Not Releasing Her Delegates & Insisting On Role Call At Convention Feeds Rumors She's Still Going

[KittyWampus]

on behind the scenes. It's guaranteed Republican operatives/trolls will be pushing this because Hillary did NOT release her delegates.

Her behavior is directly responsible for a lot of the animus between some of her voters and Obama.

As far as I'm concerned she deserves some credit for today's speech. SOME credit. However, she needed to make it clear she was releasing her delegates and refused to do so.

There is no need for her to force that role call vote. Doing so enables disruptors to feed the divide.

Clarification- this is about with things as they stand, not releasing delegates enables Freepers to dow divisive rumors.

[ksdemo]

1. There is a bit of a reason to let them stay for her.

She is trying to not piss off a massive throng of supporters.

[defendandprotect]

59. I would think the delegates would be ready to go ---

if not now, when?

A lot of the contention seemed to be from the heavy breathing money people behind her???

[datopbanana]

2. It's going to work out. She did good today.

[K Gardner]

3. Let's wait and see how things shake out over the summer. Nerves are still raw.. she's taken the

first big step and done it wonderfully. Time heals all wounds.

[Auntie Bush]

14. "Time heals all wounds." If somene doesn't keep picking the SCAB off.

[K Gardner]

21. Yeah, I know..:-)

[TahitiNut]

88. "Time wounds all heels." No matter how high and callous.

:dunce:

[AllentownJake]

4. All her supers are endorsing Obama

So she goes to the convention with a few delegates for the platform. Plus if she outright concedes she only has 60 days for her debt repayment vs 60 after the convention.

Not worried. The only people who will read anything into this is the HillaryClintonforum.net crowd.

[KittyWampus]

6. she didn't accept public funds, thus you are mistaken.

Some people think it also helps Clinton continue to raise funds to pay off her more than $20 million in debt. But the FEC’s Bob Biersack said it makes no difference. “The word suspend doesn’t have any campaign-finance implications,” he said. “Even if she said she’s withdrawing from the race, she could continue to raise money to pay off her debts no matter what.” If she had opted for public financing, then suspending vs. withdrawing would matter, since you can’t take matching funds for money raised after you drop out. But this year, only John Edwards chose to take public funds.

[klook]

70. Huh.

That's a new one on me. (That suspending her campaign has no financial implications.)

After pondering this some more, I see the logic of what several here and on other threads today have said: That 1) Obama has the votes to win the nomination at the convention, and 2) it's not a problem for Hillary to get some votes at the convention, as many runners-up have in previous election cycles.

It's going to be a great day when we have the first African-American nominee AND the first delegate votes cast for a woman nominee. Obama will be the nominee, but it's a great thing for women and all of us who want equality to see a woman get those votes at the convention.

So everybody please relax about this. HRC said today she endorses Obama and fully supports him as the Democratic nominee. For her to simultaneously run a stealth campaign to unseat him would be political suicide.

So let's chill and all work together to get Obama elected, OK?

Edited to correct faulty logic.

[defendandprotect]

60. OK . . . question of $$$, I can buy that . . .

[sufrommich]

5. .................

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gb6PHCVOU7s

[genna]

24. I will see your Ben Crosby and raise you a HEATWAVE - SUPER SOUL SISTER

HRC has the ability, for good or for evil, to reach people in profound ways...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VS7CWcCj-3M

[genna]

7. Crying shame before God, HRC is still negotiating for what she wants

The political operatives and elected officials DID NOT want to be used as bargaining chips, but many of her regular Jane voters don't mind as much.

How do you suggest she negotiates for a role for herself, Clintonites, the DLC, Bill and Chelsea Clinton, campaign debt, gender issues, or any other things she wants?

If she released her delegates, where would her power come from?

[KittyWampus]

12. her "power" would come from being an HONEST Team Player. From her behavior.

[genna]

42. Margaret Carlson, the Bloomsburg correspondent, said nothing good in politics comes from being nice

when she described Tuesday's lack of Team Player spirit Tuesday night.


