wouldn't be surprised...just look at the 40 plus % supporting shrub!

[drdigi420]

37. let's not forget, Gore WON

and this was before the world had 4 years of Bush to be outraged against

be patient, Kerry camp knows what's up

[AmerDem]

38. Lets not forget Clinton did also...

with absolutely NO Doubt he had won. Lets also not forget how Brazil and Gore kept as far away from Clinton as possible ( basically telling him to f off! )

Yes what a team that Brazil and Gore were! *sarcasm on heavy mode*

[The Hair in my Nose]

12. WHAT THE HELL IS KERRY DOING TO RESPOND TO BUSH'S CORRUPT PROPAGANDA????

... Windsurfing ???

[JI7]

15. no, he was campaigning in tennessee, but anyone who actually cared

would have already known that.

[JohnKleeb]

19. I thought he was in Beckley, West Virginia

Wait that was Edwards, sorry. You can't windsurf in Tennessee can you :D? NM its the American Legion and its today at 11 EST.

[gasperc]

13. If Kerry spent heavy in August he'd be very weak in Oct

should a quick 30second response been up with 24 hours of the ad yes, that way the news media could have included it with the saturation of replaying the SBVT ad to death. That would have been way better than the drib drab of press releases. Lesson learned, but on the whole it didn't have the impact they really wanted which was a huge 5-10pt drop on Kerry and force him to spend millions if not 10s of millions in August.

[Maddy McCall]

18. Thank you for pointing this out! Kerry has had to hold his funds...

until after the Republican convention. I don't know why this is so difficult for people to understand.

I expect a Kerry ad deluge after the convention ends. Wait and see.

[lancdem]

33. The money situation put Kerry at a major disadvantage

Kerry could've gone after the SBVT liars directly earlier, but I don't know if it would've made that much difference. They still would've been all over the TV.

[wildeyed]

16. I, too believe the media is at fault.

Karl Rove is a lying sack of shit, and any media who was pulling their own weight would be pointing that out.

What are YOU doing to respond to Bush's corrupt propaganda? I registered 10 new dem voters last night. I will be picking them up on election day and driving them to the polls, too. They HATE Bush!

Ask not what the Kerry campaign can do for you, ask what you can do for the Kerry campaign.

[Spazito]

17. Brilliant? Hardly...

I don't see the Mission Accomplished, the plastic turkey, etc, as brilliant in any way. You have an incumbent President that is under 50% in the polls when he once had over 80%. You have an incumbent President that is following the path of GHWB and Carter as a one-termer given that those incumbent Presidents such as Clinton and Reagan had 20% leads over their opponents at this time in their campaigns. Rove brilliant? If that is brilliant then, please, let him continue on.

[glitch]

34. Thank you for your voice of reason nt

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LondonAmerican]

26. Oh, OK

that's all right then! Don't worry, be happy!

[quaoar]

22. Here's an email I got from MoveOn:

Dear MoveOn member,
After four days of the Republican convention, national polls will likely find President Bush in the lead in the race for the White House. The Bush campaign is banking on using this so-called bounce to claim an early victory.

Of course, this bounce business is a mind game. Polls measure how the nation feels at a given time, but they’re terrible at measuring who’s going to actually get out and vote in battleground states. And when you look at those numbers, this is our race to lose. (See below for a longer explanation.)

So while Karl Rove tries to psych us out with poll numbers next week, we’re going to maintain a laser focus on one critically important task: getting our people to the polls through our ambitious Leave No Voter Behind field program. And our success in that depends on you.

Just because you live outside the battleground states doesn’t mean you have to sit this election out. The best way you can help is by adopting a battleground-state neighborhood as a Precinct Partner. You can call swing state voters to talk about the issues, take day trips there to knock on doors, even spend Election Day in one of the key neighborhoods where the race will be decided, getting Kerry voters to the polls. No matter where you live, you have an important role to play. Just click here to sign up:

http://www.moveonpac.org/precinctpartners/signup.html

Here's why the hype that Bush is winning doesn't stand up to scrutiny:

Nation-wide polls don't matter. This election will be decided in the 20 or so states that aren't firmly in Bush's camp. So while most national polls--which include voters in Texas and California--show a dead heat between Bush and Kerry, polls of the so-called "battleground states" tell a different story. A bipartisan poll from NPR1 has Kerry leading 52-43% in these states, and Fox News2 reports a 47-37% Kerry lead there.
Historically speaking, Bush is in a very weak position. Most experts agree that when a president is seeking re-election, most voters first decide whether he deserves re-election, and then look at the challenger. And most voters aren't liking what they see: Bush's approval rating is very low for an incumbent. Even more importantly, in some recent polls a large portion of voters say the country is on the wrong track, a benchmark that is extremely tough to recover from. Bush is not where he needs to be, and even a significant bounce won’t put him there.
In the swing states, the name of the game is turnout. There are literally millions of people who prefer Kerry to Bush but who are unlikely to vote at all. In fact, there are far more of these folks than there are "swing voters" who haven’t made up their minds yet. Experts on both sides agree that the winner on November 2 will be the candidate who gets his base out in the places where it matters. And it's pretty straightforward to get their attention: we'll call them on the phone, knock on their doors, and invite them to neighborhood house parties. We'll listen to their concerns and talk to them about both candidates' positions on the issues. And we'll remind them repeatedly to show up on Election Day.
We've now got 60 paid organizers on this campaign, by next week we'll have more than 100, and two weeks from tomorrow we'll have 400 more. But our ultimate success depends on you: talking to millions of voters takes tens of thousands of volunteers, and we're counting on you to be among them.

[RedEarth]

29. EVERYONE should read this email..............nt

[johnnie]

23. What are YOU doing to counteract this?

This is our race too. I'm not insinuating anything here, but we all have to get the word out about our candidate.
There are people here at DU that are out protesting, writing letters, calling their elected officials, writing to the news media and other things to get the word out to people.
There have also been a lot of people who have been posting threads about how Kerry is losing his numbers. We are all pretty much on the same side here at DU. Instead of wasting time preaching to the choir, maybe getting the word out beyond DU would be a better use of time.

[calico1]

24. I have seen endless threads talking about

the unfair media. How they cover every sigh any of the bushies utter, regardless of how insignificant and mostly ignore what the Dems do. All of which I agree with. One example- "commentators" for the DNC included many right wingers, yet there are no Liberal commentators for the RNC, except maybe for Ron Reagan and he probably gets limited time. It is customary for the opposing party to not campaign during the convention of the other party. Yet here we go AGAIN-- blaming the Kerry campaign for the fact that their message isn't getting across. Basically blaming Kerry for the lack of coverage from the mostly biased media. You know....He really does have his work cut out for him. Not only does he have to fight the republicans. He also has to fight some who claim to support him, it seems. :mad:

[Feanorcurufinwe]

28. Of course the majority of polls don't back you up.

Why let facts get in the way of a good rant, though?

[chiburb]

31. Bullshit.

I agree with the Plaid Adder, who says this:

Snip:

Well, barring massive election fraud, the ham sandwich is not getting another term. Rove's viruses are all still out there merrily exploiting human weaknesses - fear, hatred, greed, ignorance - but they're not helping his candidate any more. Rove's playbook basically has two pages in it. Page One: Manipulate the images of your guy so that he looks like General Patton, Superman, Santa Claus, and Jesus Christ all rolled into one. Page Two: Attack the other guy.

That's it. That's the whole bag of tricks.

Both strategies have gotten Rove and his crowd this far; but both strategies are foundering now, for one simple reason. Rovian media tactics only work on what you might call a "naive" reader - someone who doesn't realize that these images are not a transparent representation of reality. Four years ago, they had a lot of naive readers to work on. Bush's presidency has wised an awful lot of people up. It's 2004, and people in this country have experienced Bush's policies for long enough to be aware of the ironic and often tragic distance between the images projected by Rove's magic lantern and the reality that we are all currently mired in. Once people start reading those images ironically, Rove's Page One doesn't work worth a damn.

More on DU's front page here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/plaidder/04/28.html

[Julien Sorel]

32. People should just ignore the hysterical posts from now on.

Pointing out facts doesn't work, since the same people post the same shit every day no matter what is said, so just ignore them and let the chicken littles have their own little threads where they debate the velocity at which the sky falls.

[John_H]

36. Rove is not brilliant. He's just smart enough.

what he has are willing media accomplices, surrogate and communications operations that kick the shit out of ours on a daily basis (especially as far as staying on message goes) and lots of money.

[West Coast Democrat]

39. He's a lucky moron, just like Bush

Look what he said today!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x792979