HRC has no "18 million person army". The vast majority of her voters are Democrats first

[DemsUnited]

and not bargaining chips as long-time HRC supporter, Hilary Rosen, so eloquently puts it in her must read HuffPost piece at http://www.huffingtonpost.com/hilary-rosen/i-am-not-a-bargaining-chi_b_105133.html

HRC is flexing her muscles now because she knows that whatever leverage she has (or thinks she has) will quickly evaporate in the days ahead and disappear totally within weeks.

More Rahm Emmanuels will declare for Obama. More super Ds will switch out of her column. More Hilary Rosens will write unity essays. More Paul Begalas will pen respectful but definitive obituaries for their former candidate. And new polls will show Obama consolidating Hilary supporters and running strong against John McCain.

We will have almost 12 weeks of intense, expensive, and heavily media covered general election fighting between Obama and McCain. Top Democrats will publicly and strongly back Obama every step of the way. If HRC believes that after that kind of time and investment in Obama as the Democratic candidate, she is going to pull out a coup at the convention, then she really is narcissistic and delusional.

Hopefully she is not, and will soon do the right thing. If she doesn't, she is going to watch those who voted for her quickly distance themselves. And many of even her strongest supporters will not be that far behind.

[NJmaverick]

1. When has she ever let the truth stand in her way?

Still she has roughly 4 million fanatical supporters that are angry and irrational over the fact that Hillary will not be the first female president.

[cliffordu]

2. Are we even sure it's 4 million? Maybe 400,000??

[NJmaverick]

8. Well beyond the rhetoric here at DU, I have heard at least 2 formerly

Democratic women say they would never vote Obama. If you figure 80% are good dems and 20% are fanatics, that works out to roughly 4 million.

[Willo]

16. If you figure 36 million votes between them

then 7.2 million tops. So 4-7 million possible fanatics. I doubt it but for the record let's work with those numbers.
Obama starts with 28.8 Dems

[hfojvt]

24. doesn't "never" include an Obama/Clinton ticket?

Isn't Hillary still kinda urging her supporters to feel this way?

Why aren't these people more prepared? Hillary has been a long shot since Wisconsin, and especially Indiana. Why do they act like defeat has been snatched from the jaws of victory and they are heartbroken? The defeat has been written on the wall for months.

[americanstranger]

14. CNN included the question in their SD/MT exit polling last night.

As best as i can remember, roughly 60% of Clinton voters in both states said they would vote for Obama. The numbers for those who wouldn't were (again, best I can remember) 26 or 27% in SD and 18 or 19% in MT.

And this was right at the height of the supposed 'outrage' that the Clinton hardcore is feeling.

Boil that down to half, and it looks like the numbers there are 9% in MT and 14% in SD.

I think Obama can whittle those numbers down pretty easily once he's recognized as the Dem nominee. And remember that when he starts campaigning, his numbers go up.

Bottom line - the 'poutrage' crowd is probably nowhere near as large as they may think they are.

- as

[DemsUnited]

5. Totally agree about a good number of fanatical supporters. And they called Obama people zealots!

Some of the most hardened HRC supporters will be brought back into the fold given time and coverage of Obama v. McCain instead of Obama v. Clinton. Some will not and that's a shame but probably unavoidable.

[DJ13]

3. I'll concede she has 1 million (tops) diehard sheep who will follow her

But no more than that, and if Obama caved into her demand for the VP slot he would LOSE far more independents than that in the GE.

[ShortnFiery]

4. Well, certified megalomaniacs like HRC and Bill Clinton consider "the world" is ALL ABOUT THEM. N/T

[EFerrari]

22. It was so weird last night when she said she didn't want her supporters

to be invisible -- as if they'd disappear, somehow, when she conceded.

There's no better illustration of narcissism than holding the belief that other people don't exist without you. :wow:

[Independent-Voter]

6. If she had 18 million "supporters", why is she 20+ MILLION in debt?

[DemsUnited]

10. Excellent point. The fact that those who voted for her ARE NOT financially supporting

her probably proves more than anything that a large number of them have moved on.

[bvar22]

21. "Operation Chaos" Hillary voters aren't going to send her money.

nor will they be voting Democratic in November.

[Catherina]

7. I agree. It's tpast ime for her to gracefully exit because people won't be kind

if she doesn't now.

[RememberWellstone]

9. 18 milion did not vote Obama

That is a fact.

[NatBurner]

12. they didn't vote for grampy either

i'm just sayin'

[DemsUnited]

13. No they did not, and I gladly give you that fact. But of the 18 million, many WILL vote for Obama

when it is his name and John McCains on the ballot.

Because they are Democrats first and foremost.

And that will likely be proven as fact on November 2.

[SoonerPride]

20. No, 19 million voted for Obama.

Thanks fort playing.

Game over.

[papau]

11. HuffPost as campaign adviser - yep - I like it - shows judgment - should incl DU Obama fan posters

[DemsUnited]

15. Hilary Rosen is a high profile, long time, and vocal supporter of HRC. She just happened to

post her piece on Huffington Post. I couldn't tell you why, any more than I can tell you why Paul Begala, another long time and strong HRC supporter also posts on Huffington Post.

[Willo]

17. Here's a bit from Kos on the popular vote

Hillary Clinton Did NOT Win the Popular Vote - Media Needs to Point This Out
by cscmm

Wed Jun 04, 2008 at 06:15:40 AM PDT
I would like to point out that Hillary Clinton did NOT win the popular vote during the Democratic race for a presidential nominee – according to RealPolitics.com.

Barack Obama without IA, NV, ME, WA caucuses and without Michigan, ended up with 33,916 more votes than Hillary Clinton.

Barack Obama with IA, NV, ME, WA caucuses and without Michigan, ended up with 144,138 more votes than Hillary Clinton.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/6/4/9654/78622/683/529184

[Vinca]

23. I'm really annoyed the MSM has picked up this popular vote

majority thing as if it was gospel. Since 4 caucus states don't have a popular vote and none were cast in Michigan for Obama, I'm at a loss about how she figures she's ahead.

[Willo]

25. And playing up her lies for the sake of viewers

is partly responsible for enabling the angry delusions that remain.

[Mme. Defarge]

18. Keep in mind that

quite a few of those so-called bargaining chips are Republicans who participated in Operation Chaos, and have absolutely no intention of voting for any Democratic candidate in the general election.

[DemsUnited]

19. Yup, the more I think about it, the smaller the number of "chips" seems to be.

As you point out, a lot of those who voted for HRC would NEVER vote for her in the general.

As an upstream poster points out, if there really were 18 million diehard supporters, they'd have been putting their money where there vote was. But HRC is 20 million in debt.

And as HRC supporter Hilary Rosen writes, she's a democrat first and will support Obama now that he's the nominee.

So the actual number of voters that HRC can "bring to the table" is no where near 18 million, and will continue to shrink over time.

[Forkboy]

26. I couldn't be less concerned about those few dead enders that will be left in November.

In their desperation to soothe their ego and be important they're actually accomplishing just the opposite and making themselves less than a footnote in this election. They'll be remembered as a small, sad group of selfish children who couldn't see the forest for the trees, and those that do remember them will do so in mocking terms.