Jimmy Carter IMHO is as nice and honest as he could be in the 1970s and was ate up by Washington politics. He was trying to be a fair and honest broker in MidEast peace in the 1980s and 1990s but he watched settlements expand and rocket launches increase. In 2000s, he took a position on the impolitic side and has been caricatured ever since.



HRC has no floor to fall through when it comes to her reputation. Her opponents already think the absolute worse of her. During this primary season, she picked a vast left wing assault.

Q: Where can she possibly go from here?

Watching her behavior, I think the only way she can push forward is playing hardball politics. Now that she was panned for that Tuesday speech, she has to mount a stealth campaign.

If you want to call her out, I am all for it.

Her rationale feels fairly straight forward: Most of you all hate me, the only thing you will respond to is a shear show of force.

[MonkeyFunk]

8. There's nothing wrong with her delegates casting their votes for her

this new demand that they nominate Obama by acclamation is just dumb. You guys are the least gracious winners I've ever seen in my life.

[PeaceNikki]

22. sigh

[defendandprotect]

62. You mean Hillary is going to put us thru the crap of having her delegates vote for HER . . . ????

[undeterred]

9. I don't trust her any more today than I did last week.

[ShortnFiery]

13. I don't trust her either - but her "assassination comments" make it UNLIKELY she'll even

be offered to run on Obama's tickets. Hell! Who would blame him? :shrug:

[undeterred]

25. I wouldn't blame him at all.

Steer clear of her.

[defendandprotect]

64. HRC being DLC should be sufficient to STOP anyone from trying to put her in VP slot .. right--????

[sufrommich]

66. I think you'll be surprised when the

vast majority of DLCers get behind Obama.I doubt he'll turn them away.

[defendandprotect]

68. Why turn them away . . . what you want to do is turn them off ---

Are you supporting a corporate-wing of the Democratic party should have sway?

[sufrommich]

69. Huh? I'm not supporting any one group of the Democrats

over any other.I'm saying many of the DLC members already support him and will continue to do so. Barack Obama will not push them away,rather he'll hold together the WHOLE democratic party,he's an adult,that's what adults do.

[defendandprotect]

85. Again, it's not the money --- it's the ideology -- do you want a corporate Democratic Party????

Do you want to move the party to the right---?????

[defendandprotect]

63. -ditto --

[rateyes]

10. Roll call.

I enjoy them...going state by state is pretty cool. There's a lot that will switch, anyway.

[KittyWampus]

18. yes, but the fact remains her insistence on keeping delegates feeds rumors that WILL flourish

amongst some of her supporters.

You KNOW Freepers will run with it.

[sufrommich]

23. Bullshit,it will be used by DUers who can't let go

of their hate.The rest of the country will ignore it as the boring political minutia that it is. Stop this already.

[KittyWampus]

31. I don't hate Hillary. I am, however familiar with how Republicans & Freepers operate

[onenote]

38. if you are worried about how repubs will use this, here is your response

just point out to them that John McCain didn't release his delegates in 2000 until the eve of the convention.

[MonkeyFunk]

33. Yup

I can already think of at least 10 people here who will push this invented story between now and August.

They're not interested in actually winning in November - they just want to destroy Clinton. There was a time when such people found a home on FreeRepublic.

[sufrommich]

36. I've said beforwe,we'll find out soon how many

were just here to bash a Democrat.

[Meshuga]

11. I disagree

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x6316746

[suston96]

15. Have you bothered to check the convention rules? There has to be a vote....

...with over 4000 delegates seated how on earth can the nomination be finalized? Count hands?

Or do you beieve the AP or CNN numbers should be used to proclaim the nominee?

[QC]

16. Have you ever watched a convention before? They *ALWAYS* do a roll call.

It's a standard part of the convention. In fact, it's one of the high points. The head of each state delegation announces that he has come from _____, which produces more cottage cheese or NLF quarterbacks or clementines or whatever than any state in the union, to give their votes to ___. Everyone claps. Sometimes states even swap places so that the nominee's home state can be the one to put him over the top.

