Is Obama falling into a trap ?

[kentuck]

Anytime Republicans such as Karl Rove and Joe Scarborough attempt to give advice to the Democrats, I am suspicious. Everyone seems to be saying that Obama needs to "get tougher" with John McCain. If they can get Obama down in the mud with them, the Republicans believe that is the best way to defeat him.

So, what should Obama do? What should be his strategy?

In my opinion, he has to force McCain to talk about the issues? What is the best way to accomplish that? Certainly not going tit for tat in the mud. Of course, everyone has an opinion on this matter.

However, I think Obama needs to challenge McCain directly and often to talk about the issues. When the McCain campaign puts out a negative ad, the Obama campaign should point out to the public that McCain has refused to talk about the issues once again. After about three repetition of this charge, the focus would be upon the negative ads of the McCain campaign and their failure and disregard for the issues that are important to this country.

Obama does not need to get in the dirt. He needs to talk about what is important to the people and to our country and he needs to force McCain to do the same. He needs to point out each time they refuse to do so. That is just my opinion.

[creeksneakers2]

1. They keep trying to talk about issues

The media doesn't cover it.

[kentuck]

4. The Repubs have their own "media"

And, more or less, have said they do not care what the press says about their lies and distortions. The Democrats have to be their own media. There is a war going on to see who can get their message to the people the best. At present, the Repubs are winning. This is a serious issue.

[Kdillard]

2. I agree it is about the issues and Obama seems to be focusing

on that even though the McCain campaign doesn't want to do it.

[alcibiades_mystery]

3. The Obama camp has been successfully pushing the image of McCain/Palin as liars

They've done this over the last two weeks and worked the press into a lather behind it.

Just because it is not a strategy made up of aggressive attack ads doesn't mean it is not aggressive.

[kentuck]

8. Somehow, they have to force McCain to talk about the issues.

That is the challenge. The aggressive ads that have been running do not seem to be working. They need to focus on McCain's refusal to talk about the issues. And they need to point out when he refuses. We cannot let them continue to slide around what is important to the people. How do we do that? That is the question?

[alcibiades_mystery]

12. They force McCain to talk issues by making the character argument hurt

Essentially, they have to cut down McCain's character advantage in order to get him to pivot. Once that happens, it's slice and dice. In the meanwhile, we're seeing serious erosion of Palin's favorables that will pay dividends down the road.

I think it's been a fine effort. The liar stuff works because it makes McCain's character look bad, and because it paints Obama as somebody who really rteally wants to talk issues, while the GOPer try to divert. The lipstick on a pig incident is a good example.

[kentuck]

14. I agreed with the lipstick on the pig remarks...

it was the perfect analogy, which threw them off balance. However, perhaps should have followed up with more comments or ads about talking about the issues? Force them to get out of the mud and personal attack politics and talk about important matters. He must.

[alcibiades_mystery]

32. You have to build it

I think the Obama camp is doing a very good job of throwing McCain and company off the character path. They will have to turn to specifics sooner than they wanted to, and that's where Obama will slice and dice them.

[kentuck]

33. I agree.

When they start to talk specifics, McCain will have little to talk about. They realize that.

[nevergiveup]

5. Obama should ignore Palin

She is in the process of imploding. He needs to concentrate on the economy and McCain/Bush. In the end this will be all about bread and butter and are you better off than you were 4 to 8 years ago.

[elocs]

26. I basically agree. He is running against McCain and not Palin.

Republicans love the distraction and misdirection that Palin provides and we're getting suckered into falling for it. The more the Democrats harp on Palin and make her important the less that is being said about Obama and what he will do.

Whatever happened to, "It's the economy, stupid"? It's not Palin, Palin, Palin.

[Window]

6. I trust the Obama campaign. When he does hit back, at least it's not with lies.

Also, he uses the issues to hit back and he is much more classy than his foes.


Peace:thumbsup:

[tekisui]

7. Hit Hard WITH the Issues.

Mccain is bad for America. Bad for you. Bad for me. Scary bad.

