“Latino-vs.-black violence drives hate crimes in L.A. County to 5-year high” (LA Times)

[jody]

Latino-vs.-black violence drives hate crimes in L.A. County to 5-year high

The annual report by the Los Angeles County Human Relations Commission showed hate crimes rose by 28%, to 763, with vandalism and assault leading the way.

In what commission Executive Director Robin Toma called an alarming trend, hate crimes based on race, religion and sexual orientation all rose, increasing against nearly all groups -- including blacks, gays, Jews, Mexicans, whites and Asians -- even as crime in general declined.

* * * * * * * * * * * *

Levin said other areas of the country have reported similar increases, including a 30% increase in New York last year; a 10-year study published last fall found that hate crimes in New York began to increase two years ago after declining over several years.

* * * * * * * * * * * *

"Pray," he said. "How else do you change someone's heart? Hatred is a spiritual wickedness."

Why aren’t Obama and McCain talking about our War on Terrorism against our homegrown terrorists?

Why are we spending hundreds of billions annually in other countries and ignoring violent crime in the U.S. that IMO is more important?

Why don’t Obama and McCain propose a budget that would fund “Home Security” at least as well as “Homeland Security” because in many communities, citizens cower in their homes?

Perhaps SCOTUS should reconsider its decision that governments are not obligated to protect an individual unless she/he is in custody leaving self-defense as a personal problem.

Self-defense using arms protected by the Second Amendment sounds good but our DoD budget is nothing more than funding for the U.S. Foreign Legion to protect the international assets and financial interests of the 1% of Americans who own over 50% of our financial assets and control every major multinational corporation in our nation.

[EFerrari]

1. The feds are all tied up rounding up undocumented workers.

They don't have the resources to actually deal with violent crime.

[dailykoff]

2. Did you know more people in L.A. are murdered by the police than by gangs?

That's not a statistic that gets a lot publicity.

[jody]

3. Thanks for the stat. Do you have a link so I can use that info in the future? n/t

[dailykoff]

9. I'll see if I can find one..

I heard it in a Pacifica interview discussing the latest Inglewood police shooting of innocent victim Michael Wicks on Monday:

http://www.adn.com/nation/story/472441.html

Very sad story.

[jody]

11. Thanks. n/t

[TomInTib]

5. Really? That is hard to believe.

I don't doubt your veracity, dailykoff, but I find that very hard to take as fact.

Do you know where one could find that information?

I am pretty crappy at web searches.

[dailykoff]

12. I'm looking, but it really isn't hard to believe.

L.A. has a long history of militarized police (SWAT teams started there) and police brutality going back to the 19th century. Remember Watts? It's also got something like 70 different police and sherrif jurisdictions which makes accountability very difficult.

[jody]

15. Have you read "Overkill: The Rise of Paramilitary Police Raids in America"?

It's a CATO report but the research is sound and well documented.

[Tim4319]

19. It's not that hard to believe.

Remember, before Rodney King beating was caught on tape, people found it hard to believe that police brutality was real.

[dailykoff]

32. Links:

The statistic is attributed to minister and activist Tony Muhammad by program host Jerry Quickley at the beginning of the second of two segments of this Pacifica show (about 3/7 of the way in):

http://archive.kpfk.org/parchive/mp3/kpfk_080724_170200bts_jerry.mp3

I can't find a print reference to this particular remark, but here are a couple of recent articles mentioning Tony Muhammad:

http://2ndcall.org/news_events.htm

http://articles.latimes.com/2006/jul/19/local/me-briefs19.1

http://www.lacitybeat.com/cms/story/detail/?id=2584&IssueNum=118

[Donald Ian Rankin]

51. I think it's almost certainly not true.

Someone whose brief is "activist" rather than "statistician", being paraphrased by someone whose brief is "headlines" rather than "accuracy", making a claim this incredible, should not be given undue weight, I think.

[GeniusLib]

54. It doesn't get any publicity because it's blantantly wrong

Somewhere around 30 people are killed by police in LA county every year, the majority of these are justified so by definition they are not murder.

In contrast there are 400+ gang related killings each year in LA county.

[billyoc]

4. Los Angeles: Because even Philadelphia needs someone to laugh at.

:evilgrin:

[PM7nj]

53. Har har har... nt

[Name removed]

6. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[jody]

8. How can we find solutions to social problems if no one wants to talk? Isn't that the burden of those

elected to the highest office?

I remember reading "For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more."

[CreekDog]

41. that's a horrendous accusation

and one that you made here without basis.

[Captain Angry]

7. No candidate talks about crime or violence without talking tougher than their opponent.

If Obama said we need to do something to change it all, McCain would come out and talk incarceration.