There is enough in the world to be outraged over without going out looking for more.

[melody]

26. I miss all the silly hats and big declarations during the roll call

The silly hat quotient has gone way down.

[QC]

28. Yes, the silly hats are one of the best things.

And I like how each state in number one in something.

[Cha]

17. We should bookmark this thread and

see if hilary's turned over a new leaf or not.

She'll be earning my trust..I'm not giving it to her based on today's rousing concession speech where she so graciously conceded to the winner, Barack Obama.

[KittyWampus]

20. Actually, this is more about how Freepers will use this against both Obama AND Hillary

[QC]

27. Maybe some freepers have actually watched conventions before

and thus know that there is always a roll call.

[MonkeyFunk]

50. Well, freepers

and their useful tools here on DU.

[bluestateguy]

19. Just as we gave HIllary some space, we need to give her delegates some space

Many will flip to Obama on their own.

All in good time.

[seaglass]

29. So you are spreading the rumor here - what does that mean? n/t

[yourguide]

30. Eh, this was the last batch of talking points issued today by HRC & Co

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0608/The_last_talking_points.html


Talking Points: SUSPENDING THE CAMPAIGN

* Today, Hillary Clinton wholeheartedly and enthusiastically endorsed Senator Barack Obama for President and urged the 18 million Americans who voted for her to support him and the Democratic Party in order to finish what we started.

* She outlined the urgent problems our nation faces and the reason she ran for president in the first place: to put a Democrat in the White House and get this country back on track.

* Women across this country watched Hillary Clinton become the first woman to win primary state victories in our nation’s history – this was a ground breaking campaign that has sent a message to our little girls that they can be anything they want to be.

* She entered this race to help people solve their problems and live their dreams and reiterated her commitment to keep fighting for people who have felt invisible for so long. Together, Democrats will unite to fix this economy, provide universal healthcare and fight for deep and meaningful equality in America.

* Hillary Clinton will remain fighting and standing strong for our values and priorities. That includes doing everything she can to unify the party, defeat John McCain and elect Barack Obama the next President of the United States.


Q and A

Q: Why is she suspending her campaign and not ending it?

* Suspension is a technical term -- Like then Gov. Dean and Sen. Bradley, Senator Clinton is suspending her campaign, because supporters who have worked so hard for this campaign deserve a chance to go to the convention.

* The only Presidential candidate she will be promoting and supporting is Barack Obama.


Q: What specific instructions is she giving to superdelegates and her delegates?

* She is encouraging and in fact urging all of her supporters across the country to get behind Senator Obama and vote for him over John McCain.


Q: Will she campaign for Barack Obama?

* Absolutely – she will do whatever she is asked to do to bring this party together and elect Barack Obama president

[maddezmom]

57. thanks for posting that, I hope more people read it

:hi:

[yourguide]

61. You got it.

Considering how forceful her endorsement was today I didnt get the sense she is itching for a floor fight. Just wanted to set the record straight.

[Warren Stupidity]

32. Wow! A mountain from a molehill!

Nice.

[roseBudd]

34. Unfortunaterly I just got back from blog.hillaryclinton.com/

http://blog.hillaryclinton.com/blog/main/2008/06/07/162034

these posters who are predominantly female and from what I gleaned formerly apolitical are insane with infatuation.

WE REMAIN YOUR LOYAL SUPPORTERS AND IF YOU DECIDE TO RUN FOR VICE PRESIDENT WE WILL VOTE FOR YOU AND THE REST OF THE DEMOCRAT LEADERS BUT WE WILL LEAVE A BLANK SPOT IN THE PRESIDENT BOX.

WE MUST HAVE FULL CONTROL OF THE HOUSE AND SENATE. OUR WAY OF PROTEST WILL BE A DEMOCRAT VICE PRESIDENT, A DEMOCRAT HOUSE AND SENATE AND IF THERE IS NOT ENOUGH VOTES FROM THE OBAMA CAMP FOR BO THEN FOR THE FIRST TIME IN HISTORY WE WILL HAVE A REPUBLICAN PRESIDENT AND A DEMOCRAT FEMALE PRESIDENT (HILLARY).