[kentuck]

9. But he must find a way...

to make McCain talk about the issues also. How does he do that?

[tekisui]

21. Frame mccain as an extremist. Force the media to ask the question

through headline grabbing quotes and hard hitting ads. They need to be so in-your-face that mccain cannot let them go unanswered. Like "mccain wants to draft your children for more wars" "He thinks Americans are unwilling to do manual labor for $50/hour"

[rucky]

10. "Give 'em the truth, and they'll think it's hell."

Obama can scrap, and still stay out of the mud.

Rove's "advice" is an indication that the sleazemeisters are running out of red meat.

[chill_wind]

11. Joe Scarborough cares about Joe Scarborough's morning ratings.

Maybe he hasn't this seen memo from the Obama Campaign, or maybe he did and he'd rather pretend he hasn't.
This needs distributed far and wide.


Obama Camp Memo on the Straight Talk Express

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x7060761#top

[Rosa Luxemburg]

13. everybody write into him with the truth or you can complain to his editor

[me b zola]

15. No, Obama is laying the traps

However, I do get shivers when I hear all of the concerned conservative talking heads willing to advise Obama. In the end, though, I can't imagine Obama giving a tinkers damn about what they have to say.

I think that the campaigns have their final push strategies lined up and are going with them. Camp McCain is on full tilt BS/lie/mudslinging mode. Camp Obama has let McCain feel comfortable with that mode (think rope-a-dope) and is allowing McCain to discredit himself while Obama continues to talk about the issues.

[kentuck]

16. The only problem with that tactic...

is that if Obama continues to talk the issues and McCain continues the BS and the lies, there is a good chance the BS/lies will win in the end. They must be forced to talk about the issues and that should be the focus of the Obama campaign, in my opinion.

[me b zola]

22. But team Obama has begun to swing back on the lies and mudslinging

But he held back long enough for McCain to get so outragious that even the timid media is calling him out on the lies. Obama is using McCain to attack McCain. Just my .02 cents.

[kentuck]

27. You are correct...

But the McCain campaign has said they don't care what the media says - they will run their own campaign. They have their own propaganda system, talk radio et al, that they believe is strong enough for them to defeat the press and the Democrats combined. It has worked for them in the past and it appears to be working again? They refuse to talk about important issues. They will continue to refuse unless they are forced to do so. That is the challenge.

[me b zola]

42. I agree with you on McCain's tactics

Team McCain is on full tilt smear. But who are the voters who are up for grabs? The only Democrats who plan to vote for McCain probably would never vote for an African American. In 2000 & '04 there were Dems who voted puke because of fear (security)issues, but the only fear this cycle is the fear of a Black man. It's the independents who will tip the scale, and right now they are split.

I trust Obama's team and what their internal polls are telling them. They have quite a tight-rope to walk, and they are doing it with grace and style. The economy is squeezing the hell out of most of the US, and IMO staying focused on this with the occasional pointing out of McCain's failure to address these issues, will win the majority of independents come Nov.

What we can do to help fight the smears is to keep writing to the media pointing out the big fat lies by team McCain, and hitting the comment sections of media sites--there are a lot of battles being waged there.

[kentuck]

45. I think it would be a good move for Obama...

to announce ahead of time, who his Secretary of Defense, Secretary of State, or Secretary of Treasury might be. This would tend to give some voters more confidence in his Administration. This is a strategy he might want to pursue. It would put the new Administration in focus, in comparison to McCain and Palin and yet unnamed Cabinet.

Unlike previous elections, I think the voters are very concerned about the issues this time around? Perhaps I am naive?

[caledesi]

35. Good call! NT

[caledesi]

34. I agree! NT

[Teaser]

17. IT'S A TRAP!!!

it always is.

[President Decider]

18. Obama needs to do 3 things and he wins ...

1) Keep the focus on the fact that the other side has no message, no ideas, no solutions and is basically a 3rd Bush term.

2) Stay on the message of "Judgement" and the contrast between Obama's good judgement (i.e., War, economy, healthcare)and McCain's bad judgement (i.e., 90% Bush supporter, wrong on war, wrong on economy, wrong on healthcare, and wrong on picking a small-town ex-mayor and gun toting moose hunter who's only left the country once and never spoke with a single head of state.

