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TeamJordan23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:23 PM
Original message
NYT: Some Muslim Americans Feel Shunned by Obama
I got a lot of heat for posting a similar article from the today's WSJ. Well this one is from tomorrow's NYT.

I understand that most of you think this is the correct political thing to do; keep your distance from Muslims to avoid getting typecasted as one by the RW. However, that does not mean it is unfortunate and in a disappointing. And I don't blame Obama for it. It is just how Islams are perceived by some in American society. My point earlier was that Obama should not run away from it but directly confront it. He should reach out the Muslim community because I think most of those who will take that him being a Muslim were not going to vote for him anyways. It is common knowledge that Muslims have been one of the most discriminated groups in the US since 9/11 and there continues to be anti-Muslim sentiment in parts of the country.

It just sucks it has to be this way, because I know Obama has to walk a fine line on the issue.

On another note, please do not take any critical articles or threads about Obama being anti-Obama or anti-Democrat. This should be a forum to have thoughtful, reasonable, and fair debate. I have been an Obama backer from Day 1 (just check my threads long before Obama won any Primarys) and will continue to be because no politician has inspired me the way he has. But that is not to say that he or any other politician will ever be perfect. I don't think we are changing anyone's mind on this forum because we are all stealth Democrats; so critical articles are not intended to not vote for Obama or support him.


Some Muslim Americans Feel Shunned by Obama
By ANDREA ELLIOTT
Published: June 24, 2008

Mr. Ellison believed that Mr. Obama’s message of unity resonated deeply with American Muslims. He volunteered to speak on Mr. Obama’s behalf at a mosque in Cedar Rapids, one of the nation’s oldest Muslim enclaves. But before the rally could take place, aides to Mr. Obama asked Mr. Ellison to cancel the trip because it might stir controversy. An aide appeared at Mr. Ellison’s Washington office to explain.

“I will never forget the quote,” Mr. Ellison said, leaning forward in his chair as he recalled the aide’s words. “He said, ‘We have a very tightly wrapped message.’ ”

When Mr. Obama began his presidential campaign, Muslim Americans from California to Virginia responded with enthusiasm, seeing him as a long-awaited champion of civil liberties, religious tolerance and diplomacy in foreign affairs. But more than a year later, many say, he has not returned their embrace.

While the senator has visited churches and synagogues, he has yet to appear at a single mosque. Muslim and Arab-American organizations have tried repeatedly to arrange meetings with Mr. Obama, but officials with those organizations say their invitations — unlike those of their Jewish and Christian counterparts — have been ignored. Last week, two Muslim women wearing head scarves were barred by campaign volunteers from appearing behind Mr. Obama at a rally in Detroit.

In interviews, Muslim political and civic leaders said they understood that their support for Mr. Obama could be a problem for him at a time when some Americans are deeply suspicious of Muslims. Yet those leaders nonetheless expressed disappointment and even anger at the distance that Mr. Obama has kept from them.

“This is the ‘hope campaign,’ this is the ‘change campaign,’ ” said Mr. Ellison, Democrat of Minnesota. Muslims are frustrated, he added, that “they have not been fully engaged in it.”


The strained relationship between Muslims and Mr. Obama reflects one of the main challenges facing the senator: how to maintain a broad electoral appeal without alienating any of the numerous constituencies he needs to win in November.

After the episode in Detroit last week, Mr. Obama telephoned the two Muslim women to apologize. “I take deepest offense to and will continue to fight against discrimination against people of any religious group or background,” he said in a statement.

Such gestures have fallen short in the eyes of many Muslim leaders, who say the Detroit incident and others illustrate a disconnect between Mr. Obama’s message of unity and his campaign strategy.

“The community feels betrayed,” said Safiya Ghori, the government relations director in the Washington office of the Muslim Public Affairs Council.

Even some of Mr. Obama’s strongest Muslim supporters say they are uncomfortable with the forceful denials he has made in response to rumors that he is secretly a Muslim. (Ten percent of registered voters believe the rumor, according to a poll by the Pew Research Center).


Full article: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/24/us/politics/24muslim.html?hp
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Bobbieo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:26 PM
Response to Original message
1. Will they feel LESS SHUNNED by McSame?
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blondeatlast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Sssh, you aren't supposed to think about him... nt
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TeamJordan23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:28 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Well as a Democrat, I don't think ANY group should be shunned. nm
Edited on Mon Jun-23-08 06:28 PM by TeamJordan23
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appal_jack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:32 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. Yup, NYT/MSM shilling for the right again...
Like a guy who sings "Bomb bomb bomb bomb bomb Iran," wouldn't be a nightmare for ALL the people of the world, but muslims especially. But the NYT wants to make hay about perceptions and that fine line that the OP notes that Obama must walk.