If Obama says incarceration, McCain will say kill 'em all. (Few of the Latinos or Blacks are voting Republican anyway, no loss for him)

It's considered a local law-enforcement issue. I don't see either candidate wading into this one.

[jody]

10. I don't see either candidate addressing the issue unless voters demand it be addressed. Failure in

Iraq and Afghanistan is thousands of miles away but failure in our inner cities is up close and personal.

[Captain Angry]

16. I know.

It's frustrating. We have to fix the poverty and its causes.

I think one of the first things we could do would be to jettison any Reagan followers into the sun. Once people get over the whole "why should I help them?" stuff, we might be able to make some headway on fixing the problems in the cities and in rural America.

[jody]

18. I haven't read a list of key advisers to either Obama or McCain but some of the ones I've read about

are hold overs from previous administrations.

They might have new ideas but they also have lots of baggage.

I'm with you "jettison any Reagan followers into the sun" and any other key adviser that is unwilling to try new approaches to problems.

[Captain Angry]

23. There are too many "third rails"

Everything is so politicized that we can't have a meaningful discussion without emotional appeals, attack ads by special interests, etc.

I think that there are a lot of holdovers because people think that without them, Obama is too inexperienced. Hopefully if he takes office, he can get some new thinking.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

26. You and Captain Angry are so very wrong!! Have either of you even read Obama's platform

for Urban America? What do you know about the candidate that you plan to support? The plan is very long but worth the read...

Here:

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/pdf/UrbanFactSheet.pdf

<snip>

CRIME AND LAW ENFORCEMENT
Support Local Law Enforcement: The Bush administration has consistently cut funding for Community
Oriented Policing Services (COPS). Barack Obama is committed to fully funding the COPS program to combat
crime and help address police brutality and accountability issues in local communities. The COPS program
provides local law enforcement funding for: hiring and training law enforcement officers; procuring equipment
and support systems; paying officers to perform intelligence, anti-terror or homeland security duties; and
developing new technologies, including inter-operable communications and forensic technology. Obama also
supports efforts to encourage young people to enter the law enforcement profession, so that our local police
departments are not understaffed because of a dearth of qualified applicants.

Reduce Crime Recidivism by Providing Ex-Offender Supports: America is facing an incarceration and
post-incarceration crisis in urban communities. Today, nearly 2 million children have a parent in a correctional
facility. In the U.S. Senate, Obama has worked to provide job training, substance abuse and mental health
counseling, and employment opportunities to ex-offenders. In addition to signing these important programs into
law, Obama will create a prison-to-work incentive program, modeled on the successful Welfare-to-Work
Partnership, to create ties with employers and third-party agencies that provide training and support services to
ex-offenders, and to improve ex-offender employment and job retention rates. Obama will also work to reform
correctional systems to break down barriers for ex-offenders to find employment.

End the Dangerous Cycle of Youth Violence: Barack Obama is committed to ending youth violence. As a
resident and former community organizer on the South Side of Chicago, Barack Obama has witnessed firsthand
the destructive nature of youth violence and gang activity on our children and entire communities. As
president, Barack Obama will support innovative local programs, such as the CeaseFire program in Chicago,
that have been proven to work. Such programs implement a comprehensive public health approach that
investigates the causes of youth violence and implements a community-based strategy to prevent youth violence
by addressing both the symptoms and causes of neighborhood violence. He will also double funding for federal
afterschool programs and invest in 20 Promise Neighborhoods across the country to ensure that urban youth
have safe and meaningful opportunities to keep them off the streets after school.

Allow Effective Gun-Tracing: When law enforcement agencies operate in concert at the federal, state, and
local levels, the chances of solving a crime increases. Since 2003, the Tiahrt Amendment has restricted the
ability of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) to share gun trace information with
members of state and local law enforcement. The ATF has a wide-ranging database of gun information, yet
Washington has threatened police officers with time in prison for attempting to access it. As president, Barack
Obama would repeal the Tiahrt Amendment and give police officers across the nation the tools they need to
solve gun crimes and fight the illegal arms trade. Obama also favors commonsense measures that respect the
Second Amendment rights of gun owners, while keeping guns away from children and from criminals who
shouldn’t have them. He supports closing the gun show loophole and making guns in this country childproof.
He also supports making the expired federal Assault Weapons Ban permanent, as such weapons belong on
foreign battlefields and not on our streets.

End Racial Profiling: Barack Obama cosponsored federal legislation to ban racial profiling and require
federal, state and local law enforcement agencies to take steps to eliminate the practice. He introduced and

passed a law in the Illinois State Senate requiring the Illinois Department of Transportation to record the race,
age, and gender of all drivers stopped for traffic violations so that bias could be detected and addressed.

