A major fallacy no one has spoken of--Hillary Clinton does NOT have 18 Million(?) behind her.

[Bicoastal]

Think about it. That would assume that all of the people who voted for her way back in January and February STILL feel the same way about her.

It's pretty clear that's not the case. According to most polls, California is now firmly in Obama's camp, as is New Jersey--an awful lot of people, including my own Mother, have changed their support since then.

I'm simply guessing that the true number of Hillary-or-nobody people is much, much smaller than the people who actually voted for her over the course of five months--but of course, the media is content to take her bluff at her word.

[Lakerstan]

1. It also assumes that people that voted for her in the primary would not vote for Obama in the GE

[PoliticalAmazon]

15. It also doesn't account for states where GOPers could vote in the primary....

where GOPers, if given the option of McCain, would vote for McCain.

And my I say that, according to Harry Reid, Obama swept the rural areas of Nevada, largely made of white working-class or white-retirees.

[woolldog]

2. Also it doesn't take into account all the Rush Limbaugh voters.

[papapi]

3. The Hillary-or-nobodys were all in D.C. over the weekend making an ass of themselves...

...on national television.

[cliffordu]

8. yeah, the fearless 250....

[MrModerate]

4. How about "millions and millions" . . . will that do it for you?

Any way you look at it, she's got substantial support and has commanded nearly half of the primary vote. Trying to pretend she has inconsequential support now that Obama's presumptively locked is a recipe for disunion.

And failure in November.

[Bicoastal]

12. Yes, but no evidence says that ALL those people are diehards. Only a handful.

The rest will vote for the Democratic Nominee whether she's on the ticket or not.

[MrModerate]

19. I don't think it's a handful, but yes, I think most Clinton supporters . . .

Will enthusiastically vote for Obama.

[juno jones]

18. There are no 'millions' of suffering Clintonites out there

Not to pry but are you registered to vote in the US?

I live here and there aren't any 'millions and millions' out there for Hillary. Hell, not even one pathetic bumpersticker in my neck of the woods.

Lots of Americans don't vote in the primaries. There will be plenty to vote for Obama that didn't vote back in the spring. Especially in my state where the popular primary vote means absolutely *zero* in terms of delegates. I am an independant so I do not caucus. Myself and my family and most of my co-workers are all solidly behind Obama. None of us participated in primaries. Our votes have not been counted yet. But I think they will begin to offset any 'sore loser' voters in November.



250 petulant followers do not translate into millions.

[MrModerate]

21. While I haven't been in the States for about 7 months now . . .

I can read the returns on the Internets and in the overseas papers. Millions and millions of people willingly, even enthusiastically voted for Clinton, under the impression that she would make the best candidate and the best president.

While many new primary/caucus voters probably trended heavily to Obama (it's one of the reasons he's won, IMO), some of the new voters were also excited by the prospect of a woman president and Hillary specifically.

Anyway, its a looooong way from "250 petulant followers." (Presuming, of course, that among Obama's winning millions, there are less than 250 who could be defined as "petulant." Having breezed by GD-P a fair number of times lately, I'd dispute that.)

And yes, I'm registered to vote in the US. Despite having lived less than half of the last 25 years in the US, I've never missed a federal election (whether my non-military absentee ballot always got counted is another matter entirely.)

[juno jones]

24. Thank you for your reply.

Sorry if I came off antagonistic. I didn't really mean to. I've just been a little irrtated by some unhelpful comments by people who who don't have to live with the results of the descisions being made here. I apologize and look forward to voting with you in the fall.

I personally have seen little or no support of Hillary on the scale that has been played up by her campaign. There may be more than 250 hard-core out there, I admit. However I can see a groundswell of potential voters that will come out for Obama. And I also see many of the Clinton voters having some buyer's remorse. Just my view from this particular patch of ground...

[ribrepin]

23. Now that you mention it, I've seen some Obama bumperstickers

but no Hillarys...good point.

[Carolina]

26. but no evidence says all those people are assholes

like the Hillary harpies who showed up in DC last Saturday. Most are Democrats -- first and foremost.

Besides, HRC doesn't own those who voted for her in the primaries since many now have buyer's remorse.

[sandnsea]

5. A lot of people voted for her

I have absolutely no more idea why people voted for her than for Bush, especially poor people. But they did. A lot of them. No point in really arguing that.

[Bicoastal]

6. They voted for Bush in a 24 hour period. In the case of Clinton AND Obama...

...we're talking about a five MONTH period. Not really comparable. But everyone is assuming that the Democratic primaries all took place "overnight," as it were.

[smiley_glad_hands]

7. Don't forget about michigan and the caucuses. eom

[MarjorieG]

9. May have voted for brand name ID. Pundit hand-wringing about Obama admitted he was unknown

Still rankled about the bogus popular vote she keeps pushing, because it puts an asterisk by Obama.

[NYC_SKP]

10. I have noticed difficulty with telling the truth by some involved in this race.

I'm not naming names, I'm just saying that there seems to have been a pattern.

[LordJFT]

11. something was off with her math

she claimed Obama had 16 million and there's no way she had 2 million more even with her way of counting it

[PoliticalAmazon]

13. Many people who voted in Calif. for her won't vote for her again. n/t

[yodermon]

14. Whty do you think they were fighting to get the primaries moved UP

meaning into January?
Earlier the primaries, less time Obama (& others) had to campaign, and HRC woulda been guaranteed a win on name recognition.

[juno jones]

16. And a lot of people didn't vote in the primaries

But I know there's gonna be about half dozen happy restaurant employees at my work tomorrow, and they will be voting Obama in the general.

[bhikkhu]

17. a lot of people vote for people who don't win primaries.

a lot of people vote for people who don't win GE's. You don't see Ross Perot or Nader still parading their voters around...a fair point is made that many of Hillary's voters moved on long ago, looking at the CA and NY polls, and the majority of them are more than pleased to vote for the Democratic nominee.

Nothing else nice to say...the sideshow needs to close up for the season.

[The Magistrate]

20. Democrats, Sir, Will Certainly Unite Behind The Party's Nominee

The changing figures you cite demonstrate that, as the change tracks the rise of Sen. Obama to status of likely winner in the tjme since those earlier primaries.

[ribrepin]

22. If she has so many rabid supporters, why aren't they donating?

It's pretty sad that she is up there begging people to visit her website (hoping for a donation).

[TexasObserver]

25. If she can't talk them into sending her $2 each, does she really have any influence?!

She's $30 million in debt. If those 18 million really care that much what she says, you'd think they'd send her $2 each to retire her debt.

She can't raise $18 mil, and she damn sure can't deliver 18 mil votes.

[TexasObserver]

27. If she had 18 million followers she wouldn't have 30 million in debt

[Starbucks Anarchist]

28. Her name recognition helped early on, too.

Obviously, it's not the only reason she did well in those states, but it was definitely a factor.