3) Counter-attack every single attack and lie that comes out of the McCain smear machine swiftly and severely. Don't just defend the attack against you ... but go on the offensive and attack the lie and distortion. Call them out for the party with "no plan" and gimmickry that they are.

[kentuck]

20. I agree with that...

and I would add that he should challenge McCain publically to talk about the issues that matter. When he refuses and comes out with another ad or lie, Obama should call "Strike One!" If he gets three strikes on him, that would be a very effective campaign issue for Obama. It is not good enough that only Obama talks about the issues.

[Avalux]

19. Advice from my Dad (a wise man)....

he believes that if Obama stays on message, calls out McCain on his lies and distortions and does so in a forceful but not mud-slinging manner; the American people will realize Obama really IS different. This will be what makes people to decide to vote for him - people will realize he is true to his message and will trust him.

My Dad might be giving the American people too much credit, but we'll see. ;-)

[Abugface]

24. The Obama campaign must call out McCain ...

on every lie, and quickly, while getting the economic messages across, IMO.

[BumRushDaShow]

23. IMHO, it's time to get back to the "emotional"

Obama got where he was on looking at the future with hope and inspiration. This invoked a purely "emotional" response among the public. And as much as the lunatic fringe-biased M$M kept pounding on the "where are the issues?" and the "He needs to do more town halls" mantras, when he HAS done "issues" and "town halls", they ignored it. Meanwhile not one "issue" has come out of a repuke mouth other than "drilldrilldrill" and "bombbombbomb", and the rest of their campaign is based on "emotion" - fear, anxiety, anger, hatred - all negative, all the time.

The death of the McLame campaign came after the mortal wound of Housegate and the flood of positive "emotion" internalized by nearly everyone nationwide at the conclusion of the Dem. convention, which trumped even the blowhard pundits leaving them utterly speechless and eventually triggering the Hail Mary pick out of the repukes.

I think it's time for folks to really look at that dynamic at that point in time - even try to find videos of the aftermath of the Obama acceptance speech on the M$M and the flailing around that the repukes did over the weekend - leading to the near cancellation of their convention, the shortened first day, and the morphing of their nomination process into an unprecedented hatefest full of anger and ridicule because guess what? They got punk'd.

And then the next step for them was what? To try to lamely "copy" what Obama had done through much of his campaign. But instead, they did it repuke-style, bringing out the crowds to hear a screeching cow pandering to their worst emotions. But once more, acknowledging that "emotion" WORKS!

More and more, I don't think "issues" is going to get it at this point in time because guess what? The issues ARE out there (and have been since day one). The detailed economic plans, healthcare plans, foreign policy plans, etc. - these are ALL out there. And it seems that the only way to get a news cycle now is if tens of thousands show up to hear Obama speak (and within those speeches, he has ALWAYS stated "issues"), and doing this once more may just be enough to start swaying the sentiment (via the known "groupthink") back to sensibility.

[many a good man]

38. Exactly right. Issues obviously don't win elections

For the past 30 years we've always been right on issues but done horribly at the polls.

People who base their votes on the "issues" have already made up their mind. Now it's up to character and emotion to get us over the bump.

Obama's stance on the issues are all out there and he can rattle them off whenever he wants. But laundry lists don't sway most undecided voters because they are easily countered with lies and distortions. And the MSM doesn't even cover it.

Obama can use the McCain camp's lies and use it as a springboard to draw distinctions in character. His greatest strength is inspiration and he gives hope for positive change that can actually be achieved.

[L. Coyote]

44. An emotions campaign is the Republican goal. They can only win that one.

They cannot win on the issues and the record.
All they have is emotion and crude faith-based beliefs.
They want the emotional charge of two guys beating up on their girl!

[RNdaSilva]

25. My opinion?

Obama's camp knows what they're doing without...

[kristopher]

28. Speaking of traps...

Have you noticed the now recurring references to Mc being dishonorable?