</snip>

[jody]

30. See my #25. n/t

[Hutzpa]

13. Let me see if I understand your thinking here

you are posting this because....

obviously the polls are showing

Obama winning Latino's vote by 4

to 1 so you feel oblidged to post

this now to show us wonderful people

how divided Latinos and Blacks are.

Good Job!

[jody]

14. My reason is simple, presidential candidates should propose solutions to our on War on Terror as

well as Bush's global War on Terrorism.

If the War on Drugs is fought in local communities by federal forces with laws that violate basic civil rights, e.g. asset forfeiture, then clearly a president should do no less in fighting local gangs.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

17. Obama *HAS* been discussing this in nearly every one of his speeches on domestic policies

McSame doesn't give a shit. Blacks and Hispanics aren't voting for him.

[jody]

20. Given your assertion, then we Dems need to stress McCain's failure on this key domestic issue. n/t

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

22. Absolutely. Obama has dedicated his entire career addressing communal, social problems in Urban

America. What has McSame done, other than vote against civil rights legislation?

[Cha]

21. That's good to know..maybe the OP

should do some research before asking the same question of both our candidates.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

24. This is an exercise is stark contrasts. Obama could have secured a high paying job

in some major law firm, becoming a corporate lawyer. Instead, he became a Civil Rights attorney and a community organizer, working with local non- and for-profits, and churches to tackle problems in some of Chicago's toughest neighborhoods. What has McSame done? Vote against civil rights laws, MLK holiday, and refuses to offer amnesty and a path to citizenship for illegal immigrants. In fact, he vowed to vote *against* his own comprehensive immigration bill because his party didn't like the idea of citizenship for illegals. He is a disgrace and a phony! Maverick, my ass!!

[jody]

25. Obviously you are an expert on Obama’s policy so please tell me in which of the issues below

does he discuss specific solutions to violent crime in inner cities and hate crimes such as the LA Times discussed in the cited article.

Civil Rights

Homeland Security

Urban Policy and under this issue:

CRIME AND LAW ENFORCEMENT
• Support Local Law Enforcement: Barack Obama is committed to fully funding the COPS program to combat crime and help address police brutality and accountability issues in local communities. Obama also supports efforts to encourage young people to enter the law enforcement profession, so that our local police departments are not understaffed because of a dearth of qualified applicants.

• Reduce Crime Recidivism by Providing Ex-Offender Supports: America is facing an incarceration and post-incarceration crisis in urban communities. Obama will create a prison-to-work incentive program, modeled on the successful Welfare-to-Work Partnership and work to reform correctional systems to break down barriers for ex-offenders to find employment.

• End the Dangerous Cycle of Youth Violence: As president, Barack Obama will support innovative local programs, such as the CeaseFire program in Chicago, that have been proven to work. Such programs implement a comprehensive public health approach that implements a community-based strategy to prevent youth violence. He will also double funding for federal afterschool programs and invest in 20 Promise Neighborhoods across the country to ensure that urban youth have meaningful opportunities to succeed.

• Address Gun Violence in Cities: As president, Barack Obama would repeal the Tiahrt Amendment, which restricts the ability of local law enforcement to access important gun trace information, and give police officers across the nation the tools they need to solve gun crimes and fight the illegal arms trade. Obama also favors commonsense measures that respect the Second Amendment rights of gun owners, while keeping guns away from children and from criminals who shouldn't have them. He supports closing the gun show loophole and making guns in this country childproof. He also supports making the expired federal Assault Weapons Ban permanent, as such weapons belong on foreign battlefields and not on our streets.

• End Racial Profiling: Barack Obama cosponsored federal legislation to ban racial profiling and require federal, state and local law enforcement agencies to take steps to eliminate the practice. He introduced and passed a law in the Illinois State Senate requiring the Illinois Department of Transportation to record the race, age, and gender of all drivers stopped for traffic violations so that bias could be detected and addressed.

[Cha]

27. Obviously you're

not..but that doesn't stop you from acting like it's the primaries..get the fuck over it.

[jody]

28. I interpret your reply as you are not able to answer my question. You really do need to get a life.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

29. I'm not sure I understand what you mean. This sounds like a plan to me...

What is it that you would have Obama do specifically? Are there other candidates that you feel would do a better job addressing these issues? If so, who are they and what are their plans?

[jody]

31. Please reread the LA article in the OP. Obama's talking points are not even close to what is needed

to fight violent crime in inner cities particularly those caused by gangs.

His talking points do not address the growing problem with hate crimes.

[CreekDog]

33. all you do here is start crap

i'm not getting into it with you anymore.

[jody]

37. I'm sorry you don't believe as I do that violent crime in inner cities like Philadelphia, D.C. are

major problems.

