Hillary Clinton is not a monster

[doyourealize1]

Before this election, she fought an absolutely noble battle for universal health care, children's healthcare, and human rights in China.

Regardless of the outcome of the primary and the stubbornness in exiting the primary, she has my respect what she has done in the past. Her vote on the Iraq-War Resolution was a blemish on an otherwise solidly Democratic career.

She is a good Democrat, and not a Neo-conservative. She was not a monster then, and she certainly will not be after she returns to her Senate seat.

The measure on which to judge a politician, in my opinion, is the effect that he or she has had on the voters rather than on the campaign trail. Her campaign style may be ugly, but in my opinion it does not take away from the fact that she has generally shown in the past to be a champion of women's rights and for universal healthcare.

This is the end of a positive thread.

[rug]

1. 3 - 2 - 1 for the first asshole.

[AllentownJake]

3. Do I get a prize?

[Bucky]

13. Yes, you get a prize. Unfortunately that prize will be...

... coming out of that "first asshole". 3... 2... 1...

[Blue-Jay]

53. Got it in 1!

[AllentownJake]

2. Nope

She's a monster

[rug]

5. Hi Jake!

:hi:

[AllentownJake]

10. Hi Rug

:hi:

I'm eating pudding what you up to?

[rug]

12. I just bought some diapers for a neighbor.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

58. Planning on takeout?

:D

[JVS]

4. as far as I know

[rug]

7. Hi JVS!

:hi:

[WeDidIt]

At this point, I'll give her the benefit of the doubt

After June 4, not so much.

[Tommy_Carcetti]

6. Most sane people know this.

Including most Obama supporters.

There are a select few who are either instigators or simply are so delirious by the growing mob mentality on board that unfortunately tend to dominate the conversation.

[doyourealize1]

11. Thanks n/t

[Tyler Durden]

22. So don't let ME be the only REC.

[frickaline]

39. definitely agree (nt)

[marylanddem]

8. She just plays one on the TV?

[Cheap_Trick]

32. grrrr

you stole my response!

[tekisui]

9. I agree, but that window is closing.

Let's talk again, when we see how she reacts to the RBC ruling. If it is with an appeal or a lawsuit, you will be on your own, because she will have then shown her true colors. If she accepts the ruling, and bows out, no monster.

[NC_Nurse]

14. No, she's a sore loser.

[beac]

61. And a monsterously sore loser, at that. n/t

[RaleighNCDUer]

15. She never fought for universal healthcare.

She fought for universal health insurance, which is a whole nother critter.

And she's not a monster. She's a DLCer, which translates to, she is not a Democrat. She's not a neo-con, she's a neo-lib who believes in American exceptionalism and economic imperialism.

And she's going to have to fight to hang onto her senate seat, now that we all know who she really is.

[AtomicKitten]

16. Epic fail.

She failed at HC, worked less than a year a thousand years ago on children's issues, and gave a speech in China on women's rights.

Her presidential campaign has been littered with invocation of racism and assassination and a curriculum vitae consisting of mostly fluff and amphibian DNA punctuated with sniveling and a frantic effort to constantly move the goalposts.

She is an embarrassment to the Democratic Party.

[crankychatter]

17. Her health care scam as First Lady was precisely that, and still is

the mandatory feature gives big insurance industries a monopoly

as first lady she ruled out single payer out of hand... the penalties for "non-compliance" were draconian

the mandatory feature also permanently precludes true single payer giving industry fat cats the justification of "universality" to put it off interminably

her IWR, Kyle-Lieberman, Pro-cluster bomb and pro-land mine votes cancel out her "china" efforts exponentially

sorry

think anything you like of her... when she's doing the right thing... I'll unload... until then... no quarter asked, no quarter given

[PoliticalAmazon]

29. It was her ham-fisted, "I'm-entitled-to-have-my-way" approach that killed it. n/t

[BlooInBloo]

18. (shrug) Talking about what she was *before* the election isn't evidence...

for your claim about what she is *now*.

[PoliticalAmazon]

34. Horseshit. The only thing we have to judge how she is acting now and...

..anticipate how she will act in the future is her past and present actions. In politics, promises are cheap, especially from Clinton, who has proven herself to be a consumate liar.

As my Midwestern mother liked to say, "A skunk doesn't change its stripes overnight." We cannot expect anything better from Hillary than how she has acted in the past and present.

[BlooInBloo]

40. (shrug) I wouldn't have called her a monster before the election. I wouldn't argue against it now...