Have you noticed the now frequent references to Mc's temperament?

Do you suppose Obama is hoping to get Mc to fly off the handle during the debates?

A public display of his famous rage would probably not help his chances of getting elected...

[kentuck]

30. Joe Scarborough and Pat Buchanan would define it as "passion"...

and the rest of the media would either agree or slightly disagree with their pronouncements. The people must be made aware of the critical nature of this election. We don't need to have a beer with the next President.

[kristopher]

31. I don't think they could put lipstick on that pig...

hehe.

If it's the PTSD type of rage I've seen in some Vietnam vets, there would be no spinning it as reason visibly departs.

[saltpoint]

29. The Obama team seems a lot more evolved than the McCain team.

If anybody had offered alternative viable competition, McCain would never have won the GOP nomination. His opponents where nobodies, chumps, and egomaniacs, so he could afford to run a lackluster, half-assed primary campaign and still remain in contention. Romney lost substantial leads in both Iowa and New Hampshire. Giuliani cut his own feet off and then hunkered down in Florida, where he got whipped.

Even the hapless puppet media are calling McCain to task for his negative campaign against Obama. I know the polling suggests a tight race, but I'm not buying it. Agree with your point on Obama's needing to hit McCain on issues important to voters, and feel he can do this tough and strong without any of the guttersnipe politics McCain is using so far.

[kid a]

36. I trust the Obama Campaign has this thing figured.

[Joe the Revelator]

37. EVERYTHING IS NOT A TRAP!!!!! nt

[kentuck]

39. And everything is not NOT a trap...

Obviously, this is a year where the issues are in the Democrats favor and the Republicans do not want to talk about them. They want to discuss personal issues which they are very good at doing. It is difficult to defeat them on their own turf.

However, after 8 years of GWB, the issues can be very emotional. People are interested in the issues this time around. They are concerned about their jobs. They are concerned about the banks failing. They are concerned about the value of their houses declining in the housing bubble. They are concerned about the price of gas. They are concerned about the debt to the Chinese and the war in Iraq. They are concerned about the shrinking dollar. They are concerned about the direction our country is going. These issues are Obama's strengths.

To debate the campaign on personal attacks and negative ads is not in Obama's favor. Call it a trap or whatever. It is a fact that the voters are once again being deceived by the McCain campaign.

[geek tragedy]

40. "Let's talk about the issues" never works.

Swing voters are people who don't have strong ideological beliefs and thus don't based on the issues.

That is what is so disturbing about the way this race has shaped up--there aren't enough voters who care about the issues to put us ahead.

[kentuck]

41. It works if...

it helps to focus the attention of the media and the voters on the fact that the McCain campaign is intent on running negative ads and lying their butts off until the end of this campaign. In this reality, the issues are the diversion to force the attention elsewhere. The alternative is what?

[geek tragedy]

43. Obama needs to tap into the anger and frustration

that's out there. People in places like Ohio are frustrated and PISSED. Obama needs to at the very least acknowledge this explicitly and channel it to his own advantage.

[kentuck]

46. In the end...

that may be the only strategy left for him to pursue.

[geek tragedy]

50. McCain is tapping into it with the culture wars

stuff--channeling the resentment of steel workers towards those damn librul snobs who look down on them.

[L. Coyote]

48. And yet, the issues always decide the elections.

Take your pick from this year's trifecta:
It's the economy stupid!
It's the corruption stupid!
It's the war stupid.

[geek tragedy]

51. Issues never decide the election. n/t

[kentuck]

53. What do you think decided the 2006 Congressional elections....

Which every Democrat on the ticket won? Why did they win? Was it the war in Iraq? Was it the corruption of the Republicans? Was it the fiscal irresponsibility? Aren't those "issues"?

[geek tragedy]

55. Voter frustration. They wanted to punish someone.

Nationally, the Republicans couldn't put together a strategy to redirect that anger. So it fell on their heads.

60% of McCain voters think the country is on the wrong track. Yet they're voting to keep Republicans in power.