You could learn more about the issue from DU's thread http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=181310&mesg_id=181310

I don't believe ignoring problems is the way to solve them.

[CreekDog]

38. no that's not the point

i see your posts here all the time, and i don't particulary care if you don't like Obama, i care that you have consistently railed against Democratic positions.

like i said, you have a track record that anybody who has been here a while is familiar with. honestly a lot of your posting wouldn't even get an argument at Free Republic.

i'm not here to debate whether i prefer the Democrat or Democratic political positions. i'm here because i've already come to that conclusion.

[jody]

39. You miss my point and create fantasies. I've voted all my life for Democrats and will continue to

do so.

That doesn't mean I agree with a candidate's position on each issue or the Democrat party on its platform.

I do know that during the general election voters must demand that candidates clearly state how they plan to deal with major issues.

One such issue is violent crime particularly in inner cities because such things as homicide rates go up very fast as city population increases.

I know that community leaders in Philadelphia tried to create a 10,000 man, unarmed militia because law enforcement was not protecting citizens. Sadly only a few hundred men volunteered.

I don't know the answer to fighting crime in the U.S. but IMO it deserves the same attention and funding as Bush's global War on Terrorism.

If you disagree with me on my last point, then ignore the issue.

You say "i'm not here to debate whether i prefer the Democrat or Democratic political positions. i'm here because i've already come to that conclusion."

That sounds like unconditional allegiance to a candidate's position on every issue.

[CreekDog]

40. look, i'm not arguing with you because it's pointless

i have seen you post for a few years here and all your arguments end up the same way, you take a position, people tell you a thousand things in response, you pig headedly misrepresent them, learn nothing, and make the same argument 100 times more.

that's why it's pointless.

if you didn't, i think it might be worthwhile, but it's just an exercise in pointless frustration.

[jody]

42. Please cite several issues upon which you think we disagree. n/t

[CreekDog]

43. It was your behavior in the thread I've linked below that stopped me from engaging you

disagreeing is no big deal, but the way you did it there and elsewhere is what makes it pointless.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=2766353&mesg_id=2766353

[jody]

44. As I understand it, you and I agree on issues but you really don't like me. I can live with that but

that should not prevent us from discussing issues.

If I haven't been misled, that's the position Obama has been preaching on issues ranging from Iran to GLBT.

[CreekDog]

45. Another great reason to not debate issues with you --you've misrepresented me right here

i've never indicated to you that we agree on issues.

as for disliking you, i don't know you.

[jody]

46. I agree 100% with the Democratic Party platform. If you agree with the platform on issues then

you and I agree. See http://www.democrats.org/pdfs/2004platform.pdf

You say "i've never indicated to you that we agree on issues" however, I assumed perhaps incorrectly that you are a Democrat.

If you aren't a Democrat, please accept my apology for assuming you are.

[CreekDog]

49. charming

:eyes:

[stillcool]

34. Latino and Black

who cares? What country do you live in?

[jody]

36. Did you read the article? n/t

[stillcool]

50. Well yes...Yes I did..

I was commenting on your lamenting about the lack of attention being paid by the two Presidential candidates. Hate.. crimes or otherwise... is nothing new in this country, and I believe is born from and encouraged by politics in this country. It's the American way.

[Scurrilous]

35. LA Times Homicide Report:

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/homicidereport/

[Barack_America]

47. Or usage of the designation "hate crime" has gone up....

Whereas the same ol' gang violence is the same ol' gang violence.

Did I blow your mind with that basic logic there? ;) I'm pretty sure the LA Times minds are blown.

These two bits from the article are particularly interesting/concerning:

"The largest number of racial hate crimes involved Latino suspects against black victims, followed by black suspects against Latino victims. Latinos also made up the largest number of suspects in hate crimes based on sexual orientation. Whites were the leading suspects in religion-based incidents. Overall, blacks made up nearly half the hate crime victims, totaling 310.'

and

"The rhetoric appears to be influencing other groups, Toma said. He cited law enforcement reports that some Latino gang members who targeted blacks in the Harbor Gateway area of Los Angeles were found with neo-Nazi material and some Latino gangs were forming alliances with white supremacists in prisons to prey on blacks."

Strange considering, according to the report 32% of crimes committed against Latinos were by whites.

FYI, I found the report here: http://humanrelations.co.la.ca.us/

[jody]

48. Thanks for the link to a credible source. n/t

[Donald Ian Rankin]

52. To solve this, you'd need to either repeal the 2nd ammendment, end urban poverty, or possibly both.

So long as you have high concentrations of poor, alienated people with easy access to firearms, you're going to have high rates of crime and murder.

And I don't see either of those situations changing, no matter what the next president does, sadly.