I suspect we differ mostly only terminologically.

[LSK]

19. can you PLEASE explain her IWR vote and Kyl/Liebermann vote?????

[Lerkfish]

20. you shall know a tree by its fruits.

sorry to get all biblical on ya, But ugly is as ugly does.

[crankychatter]

21. Samantha Power for Ambassador to the U.N. - nt

.

[Connie_Corleone]

23. She is an habitual liar and a delusional monster.

[Erin Elizabeth]

24. A monster? Like this?

I see no resemblance. She's not blue and isn't covered with fur. She might like cookies a lot, but no one likes cookies as much as he does. Plus he has those wobbly bobbly bug eyes. And....no wait...

[PoliticalAmazon]

25. You've GOT to be kidding....

Hillary Clinton has trashed her own legacy and her future in politics. Go tell the African-Americans in NY that she is a "good Democrat" and see what you get for your trouble.

A good Democrat is not someone who plays on bigotry for votes, emboldening bigots to be proud of their bigotry, and turning back the clock on race relations in our country.

And what the fuck has she done for us? She bent and spread 'em everytime Bush and the neocons in Congress snapped their fingers. She refused to stand up to Bush and his policies, even voting for the invasion and occupation of Iraq, at a time that the common citizen could find enough information to convince them that voting for the invasion was wrong. She has sense said it was because she was "fooled." Well, if she is that gullible, then she needs to be on the Meals-on-Wheels program, not in the Senate, because she is clearly unable to care for herself, let alone make decisions for the country.

Not to mention her eager collabortion with Bush and the neocons on Bush's totally inappropiate appointments.

She IS a neocon. She supports their agenda. I support the liberal agenda, therefore I am a liberal. That's how it works.

[KittyWampus]

26. She is Misguided to the extreme.

[madwivoter]

27. Nah, she's not a monster

She just gets really really bad advice and takes it .

I don't think there are many here that really think that she's a monster, I do think there are some people (myself included) that have been extremely disappointed in many of the things she has done throughout this campaign.

You and I differ in that she no longer has my respect. I'll cross the "she's a good Democrat" bridge when we see if she takes it to the convention...

I will give her this: she's an extraordinary politician.

[doyourealize1]

48. I agree with you n/t

[madwivoter]

68. If you are agreeing with the 'extraordinary politician' part...

...that's not necessarily a compliment to her. But again, that's just my opinion.

[David Zephyr]

28. Well, she's not a monster "as far as I know"

"As far as I know"

[my3boyz]

30. Mmmmm...yes she is! She is like one of those monsters in a horror movie that

simply won't go away! Once this process is over if I never see her face again that will be good for me. I feel sorry for New Yorkers.....

[PoliticalAmazon]

36. She's a monster like in "Fatal Attraction"--will do anything to get what she wants...

and just doesn't take "no I don't want you" for an answer.

Again, even though Bill Clinton is an asshole, I do have compassion for him now, considering what he must have had to deal with in his marriage to Hillary.

[LakeSamish706]

31. "Hillary Clinton is not a monster" If your convinced of it, then I wonder why...

you need to post this?

[polichick]

33. Depends on which definition of "monster" you're using...

imo she's a bully who will play any card in order to get her way, regardless of truth or decency ~ that's pretty montrous in my book.

[virgdem]

35. But she plays one on TV...

eom

[Spider Jerusalem]

37. No, she just plays one on the campaign trail.

[Name removed]

38. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

44. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[WeDidIt]

47. That graphic is inappropriate

I would ask you to remove it.

[nichomachus]

41. "My candidate is not a monster" is about as far as you can get from a "positive thread"

[doyourealize1]

46. too bad i'm in Obama supporter

:eyes:

[nichomachus]

51. All the worse

"Your candidate is not a monster" is what's called damning with faint praise.

[doyourealize1]

60. I'm not blinded

So what if I can find qualities that I like in another candidate?

Declaring one candidate as the moral antithesis of another is not something worth striving for.

[nichomachus]

63. Oh my gosh

The best quality you see in her is that "She is not a monster?" God, please don't write my biography, please.

[closeupready]

42. I agree. Though it's sad how she and Bill have been behaving.

They can recover, though probably not 100%. But they will need to make amends.

But yeah, I like her okay.