All the news that's fit to print. :eyes: Yeah, right.

-app
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:30 PM
Response to Original message
4. Did you see those pics with Obama and
the Muslim women taken on the campaign trail?

That's too bad about what happened with Rep Ellison.. I hope Obama can make that up.

It's something the rw and the m$$m will push just like they pushed the War ON Iraq was because of 9/11.
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genna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 07:32 AM
Response to Reply #4
41. Pattern and practice. Obama made a choice.
You can point out the MSM, but what about Obama's original choice?
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endarkenment Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:31 PM
Response to Original message
5. You have become obsessed with this.
Edited on Mon Jun-23-08 06:31 PM by endarkenment
Obama is not going down this road. It plays right into the stupid ass 'He's a secret Mooslim' bullshit.
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TeamJordan23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:34 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. And are those voters going to be voting for Barack anyways? Will we just live in fear of the RW? nm
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Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:35 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. Indeed. Third post on this topic by my count.
I think one would have sufficed.
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genna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 07:38 AM
Response to Reply #9
42. I've been reading the response to one, two, and three. It is unbelievable
what has been said.

I haven't gone back and read Team Jordan's threads but some of the assertion against honest criticism before it becomes a bigger deal is amazing.

Maybe MSM is on a hunt for something to stick to Obama, but it's record on protecting Muslim/Arab Americans should also be on the examination table. We are Americans who should be standing against ill treatment. We are accepting it as a matter of course, referencing 911 like it is the fault of "them".

We have to careful of 'them'.
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endarkenment Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 08:49 AM
Response to Reply #42
46. What is going on here is a coordinated effort to play the muslim card.
get a freaking clue.
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:33 PM
Response to Original message
7. I wasn't aware he turned down invitations to speak at any mosque
Edited on Mon Jun-23-08 06:35 PM by Catherina
This is so ugly and unfair, yet seriously, what would we have him do? Provide Fox News with video for 24/7 news coverage of "Osama Bin Barack" speaking at a mosque? And then they'll either find or plant some "fiery radical" in the audience who'll make Jeremiah Wright look like David Duke's best friend.

I KNOW the Muslim community feels betrayed and it's over more than just turning down an invitation or two but strategically speaking this is no time for Barack to provide such ammunition. We're going to outsmart the racist demons.

Most of my Muslim friends aren't too happy but I think it's because young, Americanized Muslims living in places like California are living a totally different experience than the ones in most of the rest of the country. You have to feel sorry for Obama needing to walk such a tight rope in this unfairly racist society where fear and terror now beat the loudest drums.

So much depends on every little perception they can exploit.
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Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:38 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. And how many churches has he turned down?
How many places of worship has he honestly spoken at?

His own church and Ebeneezer Baptist are among the few I can think of.

I know for a fact that almost every black church in Philly was hoping he would speak at their service before our April primary.

And, as far as I'm concerned, the question stands for McCain as well. How many mosques has he spoken at?
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 08:39 PM
Response to Reply #10
20. "While the senator has visited churches and synagogues, he has yet to appear at a single mosque"
Edited on Mon Jun-23-08 08:46 PM by Catherina
I don't know how that could be clearer. McCain not visiting Mosques isn't the issue; the majority of Muslims aren't looking to McCain. I think they're genuinely feeling avoided. While we may understand the reasons, that doesn't help.
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Barack_America Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 08:47 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. Oh good Lord the burden that man carries.
Why shouldn't Muslims be looking to McCain? If he were to become President I imagine they'd want him to represent him too.



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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 08:56 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. He does. I feel very sorry for him but he's got some terrific advisors
who'll help him navigate these treacherous waters. Why not looking to McCain, I imagine some are especially since his post-Keating maverick, small-business do over but Bush kind of burned them.
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City Lights Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 07:48 AM
Response to Reply #22
44. Ain't that the truth!
Never have I seen so many demands placed on one man by so many different groups of people, while the other guy gets a pass.
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genna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 07:43 AM
Response to Reply #7
43. Obama is giving in to these bigots. We are giving him permission.
He is not walking a tight rope. He has rejected 'these people' out of hand because the mere association will scald him.

I can remember a time when black people were treated the same way. I like Michael Eric Dyson's comments on this 'new negro.' The fact that there is a culture of silence about the bad treatment overall just incenses me.