18 MILLION STRONG WE HAVE A LOT OF WORK TO DO. WE MUST REFORM OUR DEMOCRATIC PARTY AND GET RID OF THE CAUCUS SYSTEM THAT CAUSED SO MUCH DIVISION !!!!!!

WE WILL BE PATIENT AND WAIT UNTIL AUGUST WITH HOPE THAT OUR CHOSEN LEADER IS NOMINATED FOR PRESIDENT. IF HILLARY CHOOSES TO BE VICE PRESIDENT WE WILL GET HER ELECTED.

WE COULD END UP WITH A DEMOCRAT VICE PRESIDENT (HILLARY) AND MCCAIN AS PRESIDENT. BUT IF WE HAVE CONTROL OF THE HOUSE AND SENATE THEN MCCAIN WILL HAVE TO BEHAVE LIKE A HILL DEMOCRAT.

WE DO NOT WANT THE REPUBLICAN AGENDA BUT WITH SOLE CONTROL OF THE HOUSE, SENATE AND VICE PRESIDENT POSITIONS MCCAIN WILL HAVE TO LET HIS LIBERAL SIDE FINALLY COME OUT OF THE CLOSET !!!!!!

[beac]

51. A lot of suspicious use of "Democrat" as an adjective, so I'm going to

guess that those posts are by Freepers posing as Hillites.

However, this post is just straight-up ignorant:

"WE COULD END UP WITH A DEMOCRAT VICE PRESIDENT (HILLARY) AND MCCAIN AS PRESIDENT.

Whaaa? Has this person ever actually voted?

[roseBudd]

77. That is what I am saying, there is no context, and most of the posts are devoid of any thoughts

other than Hillary worship.

Right VP Hillary & POTUS McCain.

They say she attracts voter with no college

[autorank]

55. Value added reporting

:toast:

[onenote]

35. You have no knowledge of history, do you?

It would be unusual for Clinton to release her delegates at this point. In 2000, Bill Bradley didn't release his delegates until the day before the convention and there was a roll call in which 40 plus votes were cast for Kucinich. In 1992, there was a roll call and jerry brown and paul tsongas garnered nearly 900 votes between them. And in 1988, Jesse Jackson didn't release his delegates and he picked up nearly 30 percent of the votes (over 1200 delegates) in the roll call.

So explain to me -- an Obama supporter -- why I should be demanding HRC do what Jesse Jackson, Jerry Brown and others didn't do?

[Laura PourMeADrink]

37. Thank God - at least someone here is astute ! All that happened

is that she took her campaign underground.

[onenote]

41. no, someone here is very confused. Actually, that would be you

The OP, while wrong, at least isn't claiming that HRC took her campaign 'underground' -- the OPs complaint is that the repubs will claim that is what is happening.

Kinda puts you in some funny company, doesn't it?

[Laura PourMeADrink]

48. if I'm confused you are naive to think that was a concession/endorsement.

But before you finally figure it out - it will be too late.

[sufrommich]

52. Let go of the hate. nt

[DemocratSinceBirth]

56. She Can't ...She Still Has A Year's Supply Of This

[onenote]

53. yes you are confused and no I am not naive. It was a very strong endorsement

and is being widely discussed as such in the media.

Sorry if this whole unity thing is so bothersome for you.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

78. are you kidding? There's nothing I want more - except Hillary

is for Hillary - always has been - always will be. And every single thing she and Bill do is
calculated! How soon all of you forget ! What's amazing is how everyone is now
falling for it ! If you want to know what the word "endorsement" means there are many,
many, stunning examples from all the SDs who endorsed him already- just go to democonwatch ! She, on the other hand spent 99% of the time patting herself on the back and 1% saying anything about him. The only good thing that I can say is that since so many believed her - I guess that has some value in itself.

She didn't however, sway anyone. Most of her fans will say, oh how nice, I was going to
vote for Obama anyway.