[BlooInBloo]

47. Fucking DUers and their fucking made up "traps". Sheesh.

[kentuck]

49. So you think Obama is on the right strategy?

Or do you not wish to discuss it? Sometimes "traps" do not have to be intentional, they just happen. Perhaps you would prefer to call it something else besides a trap?

[BlooInBloo]

52. People are sofa king dense...

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/9/13/2011/51910/943/597071


It especially sucks because there's another round of swiftboating coming up. That means wussy DUers will be whining and handwringing even MORE.

Christ. Fucking wusses.

[kentuck]

54. How do you suggest they handle it?

The up-coming swift-boat attacks? Just ignore it? Fight back with similar ads? What specifically? Or should it not be discussed?

[PresidentObama]

56. He is. He can't fall into the trap, and stick to the issues. And stick to attacking McCain.

By talking about Sarah Palin, he ignores showcasing why he is ready and why McCain is wrong for American. Historically people rarely vote against the number two candidate, so McCain is pushing her forward and avoiding the bullets, while running advertisements attacking Obama on sex education for kids and etc.

It's classic strategy we saw in 2004. George W. Bush was unpopular, and couldn't win on the issues. So they made it about John Kerry. They're trying to make it about Barack Obama, keep the heat off the issues and McCain. And to 100% prevent Obama from going after McCain, they're also forcing him to focus on Palin--instead of McCain.

He has to stick the issues, not get distracted. Hammer at the issues, hammer at McCain.

Don't play defense, play offense.

[kentuck]

57. You have described their strategy perfectly...

In the end, I suppose all anyone can do is to tell the people the truth. It is then up to them to decide which direction they wish to go. The choice is theirs. The responsibility is theirs. That's all we have to offer them. They can take it or leave it. It's their country.

[midnight]

58. Obama better listen to his running mate Biden and not Rove.

[New_England_Patriot]

59. Obama knows what he's doing

Obama has talked about the issues. Numerous times. McCain has been echoing the same plethora of bullshit that Bush and his cronies pushed on the people for the past 8 years.

But after what happened in 2004. I don't blame Obama for going on the absolute offensive like this. Look at what happened to Kerry. In the presidential debates, Kerry destroyed Bush. The Bush machine kept scaring us with lies, and throwing mud in our faces, even having Cheney say "Vote for us or die." Kerry finally went on the offensive and defended his record, but I think it was too late by the time he did.

Bush won.

Now Obama is going on the offensive early, getting the talking points out early, making McCain and Palin look like the scum they are. Obama knows the MSM is literally against him. And the McCain camp has had to resort to lipstick to try and smear Obama back... they're that desperate that they'll do anything at this point.

[TwilightGardener]

60. The debates SHOULD be about issues, if they're done properly.

If they're about flag pins and Farrakhan and Wright and Holy Sacred POWness, then we're fucked.

[Democat]

61. Undecided voters don't care about issues

If they cared about issues they wouldn't be undecided at this point. They care about character. If Obama let's McCain undermine his character, he loses. If Obama can undermine Palin and McCain's character, he wins.

It's that simple at this point in the game. Obama needs to trash McCain and Palin's character by exposing the truth about them in the most brutal way possible.

[Hansel]

62. Don't know if he's falling a trap but, a good rule of thumb:

Whatever Karl Rove tells you, as a Democrat, to do you should do the opposite.

I agree with your assessment about what he should do. I would add, he needs to use short and strong sound bytes that make it to the news. And he needs to start painting a picture for the American people of what a McCain term would mean for them personally.

[kentuck]

63. McCain is a "dodger".

He doesn't want to talk about the issues. What is he afraid of? Let's talk about his taxcuts - same as Bush. Greenspan doesn't support his taxcuts without spending cuts to offset. He does not offer the spending cuts. He wants to continue the same Bush policies in the Mideast which have decimated our military. He's no reformer on the big issues. It's more of the same. Eighty percent of the people say we are on the wrong track and they do not want more of the same. Maybe that is why John McCain doesn't want to talk about the issues? We will wait to see what his next negative ad has to say?