It is not fair.
It is not right.
It sucks!
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #43
48. I wouldn't call it giving in, he's just protecting himself (and them)
Edited on Tue Jun-24-08 09:21 AM by Catherina
from some nasty slurs and smears. I think some Muslims are genuinely hurt, with reason, but if they sit down to think about it, they understand what's going on here. I don't think he's in any danger of losing the Muslim vote. What started all of this was those two idiots who didn't let those veiled women sit behind him a few weeks ago. I heard about that from some hard-core Muslim supporters who were really hurt but when I sent them the articles about his apology, that turned it around. The news didn't even mention his apology :wtf:.

This is something Obama can fix in his sleep by inserting a speaking tour at a mosque. I agree it sucjs totally but there's something to be said for not giving them opportunities to destroy you. I'll ask some friends today and see if this is even an issue for them.
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:41 PM
Response to Original message
11. TeamJordan23, FWIW, I think he should
embrace the Muslim culture and Muslim Americans, but understand how any effort can be perverted by the right. I don't have an answer, but I hope he finds one.

I have been on the receiving end of so many hateful e-mails that he must be walking on eggs. If this current admin hadn't made Muslims into boogymen/women, this wouldn't be an issue.

But I know where you're coming from as far as your concern. I also think any positiveness coming from Obama regarding the Muslim community would go worldwide favorably for Obama. But I have to trust he knows what he's doing.
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TeamJordan23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:44 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. thanks. I also have trust in him. It just sucks it has to be this way for both groups. nm
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thewiseguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:51 PM
Response to Original message
13. Aww Jeez, Not this shit again!
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blondeatlast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 06:51 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. This one eats a lot of fiber, apparently... nt
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msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 07:00 PM
Response to Original message
15. he thinks its ok for THEM to get married. wht's their beef? nt
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thewiseguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 07:01 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. Is this another one of your hit and run posts?
:)
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uponit7771 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 08:23 PM
Response to Original message
17. Dan Abrams guest today said a guy was a "Chinese MUSLIM terrorist", IMHO they should be screaming at
...the media and these stupid guest who get on TV and demonize Islam.

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JimGinPA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 08:30 PM
Response to Original message
18. Can You Point Me To The "Muslim's For McCain" Website?
I couldn't find it on Google.
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TeamJordan23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 09:17 PM
Response to Reply #18
27. so McCain should be our standard? nm
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 10:26 PM
Response to Reply #27
30. Deleted sub-thread
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Kaylee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 08:39 PM
Response to Original message
19. Oh boy...here we go again.
Tell me, how McCain working out for Arab-Americans. Obama's made a point not to single out any demographic for special treatment or attention....remember the crap some tried to make out of him missing the Black State of the Union. The media and a few "aggrieved" parties may try to make a stink out of these perceived slights, but most of us understand his reluctance to become beholden to any one group.
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 08:41 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. He's not and they know it but I can understand their genuine puzzlement. Or hurt.
Edited on Mon Jun-23-08 08:44 PM by Catherina
The Muslim vote went to Bush in 2000 because they're more conservative than us on certain issues. And they don't bond together over the Iraq or Palestinian issue any more than Catholics band together. A little more overy outreach would probably go far. No group likes to feel excluded or shunned.
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TeamJordan23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 09:16 PM
Response to Reply #19
25. So we should hold ourselves to the GOP standards? nm
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Kaylee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 10:31 PM
Response to Reply #25
31. How is this GOP standards...
He vows to do right by us as Americans...As a black American, I am fine with him not pandering to "my group". As long as he works to make America as a whole better for all of us, I've got no problem.

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Occam Bandage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 08:52 PM
Response to Original message
23. You seem to be pretty hardcore with the anti-Obama articles.
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TeamJordan23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 09:16 PM
Response to Reply #23
26. can you show me how many anti-Obama articles I have put up.
Edited on Mon Jun-23-08 09:22 PM by TeamJordan23
and compare it to the over 3,000+ pro-obama posts I have had. thanks.
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dailykoff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 09:21 PM
Response to Original message
28. I'm guessing the WSJ and NYT are basically humping a talking point
to tie Obama to Muslims. Slightly more reputable version of those e-mails. Expect to hear lots more about Obama's "ties to the Muslim community." :shrug:
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Robeson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 10:43 PM
Response to Reply #28
33. Nah, they'd never do that, would they?
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iconicgnom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 10:18 PM
Response to Original message
29. Yah, like the NYT cares a damn about "Muslims", or about how happy they are with McCain.
Because "the paper of record" isn't into propoganda. Never was, never will be. Believe it.
you are getting sleepy.
believe it
sleepy
believe it
good, now you're feeling relaxed, and happy
pleasant dreams.
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beachmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 10:33 PM
Response to Original message
32. Although this is worse, this reminds me of how Kerry had to pretend
he wasn't fluent in French, and refused to talk to French reporters. I think the campaign needs to think this through some more on how to handle the situation.
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Frank Booth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 11:33 PM
Response to Original message
34. Obama understands what it takes to become president in this country.
In a just world, Obama could stand up for an unjustly disenfranchised segment of America. In the real world, he has to distance himself from it if he hopes to become president.
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Douglas Carpenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 04:33 AM
Response to Reply #34
37. does ANYONE believe for that Obama can carry Michigan without the Arab-American and Muslim-American
community - turning out in a big way for him?