She didn't do what Obama needed the most - for her to come right out and say - he's definitely
capable and will make a wonderful president. That he is better than McCain (hmmmm just think abo8ut that? HELLO ) - she's not going to say that - because now - no matter waht anyone says - she wants McCain to win. She needed to tell the people that she turned against Obama - WHY to turn back - not just to turn back.

[Zynx]

49. If you are a conspiratorial nut, then yes.

[slinkerwink]

39. she can't officially end her campaign---it's the debt, hence the suspension

[onenote]

43. that appears not to be the case because she didn't take matching funds

Of course, in the past, even candidates that did take matching funds didn't typically release their delegates until the eve of the convention, if then. Both Bradley and McCain waited until the day of their respective conventions to release their delegates. In 1988, Jesse Jackson got over 1200 votes at the convention and in 1992, six candidates got over 900 votes, including Jerry Brown with around 600.

I'm an Obama supporter, have been for awhile, and I see no reason to hold HRC to a different standard than past candidates, including Jesse Jackson.

[Igel]

79. She doesn't want to screw over her delegates.

If she cedes them, she's not ceding their bodies so they can vote for Obama; she's ceding their slots, and they'd probably be filled with different bodies--definitely in states that haven't settled on their final slates of delegates yet.

Her supporters, or at least some of them, wouldn't get to go to the convention; Obama's supporters would.

[slinkerwink]

40. she can't officially end her campaign---it's the debt, hence the suspension

[BooScout]

44. There's ALWAYS a Roll Call vote....

She isn't forcing anything.

[union_maid]

45. She said Barack Obama

Good enough for me. She doesn't need to release her delegates. The movement of the elected superdelegates make a convention challenge impossible. Let's accept this for what she says it is. It doesn't hurt us any and it might help a lot.

[sfam]

46. Give it a rest. Hillary made her intentions VERY clear...

BTW, Edwards only very recently released his delegates. There is no need for Hillary to do this now, nor do we need her to state this.

[Trajan]

47. More silly shit ....

In the season of shitty silliness ....

That animosity exists within those who cultivate and nurture it ...

It is obvious that it exists right here ... Your fears are unfounded, and they lead to a rather unbecoming mien for you ....

Hillary was a diligent candidate .... She is no scary monster ....

One might well ask to define the difference between freepers who sow divisive rumors and those here who sow divisive rumors ... I see very little essential difference ....

[defendandprotect]

65. I also don't like the idea that someone who is part of DLC leadership . . .

gets a large role in aiding the Obama campaign?

Or speaking for it --- !!

[autorank]

54. And it should! k*r

"What does Hillary want?" she asked. Well, let's see ....

[tandot]

58. "...enables Freepers to dow divisive rumors" ... we don't need freepers

some DUers (including this OP) are taking care of that quite nicely.

I am ready to throw my full support behind Obama. Some of the most ardent Clinton supporters have already announced that they are fully behind Obama.

Why some of you guys need to spew more divisive BS I just don't understand. Is the hate for her so great that you just can't let go?

[Hippo_Tron]

67. McGramps didn't release his delegates until just before the convention in 2000

Obama has the magic number and will be the nominee. I don't see what everybody is worried about.

[romana]

71. These kinds of threads

These kinds of threads prove to me more than anything else that we have a bunch of kids who know NOTHING about politics, and who have never bothered watching a national political convention. It is standard procedure for the loser to keep their delegates. It gives them leverage to help shape the platform. Edwards suspended and kept his delegates, as have other people in the past. Senator Clinton has a significant number of delegates, but not enough to win the nomination. She will keep those delegates as a negotiating tool.

Some of you seriously need to get over the Clinton hatred, and use that energy for something good. It's become a cottage industry for some of you, and I'm convinced some of you will never be satisfied, regardless of what she does. It reminds me of the bad old days when President Bill Clinton couldn't take a crap without a million Freeper talking heads criticizing it as the worst crap ever taken in the history of craps. Seriously, stop for a second and listen to yourselves. You sound like Republicans.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

72. What You Said And Welcome To DU

~

[sufrommich]

74. Wow! That was great and welcome to DU. nt

[romana]

75. :)

I've been here for awhile now, but thanks for the welcome all the same. I don't post often, but I guess it might be safe to start posting a bit more, now. :D

[Number23]

84. Great Caesar's Ghost!

You've been here since 2005 and only have 35 posts??! You, my friend, are a true Goddess of Restraint and an inspiration!