[dsomuah]

43. I agree but ...

Hillary certainly did a lot of great things before she came to this campaign, but she has certainly done a lot of things in this campaign that have damaged her standing. As polling shows, many voters now have an unfavourable opinion of her and particularly doubt her trustworthiness. Worse there is the growing sentiment among Obama supporters that she is staying in the race to weaken the Obama campaign as much as possible in the hope that an Obama loss in 2008 will set her up for a Hillary '12 campaign. This hasn't been helped by her supporters going around encouraging people to vote for McCain.

It would be a sad thing if Hillary's legacy and all the good things she has done are tarnished by her inability to gracefully bow out, and work very hard to reunify the party. Hillary still has the chance to repair her image. If she doesn't, all the good she has done will be forgotten.

[MadAndy]

45. Not a monster. Incompetent, unqualified, dishonest, ruthless, shrill, megalomaniacal...

[jzodda]

49. Monster? Thats reserved for Bush, Rove, Rumsfeld, Cheny, Libby

Is she overly ambitious, maybe a little too power hungry? Probably...but many politicians have that vice. Can she still do good work for the party? Sure! Ted Kennedy was blamed by many for Regan's 1980 victory but it didn't stop him from being the leader he has been in the US Senate. Nothing stopping her from doing the same.

[Sundoggy]

50. Neither is my ex wife a monster

but wow, did she show me what she was made of when the chips were down.

[Nia Zuri]

52. Card carrying member of the Illuminati?

[cbayer]

54. We need a whole lot more of this

and a whole lot less of what you got for posting it.

It takes a certain degree of maturity and class to post a positive tread like this in an environment full of hostility. It takes none of either to respond like most did.

[doyourealize1]

59. Thank you n/t

[Milo_Bloom]

55. She voted for the war.

[backscatter712]

56. She's Alex Forrest, bunny boiler!

"Bring the dog. I love animals. I'm a great cook!"
"I will not be ignored!"

Hide the bunny and lock up the cutlery!

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

57. Neither was LBJ. He did a lot of good things....then there was this war.

[Lucky 13]

62. I wholeheartedly disagree.

Oh she's a monster, alright. She disgusts me a little more each day. She's going to take this thing to the convention and do serious damage to the party because she is a self-centered sociopathic MONSTER.

[Beacool]

64. Of course she's not a monster!!

She only is to his supporters because she won't clear the way for their guy.

:shrug:

[ccharles000]

65. Hillary is wonderful.

[intaglio]

66. Hillary Clinton is not a monster

but neither was Swamp Thing, just misunderstood

[Straight Shooter]

67. When someone posts anything positive about Hillary, the usual entourage shows up ...

... to mock and disparage it.

Thank you for trying. :thumbsup:

[mod mom]

69. She's a neolib not neocon

The standard neoliberal policy package includes cutting back on taxes and government social spending; eliminating tariffs and other barriers to free trade; reducing regulations of labor markets, financial markets, and the environment; and focusing macroeconomic policies on controlling inflation rather than stimulating the growth of jobs," reports economist Robert Pollin (2003).<20> Arising out of a rejection of the class compromises embedded in previous liberal political-economic policies, including Keynesian and Active Labour Market Policies (ALMPs), neoliberal theory, institutions, policies, and practices are not regarded as politically neutral by their opponents. Their criticisms of neoliberalism are often historical materialist, bringing inequality into sharper focus.

-snip

According to Pollin (2003), neoliberalism under the U.S. Bill Clinton administration – steered by Alan Greenspan and Robert Rubin – was the temporary and unstable policy inducement of economic growth via government-supported financial and housing market speculation, featuring low unemployment, but also low inflation. This unusual coincidence was made possible by the disorganization and dispossession of the American working class.<34> Santa Cruz history of consciousness professor Angela Davis has argued and Princeton sociologist Bruce Western has shown that the astonishingly high rate of incarceration in the U.S. (1 out of every 37 American adults is in the prison system), heavily promoted by the Clinton administration, is the neoliberal U.S. policy tool for keeping unemployment statistics low, and stimulating economic growth through maintaining a contemporary slave population within the U.S. and promoting prison construction and militarized policing.<35> The Clinton Administration also embraced neoliberalism by pursuing international trade agreements that would benefit the corporate sector globally (normalization of trade with China for example). Domestically, Clinton fostered such neoliberal reforms as the corporate takeover of health care in the form of the HMO, the end of welfare protections, and the implementation ofWorkfare.<36>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoliberalism

[tbyg52]

70. No, she's not.

But that's about all that can be said on a positive note at this time. One has hopes for the future.

[ronnykmarshall]

71. Thank you for your courage.

Thank you for posting this.