There are approximately 3.25 Arab-American citizens in the U.S. (70% if whom are Christian)

and approximately 7 million Muslim-Americans citizens in the U.S. of various ethnicities -(only 24% are Arabic)

http://www.allied-media.com/AM/

http://www.allied-media.com/Arab-American/Arab_demographics.htm

Thanks to George W. Bush most now vote overwhelmingly Democratic.

The largest single concentration of both is in the state of Michigan

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Douglas Carpenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-23-08 11:48 PM
Response to Original message
35. thank you for posting this
I don't believe Sen. Obama is a bigot in any way, shape or form. In fact he will probably be the first American president who did not come into office with bigoted attitudes toward Arab and Muslim people.

It is still rather disturbing that even on a liberal and progressive forum there are those who would rationalize if not legitimize a perceived need for a political leader to distance himself from millions and millions of decent and respectable American citizens.

If this is the case and it can even be said unapologetically on a liberal forum, America has truly evolved into a deeply racist and xenophobic society.
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chimpymustgo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 05:11 AM
Response to Reply #35
38. Thank you, Douglas Carpenter. How can we "progressives" rationalize and legitimize this behavior?
Especially at the same this candidate has rallied millions by promising hope and change. When does he come out of the hidey-hole - AFTER he wins the election?? I fear there may be more excuses then.

Stand up man, be brave. Go to churches and mosques and synagogues. Talk to us all. Embrace us all.
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ProgressiveMuslim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 05:20 AM
Response to Reply #35
39. It's a missed opportunity to educate and raise the bar
and it's really unfortunate that Obama hasn't had the courage to say and do the right thing.

I will vote for him to be sure, but I don't think I'll be sending more $ or volunteering time.
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Tillseptember Donating Member (11 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 12:05 AM
Response to Original message
36. It's unfortunate
That he goes to synagogues and churches but not to mosques, as reported in this article.
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genna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 07:29 AM
Response to Original message
40. Tell the truth and say it loud because the hate toward Muslims and Arab Americans is unconscionable
Edited on Tue Jun-24-08 07:30 AM by genna
It's as if we want to send them into camps like WW2 Japanese Americans until we can figure them out. Why should the acts of a small group of Muslims/Arab Americans define anyone who even looks like them or hold the same faith?

I think it sucks!


I think we as a society deem who is acceptable. AS soon as we decide we are tired of hating one group, we find a new group to persecute.


Since Obama is in a campaign to win by all means possible and he is trying to dodge the tag of this one group we hate so much :sarcasm:, he is perpetuating the sentiment while he is trying to avoid the consequences.

If TeamJordan makes this point over and over, I GIVE YOU PROPS. Tell the truth and shame the devil for engaging in devilish behavior. (The expression is tell the truth and shame the devil, but I'm adding devilish behavior because he is becoming the thing he avoids.) If you don't speak out and if I don't speak out, will Muslim/Arab Americans know that that hateful sentiment is not universally embraced?


I don't hate other Americans on the basis of race, sexual orientation, RELIGION, gender. It is a choice I'm making.
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high density Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 07:49 AM
Response to Original message
45. Why does the NY Times feel it is up to them to run Obama's campaign?
I'm tired of their "activist" reporting about him lately.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-24-08 08:57 AM
Response to Original message
47. An FYI:
Local Muslim leader met privately with Obama

This was May 18.

Sen. Obama is the only current presidential candidate known to have had a one-on-one meeting with an American Muslim leader during this election cycle. Many Muslims empathize with him as he is attacked for being "Muslim," which is erroneous since he is Christian. However, many were concerned when he recently told American Israel Public Affairs Committee conference attendees, "Jerusalem will remain the capital of Israel, and it must remain undivided." Current U.S. policy does not recognize Israel's claim to the city, the eastern part of which is occupied territory according to international law.

link


Where is the NYT's outrage?

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