[romana]

86. I know!

Sometimes I look at my post count and think "That can't be mine! What about the time I posted THAT! And THAT! And THAT!" Then I remember that I only posted in my head, but not actually here.

I tried very hard to stay above the fray in GDP. I supported Clinton in the primaries, and GD:P hasn't been very friendly toward Clinton supporters for awhile now. I didn't feel the need to add to the bickering unless I thought I had something really worth saying.

[Number23]

87. LOL

Then I remember that I only posted in my head, but not actually here.

Goodness, doesn't everyone do that??!

I didn't feel the need to add to the bickering unless I thought I had something really worth saying.

It is truly, TRULY sad that your sentiment is shared by so few! :rofl:

It's been a pleasure meeting you and I do hope you'll post more often. I was ecstatic about both candidates too but am now thrilled to be supporting Obama. You will henceforth be called (by me, at least) Goddess Romana, Mistress of Moderation. Don't get that post count too high or you'll spoil your title!

:hi:

[Number23]

82. Gotcha

It is standard procedure for the loser to keep their delegates.

If this is true, it certainly clears up a few things for me. And I guess that also explains why she said she was suspending her campaign, and not ending it? Because if she ends her campaign, she loses her delegates, right? Makes sense now. Thanks a bushel.

[NashVegas]

73. I Can't Imagine What You're So Afraid Of

[progetto]

76. Cut her some slack, she can't flop after today's speech.

Only the crazies at 44 and HCF are calling for her to do battle at the convention. She wants and deserves some recognition. When you get half the votes, it's not unreasonable.

[Number23]

80. Okay

So, it IS widely known that she is only suspending her campaign and not officially ending it. I was wondering because all of the threads I've been reading today have been "yay Hillary!" as if she's conceded but, thanks to this thread, now I realize that it is common knowledge that she is not dropping out. Clears a few things up, but now I'm confused as hell as to why so many people are saying "yay Hillary!" all over DU today.

She even said in her speech that she was only suspending her campaign and not ending it. "Today, as I suspend my campaign, I congratulate him on the victory he has won and the extraordinary race he has run. I endorse him and throw my full support behind him. And I ask all of you to join me in working as hard for Barack Obama as you have for me."

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/us_elections/article4087902.ece

Is it possible to endorse someone without conceding? But perhaps this is all in the spirit of Dem unity and trying to put all of the ugliness of the primary in the past. If that's the case, then I understand all of the "Hooray for Hillary!" threads. If that's NOT the case, then I'm confused all over again.

[blues90]

81. I didn't think her speech today was any different

Than anyone of her speeches, the only difference is this time she was ending her run and this is all many people wanted to her.

Now that they have what they wanted then why not just STFU and quit reading into things.

Now the new spin is we will all heal the party and all be one huge happy hypo-critic family and go after McCain.

As always the case, say it enough times and people will believe it.

Doesn't matter that we live in a country so screwed up that it will take decades to even begin to turn it around. Doesn't matter who got left out and lost everything during this last 8 years or wars and lies and crimes.

Doesn't matter that some freak may attack Iran.

Doesn't matter most jobs are crap and many are gone forever.

All that seems to matter is that there is some new hope, no lets just move forward as a bull dozer and let it all get buried and go away.

Doesn't matter that all the letters and emails to all the reps meant not one damn thing. The protests did not mean a thing either.

Some people here may think i'm a spoiler or bitter or angry or hateful.

What I am is sick and tired of all the bull and the lies and the denial.

[CarbonDate]

83. I don't see the problem here.

As long as they keep their back room dealings in the back room and maintain a united front, that's all that matters as far as the election is concerned. Let the freepers spin their rumors. In the end, it won't help them.